D.I.Y. Cam Chain Replacement

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe' started by Dieselboy, Sep 22, 2011.

  1. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    Ah the pressure to perform.......thanks for the vote of confidence!
    :freaky

    Lost Rider, I read your saga and I hope to avoid those labor fees. I would hope that the tensioner replacement would preclude replacing the guides. You can do the tensioner while wearing your riding gloves. To do the guides you have to split the engine. So hopefully that won't be necessary if we take a little preventative action.

    ......So I'm printing the repair manual pages for dropping the engine.....over 100 and counting:norton. Granted things like taking the seat off or removing the rear wheel are not really tasking but I don't want to get knee deep in parts and wonder if I've missed something...


    For instance, I realize now that I need to order the bolts for the foot peg mounting bracket. So that goes on the list for ordering.


    Awaiting parts and printing pages. More to follow.....:deal
    #21
  2. itsatdm

    itsatdm Long timer

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    The manner BMW measures slack in the cam chain also include wear with the rails. If it was me, I would replace the rails and have the dealer test again. Then make a decision on replacing the chain.
    #22
  3. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    really? why drop the engine put it together and not replace the chain and run the risk of having to do it all again?


    EDIT: Unless you meant do the rails first, before the teardown. After reading through the manual, I see that that actually makes some sense if they can be changed without teardown. I need to study it some more. The left crank cover has to come off, but it doesn't say dismount the whole engine. My thought though is that the rails/guides are on the outside of the chain so is there wear without stretch? Stretch will damage the rails but does wear come before stretching? I'll have to discuss this with the service manager.
    #23
  4. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    okay, I may be wrong on this, but after running through the Maintenance DVD, I don't think you need to split the case for the guides BUT you still do to replace the cam chain. (Unless we can find one that has a master link....Buehler....Anyone, Anyone?)
    #24
  5. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    I've now printed the pertinent pages from the manual for this job.

    11 00 050 Removing and reinstalling the engine.
    11 31 551 Removing and installing or replacing the timing chain(engine removed)

    Drop engine. Replace cam chain. Simple, right? :hide





    I now have additional parts to order on top of the list above. As I read through the manual, I noted that these parts appear to be one-time use:

    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    01 CONSTANT PRESSURE VALVE 11417719354 $22.69

    Oil Pan
    6[​IMG]


    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    9 Oval head screw M6X20 35217685343 $2.00

    BRAKE PIPE REAR ABS

    7[​IMG]


    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    7 ISA screw M12X1,5X60 33537709575 $19.84

    Spring strut, rear

    8[​IMG]


    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    09 O-ring 12X2,5 11117694729 $1.10

    Heat exchanger/Leads
    9[​IMG]


    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    05 Oval head screw ISA M8X35 MK 34117672808 $1.80

    Brake pedal
    10[​IMG]


    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    10 Gasket ring A8X13 11112343010 $0.89

    Engine housing
    11[​IMG]



    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    15 SELF-LOCKING HEX NUT M14X1,5-8-ZNS3 07129906047 $2.48

    REAR WHEEL FORK
    12[​IMG]


    I can’t seem to find this one on the fiche:

    Shaft Sealing Ring (1)

    Gearbox Output Shaft
    13[​IMG]

    EDIT: I think I found it:

    Part Quantity Part Number Cost
    11 Shaft seal 12X28X7 1 * * 11142343038 $6.20 EDIT EDIT: THAT'S THE GEAR SHIFT SHAFT SEAL.

    Engine housing cover, left
    14[​IMG]
    #25
  6. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    As we all know, special tools are a plague to the home-wrencher. These are the tools that are listed that I do not have on hand and must resource. Some of the pics below do not show the actual tool, but the tool is used in this spot in the repair manual so I've dropped in the picture for reference.


    Sliding Sleeve 231561 (I'm not sure what this is.) [EDIT: a buddy says he's used a bit of garden hose- works for me.]

    Gearbox Output Shaft
    15[​IMG]


    Impact Weight 008582 and Rod 008581. EDIT: DID NOT NEED. THE PARTS SLID OUT BY HAND.

    Crank Case
    16[​IMG]



    Magnet (I don't think it's necessary, but I include it because it's in the manual).

    Valve Shims
    17[​IMG]


    Locking Screw 116570

    Crank Case
    18[​IMG]


    Angle of Rotation Guage 112501 (This actually appears in a couple of places.)

    Main Bearing Crank
    19[​IMG]


    Pliers 131512 (I'll try Harbor Frieght.) EDIT: USED LONG NEEDLE NOSE PLIERS WITH LIGHT BEND IN THEM.

    Throttle Valve
    20[​IMG]


    Pliers 175571 (same) EDIT: NEEDLE NOSED PLIERS AGAIN

    Radiator
    21[​IMG]



    Hose clamp

    Coolant Res
    22[​IMG]





    Also need to find a tool to check the pressurization of the cooling system. EDIT: DID NOT DO THIS.
    #26
  7. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    There are several instances of pastes, oils, and sealants. I did not do a diligent search to make sure I found all of these but these are the ones I’ve noted so far. Any suggestions for non-BMW substitutions (where applicable) are welcome.


