Darkside

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by Concho, Feb 6, 2008.

  1. Concho

    Concho Adventurer

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    Since needing a new rear tire, I made the jump to a Car Tire
    aka The Darkside. I replaced a 170/80-15 motorcycle tire with
    a 165/80R15 "T" rated car tire. So far I have not noticed any
    difference in ride or handling. Of course your mileage may vary.


    [​IMG]
    #1
  2. tripodtiger

    tripodtiger Off riding around on bitumen circles.

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    What rim?

    There is a difference in the rim profile between motorcycle tubed, motrcycle tubeless and car tubeless that may effect the seat of the bead on the rim.
    I hope you are aware of this already.
    #2
  3. claude

    claude Sidecar Jockey

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    Mounting car tires onto 15" motorcycle rims has been done but it is not recomended by many who have been in the sidecar sport for a while. The 15" motorcycle rim is actually larger in diameter at that bead area than a 15" auto rim. This means the 15" auto tire will be stressed more than it should be when it is installed. There have bene tire failures due to this with some injuries during mounting. I think the injusries were related to using excessive air pressure to force the tire onto the rim. Not sure if any failures were ever documented after the tires that did make it onto the 15" rims were put into use but one can only wonder if any damage was done during the mounting process.

    Note that other motorcycle vs car rim sizes are not as far off in diameter and car tires have been mounted on them on a regular basis with no problems.

    Rim design in the bead area is also a subject worth considering such as Ray mentioned.

    Also it was not uncommon years back to actually have a 15" motorcycle rim turned down to better accept the car tire. This has fell from populaity probably due to liability concerns. If one attempts this they are on their own.

    I only bring all of this up as a warning..results may vary of course.

    As far as the tire size chosen goes it is a popular size for the conversion. We do a lot of car tire conversions using the 165 tire on an automotive wheel. Milage has been excellent with 20,000 and up being common. Not bad at all on a sidecar rig for a tire that typically retails for under $75.
    #3
  4. gregbenner

    gregbenner Long timer

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    Not sure what bike you have, the "darkside" is a subforum on the GL1800 riders. On the GL1800 (GoldWing) the Mini Cooper tire fits on easily. The issue on that forum is there are a few hundred guys who use them on solo bike (i.e. no sidecar or trike). I rode my Wing several thousand mikes in route to Hannigan's, including 3 days in Deal's Gap area, and it handled great. Even better with the sidecar since mileage is better, cost is lower, and braking is greatly improved as the tread on the road is significantly greater.
    #4
  5. LadyDraco

    LadyDraco KillerSmileIHazIt !!

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    Location:
    Some of the best roads in the east..
    My mate rode on the darkside for 3 years on his Valkyrie ...( 16" rim )
    He said it did take some getting use to...
    Rode all kinds of twisty mountain roads with it...
    It was great for trailer pulling ....
    The worse thing he said was slow speed handling..
    It had a mind of it's own at times....

    But he's back to a moto tire... He said WOW it's amazing what you'll get use to...
    #5
  6. claude

    claude Sidecar Jockey

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    I put quite a few miles on a R100GS that we had converted to a car tire (165R15) with no real problems. Not really recomending it but it did fair.
    TIP:
    If anyone enters slow races at rallies etc the car tire deal on a solo bike woudl work great.
    #6
  7. Concho

    Concho Adventurer

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    It is a spoked and chromed steel rim with a tube installed. It was
    Professionally mounted by the "Wheelworks" in Garden Grove, CA. who, as
    the name indicates, is in the motorcycle wheel business for many years.

    For what it's worth, I don't notice any difference in handling or ride.

    [​IMG]
    #7
  8. auwg

    auwg AUWG

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    Congrats on the conversion, Concho.
    My bike came stock with a 170/70R16 and I learned it would take up to a 180. I measured (a few times, just to be sure) and decided to try to fit a Bridgestone Turanza EL400-2 195/60HR16 on it. It's tight, but the sides don't rub.
    Rides fine, no real differences.
    See five pix here:
    http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Darkside_Riders/

    Ed Howdershelt - Abintra Press
    Science Fiction & Semi-Fiction
    http://www.AbintraPress.com
    My Fictionwise Ratings: http://tinyurl.com/26v45
    #8
  9. yellow

    yellow Been here awhile

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    So how does one go about getting on the darkside for a R1100GS?

