Dear Motoport:

Discussion in 'Vendors' started by motorradfahrer, Jul 26, 2006.

  1. motorradfahrer

    motorradfahrer leichtmetallpferdereiter

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    [whiny message deleted by OP]

    Wayne, thanks for all your info on this thread. I was just venting as I tried to stumble through the site. It's good to see that you really know what you're talking about, and I hope you find a way to expand your business while maintaining the quality you insist on and still staying sane.

    P.s., the website is still a pain, but I'll live. :D
    #1
  2. jhank

    jhank not too gnarly adventurer

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    I just returned home from a trip to Motoport H.Q. today (I live about two cage hours away). After lots of research, looking at and trying on a lot of different brands, Motoport was my last try at finding some gear that worked.

    Because the stuff is at the expensive end of the scale and I was relatively close-by, I figured, why not just let them do the fitting since I have some free time. I called and made an appointment. I didn't request an audience with him but Wayne himself said he'd take some time to show me what they had.

    I have read the reports of his personal service. A friend placed an order and confirmed that Wayne spent a good chunk of time on the phone with him to get his order correct.

    So there I was today, standing in the small office space watching a handful of women and a lone guy sewing away. As I waited for Wayne I took a look through a rack of about fifteen jackets and a few pairs of pants. When he showed up he immediately offered to show me around. As we checked out the very specialized sewing machines they use he talked about stitch patterns, cloth strength, the reasons why only they could repair one of their pieces properly, etc., etc. Then he showed me the warehouse in back where they stored materials and did some repairs.

    Wayne grabbed a piece of the stretch kevlar out of the trash and sliced a two-inch cut in it with a powered rotary knife. Handing it to me he threw down a challenge to finish tearing through this small piece of cloth with my bare hands. Now, I'm not the strongest guy around but I think a little piece of cloth, which is already torn, is gonna be two pieces in less than a second. There was absoulutely no way I could have torn that sucker WITH the help of five other people and some hand tools.

    Suitably impressed, I followed Wayne as he showed off some more of the shop and talked at great length about all manner of issues dealing with his choices of materials, independent lab test results, and what turned out to be an hour-and-a-half of worth of graduate-level information related to riding jackets and pants. Then, just to get an idea of how stuff fit he had me try on a few jackets he thought might work. Lo and behold we found one which fit perfectly. I bought it and ordered pants on the spot without hesitation.

    In my work I depend on a number of small, one-man band operations (and a few bigger band shops) to supply very specialized parts and pieces.
    Sometimes I need the stuff yesterday. Sometimes I can't get what I need for quite awhile. Sometimes their websites suck and I pick up the phone for clarification. In any case, I stick with these small shops because I can talk directly to the craftsman who make the stuff. They hear the urgency in my voice when I need a part NOW, or they listen to my ideas for modifications and then discuss how they will deal with an order.

    If you've ever dealt with a true craftsman who markets his own product you'll know what I'm talking about. They're busy making the thing you want which only they can make. That's why you want their product. They usually don't have the time to produce a slick mass-market appeal for customers. In my opinion, if it's a genuine best-of-it's-kind product, like a Motoport piece of gear, word-of-mouth is the advertising which makes the business viable.

    Motorad, I believe you missed the point of the Motoport website claims. Again, it's just my opinion (I did just pay full price for a suit so you can rest assured that I'm not a salesman for them) but I think what they mean when they make the claim that they are "the best site on the internet" they mean they make the best motorcycle gear and this is where you can get it[/LIST]. Wayne told me today that he knows they need to do better with their website. From what I saw and heard from the man himself today was that they have all the business they can handle, and have been doing it for many more years before there ever was a commercial Internet.

    Everybody who's seen it knows the website is weak. So what. Pick up your phone and give Wayne a call. Tell him you think his website sucks. Maybe you could offer to do better. He's such a nice dude I'd imagine he'll listen to you.

    He makes good stuff and backs it up. Lots of people buy the stuff.
    #2
  3. ZOL

    ZOL Retired !!!

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    I totally agree with Jhank !

    My wife and I have 10 year old Ultra Cordura suits and I have a 4 year old Kevlar Ultra suit and the sport Kevlar Jacket. I also have a Thurlow Deerskin suit - that only gets wore about once a year since I bought the Motoport suits.