    Acid free friction bearing grease 81229407174
    MP3 paste 07559062476
    Klueber Paste 11007660831
    Loctite 243
    Coolant
    Brake Cleaner
    Paint Markers
    #27
  8. Bayner

    Bayner Long timer

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    I think based on a career of mechanical repair:
    Sliding sleeve- covers the splines on the countershaft so you don't damage the seal when you install it.
    Impact weight- looks like a slide hammer with a threaded rod to screw into the 'wrist pin' so to speak of what I assume is the balancer. A bolt with the correct threads and a slide hammer attachment for your vise grips should work.
    You won't need a magnet for the valve shims, but it helped when I did mine. (I was nervous about dropping one into the abyss) They're labeled as to thickness so as long as you document their respective locations you shouldn't be able to get them mixed up or need a fancy organizer tray.
    You can make your own crank locking screw by tapering off the end of a matching bolt. The second time I checked my valves I got the proper tool, just to be sure.
    Angle of rotation gauge- sounds like a torque-angle gauge to me. There's the old-school kind that fit between the socket and ratchet and rest against a stationary object, or a lot of newer digital torque wrenches have them built in.
    You should be able to get by with any old pliers and a little ingenuity. (Although there are definitely specialty pliers for those hose clamps that make them easy to work with). Short sections of hose over needle nose vise grips works well for pinching off hoses.
    If some of the above doesn't make sense just shoot me a PM. I'm also looking forward to your progress and opinions on doing this job on your own. Good on you for trying to tackle it yourself!
    #28
  9. Indy Unlimited

    Indy Unlimited Long timer

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    We should be able to find a Master link for the timing chain and break the chain. I rivet the timing chains on my Husaberg and KTM with a timing chain tool. That may be a big time saver?
    #29
  10. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    Bayner, I see the spline cover now that I know what I'm looking at. Never heard of a slide hammer attachment for vice grips so that's really good data. The DIY tray and locking bolt I was tracking (saw someone here make both and plan to copy.) The ratchet attachment is obvious now for the angle gauge. Previously I'd only needed it for the head bearings but that angle was simple to calculate so didn't use it. I actually have a clamp from my 1150 days before I added quick disconnects.

    Thanks for the input. The Harbor Freight list is growing.
    #30
  11. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    It would be a massive time saver and infinitely safer for the shade-tree mechanic. I'm confident I can work through the whole process (with a little help and great deal of care) but you literally are pulling the guts out of this engine and exposing yourself to a long list of potentially catastrophic mistakes.

    ...and I don't know what "tricks" are not listed that the techs all understand as common knowledge.

    After a day of printing and reading, I might reconsidered becoming the crash test dummy for the master link.....:deal
    #31
  12. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    TIMING GEAR

    23[​IMG]

    Is the Husqvarna/KTM chain similar to our F800? This thing has three or four plates to every link and looks complicated. If it were like the drive chain, I would not even hesitate to link it, but the cam chain (#11 above) doesn't look like it lends itself to a master link.
    #32
  13. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    I'm looking for pictures of the cam chain to see the construction. Can't find any but I have found pics that inmates have posted of theirs on the bike and thought it would be good to collect into this thread:



    This is what it should look like:



    This is what it shouldn't look like:


    Nor like this (from the current king of F800GS destruction, let's give it up for Lost Rider :clap :lol3):


    #33
  14. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    Aha! Oso Blanco has a good pic from the top:

    24[​IMG]


    So you think we can master link this beast? :eek1





    Side note: Oso Blanco is also the source for the home made crank tool (M8 bolt tapered on a bench grinder):
    25[​IMG]
    #34
  15. zaner32

    zaner32 In over my head

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    I'm reading to this thread and still wondering why you'd have to split the cases to run the cam chain down from the top end and down, around the crank.

    Is it because there's no clearance inside to make it around? Any bike i've done before has always had some clearance where you could make it around the crank, and then carefully engage the cam sprockets into the chain and bolt them in the end of the camshafts. Taking the sidecover off should be able to reveal all the necessary details.
    #35
  16. Indy Unlimited

    Indy Unlimited Long timer

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    I would be glad to research the master link and aftermarket timing chain. Can anyone get me the chain pitch on the timing chain, pin diameter and chain width?
    #36
  17. Bayner

    Bayner Long timer

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    I had asked about that in another thread I think, but never got any info. We'd probably have to order an OE or find someone who's had theirs done and kept the chain.
    (I've also swapped out chains in a Berg and KTM so we're on the same page). It sure would be a lot easier, especially if the guides could be swapped with some fiddling through the side cover.
    #37
  18. Y E T I

    Y E T I Unpossible

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    I'm really digging how everyone is coming together in this thread to try to figure out the best way to do this ourselves.
    #38
  19. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    Near as I can tell, no there is not clearance around the crank. So you have to get at the crank through the bottom of the engine which requires it to be turned upside down.
    #39
  20. Dieselboy

    Dieselboy Journey not Destination

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    If no one gets it before next week, I'll have one in hand then. :evil
    #40