Conversion therapy . The Hack

Discussion in 'Airheads' started by bpeckm, May 21, 2015.

  1. kwb210

    kwb210 Been here awhile

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    Oil filter access.
    What are your plans on accessing the oil filter considering the frame rail hides or prevents access to that top bolt?
    I just removed the 1970 R75/5 motor from my 1961 R50. Of the three bolts the bottom two were tight as you would expect, the top one was a shortened hex bolt and barely in the threads. There was also a gasket. My thinking is this...on /7 models the filter cover plays a role of sealing up and holding the filter tight in canister, hence the white rubber ring and metal shim, you need this snug fit in order to create the oil flow through the filter. In a /5 and /6 the filter cover is actually inside the engine case and held tight against the filter with a 17mm head on the bolt or is it a 14mm, either way, the outer cover on the engine case does not contact the filter. I am guessing the cover simply prevents oil from splashing out of the case and the pressure may be relatively low compared to the pressure inside the canister. So a simple gasket and maybe just the two lower bolts are enough to seal it up.
    If that is the case the frame does not need any attention. I have seen frames that had a "bend" or an indent on the outside of the tubing to accommodate the upper 3rd bolt on the oil filter cover. That would be my preference, but how would you go about putting that I sent in there? Maybe those frames were holding a /7 engine.

    I got my engine out and checking the serial number on realoem found the case to be a 1970 R50 bottom end and the guy installed the 750 jugs. I am trying to avoid mission creep...it's so hard! I decided to not break into the engine, not very much...I will pull clutch and flywheel to check conditions and any rear main leak, probably replace that oil seal, basically same process on front of engine, take a peak, check timing chain. My a bike has a complete/5 wiring harness into a /5 headlight shell.
    Thanks everyone here for the interesting comments, it has made this conversion resurrection so much fun. However, there sure is a bunch of mission creep going on!!! This is my first project to 'Just Say No', it's tough, I want the drugs...
    Thanks,
    Kurt
    Some of my biggest fears never happened!
  2. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    There's an old theory that says that we always worry, and it's usually about the wrong thing.....


    I haven't worried about the oil filter access yet (though I have thought about it.....) and am going under the presumption that this bike has been a sidecar bike (making access to the right side of the engine even MORE problematic!) and somehow the filter got changed. The actual filter in there was the two-piece "bendable" oil filter, which makes installing the filter itself much easier.

    This is the only pic of mine that might work... note that the engine-mount flat is just to the left of the pic:
    [​IMG]
    The top fastener is the original hex-head bolt, same length as the others. I had thought of going with an allen type, but realize that getting an allen wrench in there might be more of a problem than reaching in with a standard wrench (and now with these new-fnagled ratcheting-'renches, that's even easier!)

    Your description of the bolts makes me wonder if your bolt layout is different? Do you have any pics of your oil filter access while in the frame? I looked through my pics and don't have any (a zillion others, but not THAT one :()

    ....and yes, your /5 block and mine have essentially the same oil filter setup on the inside.

    I'll be checking all of this carefully once the block gets back into the frame! If necessary I could get out the torch and "dimple" the frame, I suppose.....:pep

    Ok, now you got me worried.....:dirtdog
  3. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    You got me thinking....( ! )....and I started by researching "conversion" in the titles of ADV threads, and I found this: A Conversion 33 years in the Making. Unfortunately most photo links don't work, but a cut-n-paste hunt of some of the promising url's led to this one:

    [​IMG]

    You can see the oil filter clearly on this one... It is a /7 R100 engine in a modified conversion/frame. Note that he had to cut off the rear "ears" of the earls fork in order to fit the engine front.


    :D
    OLD GREEN likes this.
  4. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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  5. Pokie

    Pokie Just plain Pokie.

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    When I made my first conversion back in 1972 or 1973 (I think), I retained the /5 engine spacers and engine mounts. The frame had to be spread about a half to three quarters of an inch. I never had any problem with the oil filter cover, yes it was tight but I never had to shorten any of the bolts. I have read that many of the later conversions, instead, would set thinner spacers. I would guess these thinner spacers would give a clearance problem. Does your conversion use the standard /5 engine spacers?
  6. danedg

    danedg Horizontally Opposed

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  7. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    Thanks, added to the list!

    :lol3
  8. OLD GREEN

    OLD GREEN Long timer Supporter

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    Now that's a unique conversion. I'm not used to seeing them with the slash five or six tanks, signals and tail lights. Or the Lesters and QSL seats for that matter. Very contrasting paint job too, the more I look at it the more I like it.
  9. Pokie

    Pokie Just plain Pokie.

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    That's quite a mixture of parts. Looks like someone wanted a /6 with Earls forks. They even went through the trouble of mating the rear section of the /6 swing arm to the front section of the /2 swing arm, but still had to relocate the shock mount.

    I have seen them with the later fuel tanks on, they have a much wider tunnel to hide electronic bits underneath.
  10. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    The bike was built specifically to be a sidecar tug. The final drive system that he used is unusual in the custom swingarm-tube, but many conversions have used the later rear end, which requires a shock-relocating thingamabob... that gives not only a more rugged final drive, but a wider selection of gear ratios as well.