    I have been totally satisfied with their apparel, and had a great experience dealing with Wayne when I did my purchases (only live a short distance away and used to visit their retail shop before they went to 100% on-line retailing.

    I'm not sure what the complaint is with their website. I look at it from time to time (been considering their Kevlar Airmesh suit- but don't have the funds right now) and it seems as good as any of the sites for this type of small business. And if you call them their customer service is always great !

    :clap
    #3
  4. namtinker

    namtinker Been here awhile

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    Another satisfied customer here. Cordura ultra pants & jacket with liners. Good quality - made to my measurements - fits great.
    I have managed to lose two of my jacket press studs and Wayne mailed me some replacements yesterday - free of charge. A small thing, but much appreciated. The website might not be state of the art, but I can not really fault the customer service and product. So what if it takes a few more clicks of the mouse to find the info!
    #4
  5. BikePilot

    BikePilot Long timer

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    I have a cordura ultra jacket from them as well as a full streach kevlar GPII suit. I really like the material, but the armor is by far the worst I've seen in motorcycle gear. My first $90 JR jacket has thicker, more form fitting armor. It just seems so wrong to have such a nice, expensive suite then to slap cheep, flat armor in it. And no, its not breaking in as I was told. I have over 20k miles in the GPII and the armor still doesn't bend well. I think I'm going to break down and buy a set of vanson CE armor to replace it with. My only other issue with them is the lack of attention to making it fit while I'm in a riding posisiton. The suite is great when I'm standing up straight, but bunches behind my knees and elbows when tucked in on my sport bike.

    If I were designing the suite I'd make the following changes.

    1. Quality form-fitting armor
    2. Cut the suit so its pre-curved.
    3. Vary the material thickness/layers. For example, I don't need the same amount of material on the back of my knee or inside of my elbow as on the front of my knee. Extra bulk in places it is of no use only increases material cost and decreases comfort.

    Overall, I find it the best material available, but close to the worst implementation (in terms of cut, armor etc). I like my suit enough I'll continue to wear it, but I'm not sure I'd buy another if this one died. Hopefully by the time I need another one they will have majorly improved the suits or a big company will start using this material.

    cheers,

    Josh
    #5
  6. motorradfahrer

    motorradfahrer leichtmetallpferdereiter

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    Like I said, I was just whining about it. I will probably end up ordering their stuff anyway. I just hate going to their site and trying to get info on their products because it's so convoluted and confusing, and their pictures are terrible. Luckily for them people are willing to post good reviews of their stuff on sites like this.

    It was just a reaction to their "we like to think we are the best site on the net..."

    Then again, if they improved the site I'd probably have to wait more than 13 weeks for my gear, so I guess I should shut up... :lol3

    I'm interested to hear about the armor, though. Most people seem to be very happy with it. I don't think I've read complaints such as yours (BikePilot) at all. Hmm...
    #6
  7. The Dude Himself

    The Dude Himself Hooked on Dirt!!

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    Rapid growth is the worst thing that can happen to a small company like this. The ppor website is probably not updated due to the expansion it'll promote.
    #7
  8. GB

    GB . Administrator Super Moderator Super Supporter

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    I gave up on Motoport when I couldn't navigate their website, or see any decent pics of their products. They need to get the Aerostich webmaster to give theirs a face lift.
    #8
  9. novasquid

    novasquid will ride for food

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    the first time i came across motoport's website was about 4 years ago and was interested in buying their gear but was totally turned off by their website and lack of concise information. fast forward 4 years and having read gringo's excellent write-up i decided to purchase their ultra 2 stretch kevlar jacket and pants. i wish i made this purchase 4 years ago.

    but i agree with the armor, it's pretty lacking in my opinion. many people have written that overall the gear feels like wearing a tank, but i think the armor is just too thin to make any difference in a crash involving moderate to high impacts, especially around the knees and hips. but i'm happy overall with the purchase and would do it again in a heartbeat.

    i think the gear is more suited for touring, and it will always be uncomfortable while on a sportbike because it's just not cut for that riding position.

    bikepilot, you live in nothern VA? we should go for a ride sometime, and make sure you wear your gp-2 suit, i wanna check it out! :)
    #9
  10. GB