    Called up liberty motors in Seattle to see what their conversion runs and was told they only sell the WHOLE KIT....i.e. subframe, leading link, sidecar, rear wheel conversion.....so starting over with fresh ideas....
    #9
  10. Concho

    Concho Adventurer

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    You can start by comparing your stock tire size to the size of a comparable
    car tire. See: http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html

    You may be able to increase the width if the frame will allow for it. Do some
    Google searches on "Darkside tires" and see what comes up. Maybe someone
    has already done the homework on your bike/tire and you can benefit from
    their experience.

    You might also post to: United Sidecar Association board at:
    http://www.sidecar.com and ask questions there.

    Good luck and keep us posted as to your results.
    #10
  11. Jonny Joha

    Jonny Joha n00b

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    I just got my tire on my bike and I just wanted to see what someone who might know more than I thinks about what I did.

    I have a shadow 600 vlx with a 165/80/15 ct on the back. here is one of the issuse, tubeless tire on spoked rim w/ a tube. is it ok heard it wasn't but then I heard a ct is not for a bike.

    How it was mounted. corn oil on rim and tire and 100 psi and it wouldn't seat. It kept getting stuck in one spot but not always the same spot finally after many atempts one side set no pop. after another deflation and forcing the stuck spot to a different spot it finally did go on...SCARY!!!!!. Thought it was coming off the rim still no pop. tire looks even all around. If you are going to the darkside beprepaired to do some daring things to do it. personaly I mounted it myself only because if somone is going to get insured or worse because I want a ct on my bike it's gonna be me.

    I have not riden much yet just a few miles. at 35psi the bike wanted to woble if you let go of the handle bars. brought it down to 32 and it handles great. does feel a little different at very low speed in hard turn mostly when it comes out of a turn. I will be commuting 90 miles a day so I should be back with more about handleing soon.

    me dad has a valkyrie w/ a ct. and his only concern was how light my bike is. anycoments on that?

    one other thing when under power the bike has a vibration but as soon as i hit the clutch it goes away. any idea what that is.

    seeya on the road. hope I can help somone and hope somone helps me thanks
    #11
  12. oldmce

    oldmce Old Motybike Rider

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    I was experiencing the wobbel you spoke of on my vt750 shadow areo with stock tires. The honda vt's have a tendency to do this. I ride this little honda as my commuter (150 miles/week) year round and in very nasty weather. Even got caught in the snow a couple times. My commute is mountainous rural with lots of curvy roads. I found that the tire selection for this bike is very limited and I believe meant for mostly fair weather riding on nice smooth pavement. My bike and daily route eats up these street cruiser tires real fast. It is time to once again replace the rear tire on this little machine and the plan is to go with the 165/80r15. Honda specs a 160/80-15 for this bike. I am currently running a 170/80-15 on it. The size calculator at http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/infoTireMath.dos indicates the size of the 165/80-15 actually will fit better than the 170.

    To the nay sayers... I have been running a CT on the rear of my Harley for 20 years without issue.
    #12
  13. FR700

    FR700 Heckler ™©®℗

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    Your imagination.

    Care to share what brand and size please ?


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    #13
  14. DRONE

    DRONE Dog Chauffeur

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    But wait. You want to put a 15" car tire on a Honda VT750 Aero? You can't do that. You can put car tires on all sorts of bikes all day long (including your old Harley) as long as it's NOT a 15-incher. That's the only size rim (that I know of) where the car tire bead just won't work on a motorcycle rim. 16's, 17's 18's are all fine, but not 15's. There are experts here who I'm sure will back me up on this. I'd suggest you go to the Darkside forum and do some research.

    What kind of sidecar do you have attached to the VT750?
    #14
  15. oldmce

    oldmce Old Motybike Rider

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    The old harley has an M+S 165R15 86S telstar on it.

    See above in the post "New to the darkside" shadow 600 with a 165/80 15 ct. Pretty sure its the same rim. I will measure bead sizes to see how and if it will be a problem. I am pretty sure it will work. Harley is a 60's chopper. So nope, no side car on either bike.

    I will do more research though. Thanks.
    #15
  16. DRONE

    DRONE Dog Chauffeur

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    OK, so now I'm confused. You joined Advrider last week in order to resurrect a 4-year old sidecar thread and post up about your Honda cruiser which isn't an adventure bike and isn't a sidecar rig? I don't get it.

    Nevertheless, it's interesting to hear that your Harley chopper from the 1960's has a 15" car tire on it. And it's definitely a Harley wheel too? Because of course if the chopper was modified to accept a narrow car wheel like what DMC uses for their GS pusher (like mine and many others) well then that's a different story.
    #16
  17. FR700

    FR700 Heckler ™©®℗

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    Your imagination.

    Thank you.

    Mine runs 16's so that kinda rules that out and a 145ish is about the biggest that will squeeze in.


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    #17