    I cut-n-pasted a bunch of pics, just cuz his links were broken:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]






    :augie
  11. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    The yellow bike above has a later engine, so he modified the cover a wee bit... this shows the motor and frame, but the motor is dropped somewhat (not in its' mounted position)
    [​IMG]

    You can see that the upper right bolt is going to be very close, and that is where others have dimpled the frame. (Somewhere I have a pic of the dimpled frame....must find.....)

    :D

    edit: found it!
    [​IMG]
  12. fxray

    fxray Long timer

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    Good picture, bpeckm. That dimple maintains a "store-bought" appearance. If that has been done for quite a while now, and by more than one person, are there any reports of frame cracking or other failure?

    It sounds like your bike doesn't have the dimpled frame yet, but it does have the full length bolts. So how were they changing the oil filter?

    Good job bringing those links together -- made for some interesting reading. There is some real craftsmanship clumped in one spot there.

    Ray
  13. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    Wish I could remember whose bike it was, that's a recent picture... he had nice shots of shortening the tank-mounts and other /2 conversion particulars as well. Will have to search the RAM for whose it was?

    I never changed the filter in the short time before I pulled my bike apart, so cannot attest to any particular difficulties. I am close to getting the block back into the frame, so that will be one of the very first "things to check further".....

    :D
  14. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    It's been bugging me to find where I read about the dimple... finally found it on lucky6600's thread: BMW R??/2 Project Suggestion, page 3

    [​IMG]

    I am seriously thinking of doing it. The forces on the frame at that point are primarily downward, and the dimple would, if anything, reinforce rather than weaken the frame, methinks.....:hmmmmm
  15. Bill Harris

    Bill Harris Confirmed Curmudgeon

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    This is the time to do it. Gottacetylene ??

    --Bill
  16. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    So, it's reeeeeeealy quiet in the yacht sales world in December.... which means that I can play hookey now and again!

    So, it's been paint time. Well, stripping paint, that is! The front fender was the first of the metallic-blue that I tackled, and it was pretty much routine: strip the paint, get to the primer and then seal/paint with epoxy. It sits, "curing".

    But the rear fender has been a Project. Paint way too thick, and it's cracking.
    [​IMG]


    Far more complicated just cuz of the hinge, for one, but it also has that wire raceway, all of which makes the underside somewhat complicated. It was pretty straightforward to apply stripper, just tedious. There was something of an undercoat, but obviously needed help ... "it is time".....

    [​IMG]
    Lots of stripper and then scraping with a dull wood chisel, and it gets down to primer. Lots and lots of little corners blah blah blah
    [​IMG]

    Then I tackled the exterior. I thought I would strip down to the primer, but in working on it it became obvious that there is mucho paint, way too thick, with some problem cracking etc. So, more stripper....

    I counted seven (7!) separate layers of primer and paint.... turns out that the bike (or at least the rear fender!) has been re-painted once, and was NEVER BLACK! Interesting!

    [​IMG]

    I found these blue pinstripes over silver paint several layers under... the last paint job had some really high-build primers that seem quite soft, but aggressive scraping will get them down to bare metal or good original primer. Lots and lots of work with nothing but boring photos to show for it (and sanded fingertips and cracked hands...... :(: good winter day work, all in all. Almost sixty degrees and raining today.... three days before Christmas for pete's sake! We've had ONE night that made some ice on puddles, but other than that, damn, it's like we live in the Carolinas or sumpin'!

    :happay
  17. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    Hah! great timing... I was writing that ^ while you were posting, but funny thing is.... my B-tank just went dry on me the other day while I was building up the feet of the centerstand.... it's in my car, awaiting my next trip up to Fall River. Feeling lazy, I am!

    :pynd
  18. Big Bamboo

    Big Bamboo Aircooled & Sunbaked Supporter

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    Just a thought; get that hinge working good and smooth before the repaint, because...
  19. bpeckm

    bpeckm Grin! Supporter

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    Yah! It was a little stiff, but workable. In my brilliance, I thought I would punch the hinge-pin out and just do it all in two piece. Nope! I didn't want to eff things up, so I am dealing with the hinge in place. Overall, the rear fender is in really good condition, metal-wise, with no evidence of bodywork or any damage. There is some beginning very-superficial rust at the edges and, on the underside, at the edges of the built-up pieces/reinforcements. I'm thinking I will take some black epoxy paint and thin it down muchissimo and work it into the undersides of those doublers, prior to painting the whole thing.

    The front fender got two coats of VHT epoxy as "primer", and then the Rustoleum rubberized undercoating. I want massimo-proteccione...... The bike has endured since '64 (current registration) or '66 (Danedg's lookup of the VIN), but either way, she's a KEEPER!

    This is good Therapy for grey winter days, imho!


    :D
  20. CafeDude

    CafeDude Ride to eat.....

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    I've never needed to dimple the frame to get the oil cover bolt out. I just swap out the hex head bolts for allen headed bolts, and bob's my uncle.....but the dimple method is kinda cool.