    GB . Administrator Super Moderator Super Supporter

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    I had a close look at the ultimate riding jacket.. Rukka's SRO. I guess you get what you pay for... and Rukka makes some fine jackets and pants, but cheap, they ain't.. :cry

    Water proof zippers have been available for years.. why can't US riding suit makers use them?
    #10
  11. Wayne at Motoport

    Wayne at Motoport Been here awhile

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    This is my first reply on advrider. Concerning our web site:
    Our site was put together 10 years ago. We are aware that it sucks. Our web site is of course, an advertising tool. We stopped advertising 4 years ago. (Not enough product to handle the demand.) At this time improving the web site or advertising would get us in more trouble, supplying gear. As mentioned on our web site, we can email hi rez photos of products.

    I've also seen comments on this thread concerning our Tri-armor. It is difficult to be breif on this subject. Here are some main points:
    1. We tested both initial and resulting impact on armor made all over the world. The best we found is called T-Pro made in England. Our Tri-Armor absorbs both initial and resulting impact 13% better than T-Pro.
    2. The Tri-Armor in our jacket/pant covers 64% of the body, this is far more coverage than any other apparel.
    3. Our Tri-Armor is light weight, large sections perforated and takes only 30 to 40 minutes to mold to the riders individuals shape. (Will not move in a tumble.)
    4. Tri-Armor is comfortable to wear.
    4. Our company conducted the most expensive in depth study of motorcycle accidents/fatalities. Over 4 million $ has been invested in the studies/development of our apparel concerning the safety aspect only. There is no other motorcycle apparel made today, other than Cycleport/Motorport USA, that provides proper: Impact/Tear/Abrasion Strength. Most racing grade leather provides proper tear/abrasion for road racing, but improper seam strength for street riding. (I can go into detail on this subject if more riders are interested.)

    One rider on this thread commented that we have bad armor. We had a run of armor that was not correct. This bad Tri-Armor was made in a 3/8 inch thickness. This improper thickness was not seen until some suits were sent out. We didn't know which suits were sent that had the improper armor. If you have Tri-Armor that is 3/8 inch thick, send it back and we will replace with the proper armor.

    If you have any other questions concerning our gear, I'm here to help.

    A Big Thank You to all the riders giving the positive comments on our gear, located all over this web site.

    Best regards,
    Wayne Boyer
    President Cycleport/Motoport USA
    #11
  12. LarryGS

    LarryGS Been here awhile Supporter

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    I've found the Motorport gear to be fantastic, for my applications - commuting and 2-3 hundred mile days. I felt that the website's deficits are made up for by the customer service I received on the telephone by both Wayne and his asst. Time frames for orders to be processed are long, but mine was dead-on at 14 weeks. I'll check the armor when I get home tonight -thanks for the heads-up, Wayne.
    #12
  13. Tankboy

    Tankboy Now older and fatter!

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    Now that made me grin for some reason.

    Had I not just tossed down 700 bucks for "Caribou" luggage I'd be buying some Motoport gear. Funny how it doesn't take long to spend more money on gear than you have invested in the bike.
    #13
  14. ldbandit76

    ldbandit76 Life is good.

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    I'm interested. I'm especially interested in how you think your product compares to something like the Halvarssons Safety Suit, one of very few pieces of apparel to be fully CE certified for abrasion, cut, tear and burst strength (to say nothing of carrying CE approved impact pads).

    I note especially that your own testing and documentation, here:

    http://www.motoport.com/saveyourhide.pdf

    indicates that the Air Mesh Kevlar offers roughly half the abrasion resistance of 1000 denier Cordura, while the Stretch Kevlar is roughly equivalent. But 1000 denier Cordura itself does not come close to passing CE abrasion requirements.

    Can you detail your testing methods, and perhaps compare and contrast them to the CE standards (the only tests performed across a wide variety of materials and brands), such that we may compare apples and apples?

    I know you're a busy guy, but this would be really interesting information.

    Thanks,

    Dave
    #14
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  15. Happycamper

    Happycamper Have bikes, will travel

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    ldbandit76

    Respectfully, I don't get your point. Who cares about CE standards developed in the lab if 99% of the gear out there doesn't meet them anyway? Given that, I want the best, most protective, most functional, readily available gear. I have yet to see one person state that their Motoport 1000 or Strech Kevlar ever abraded through to the point they suffered significant road rash.

    Their gear is easily the most protective readily available gear out there. Motoport's top-line gear is built like a tank. I had to take advantage of that fact twice. While I don't always wear my Motoport gear, but :ddog :ddog I know I am taking a calculated risk when I don't.
    #15
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  16. ldbandit76

    ldbandit76 Life is good.

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    I care, if only because making any claim of performance (safety or otherwise) is rather meaningless unless you can back it up with standardized comparisons between different items. There's a long continuum from "better than nothing" to "good enough" to "world-beating performance." How else can you know where something lands?

    I'm sure Motoport's stuff is excellent, well-made and durable. But Wayne claims it's the absolute most protective in the world. I want to know how he reached that conclusion. Even if that was a touch of exaggeration, I'd like to know how it compares to other items. And as of right now, the only way to compare to other items is against the CE standards.

    By the way, "readily available" is a bit of a cop-out. One can order a Halvarssons suit here:

    http://www.speedycom.co.uk/shop/home.php?cat=421&sort=orderby&sort_direction=0&page=2

    And a fully CE-approved leather suit here:

    http://www.bksleather.co.uk/contact.htm

    Ordering something from England is no harder than ordering from California.

    Wayne offered more info for those who were interested. I am. You don't need to read it if you don't want to.

    Respectfully,

    Dave
    #16
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  17. matey peeps

    matey peeps Bead Buddy

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    I can make a suit out of cardboard and duct tape and spray paint it green and feel like I'm riding in a tank. Doesn't mean it's safe tho. I too would like to see some performance comparisons.
    #17
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  18. grace

    grace Been here awhile

    Joined:
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    Prior to my accident, which I recount below in an email message to Wayne at Cycleport, like you, I held some reservations about tri-armor. The armor in my jacket was CE approved armor and my Motoport Ultra II Kevlar pants contained tri-armor. Unquestionably -and to my surprise, tri-armor outperformed the CE approved. I don't understand why, but I know that my knee slammed into the asphalt with extreme force and to my amazement, I didn't even suffer a bruise. I don't recall feeling any soreness. The CE approved armor did perform well, but I felt quite sore for several days. Though I wear a CE-armored leather jacket -umm I look good in it :evil, I wear my GP2 jacket most of the summer -incomparable ventilation. A perforated leather jacket doesn't even come close! Since my tailored GP2 jacket does fit me like a glove, I do look pretty dang good in it too! Yes, since my accident, I am a huge, unabashed Motoport/Cycleport fan. BTW, if anyone knows the force required to tear the Kevlar material from which Motoport manufactures its gear, then from the damage in the pictures, you will likely realize the severity of my accident.

    I feel safest when wearing both my Motoport jacket and pants. Uummmm, but I think the chicks like my leather jacket better though. :killen

    Bottom line: I don't care what kind of gear anyone buys, however I strongly encourage everyone to buy great gear. From my experience, Motoport constructs awesome gear!

    Use this hyperlink to view my web album with pictures of my gear after the accident:
    http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/woshod..._0DPEBwQWVlmJa

    Hopefully, Yahoo will not require you to register. If it does please tell me, and I may upload some of the pictures.


    ----- Original Message -----
    From:
    To: support@motoport.com
    Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2006 9:15 PM
    Subject: Ultra II Kevlar Pants Saves the Day!!


    Hello Wayne:

    Ever since my motorcycle accident earlier this year -January 2006, I intended to write you and tell you about my experience and convey my gratitude for the gear that you encouraged to purchase. Three years ago when I began looking for motorcycle protective gear, my research led me to contact Cycleport. Like many riders, I planned to probably buy "Joe's" mass market gear. Thankfully, after the education that you provided, I purchased an Ultra II Kevlar pant, GP-2 pant and GP-2 jacket. I also purchased a leather jacket too -not from your guys. My friends thought I was a little nuts to spend so much money on protective gear. After my accident, everyone said you're so lucky that you bought that gear. The cops, firemen and paramedics at the accident scene all wanted to inspect my gear. They believed that I should have died.

    The Accident: Around
    <st1:time hour="11" minute="0">11 AM</st1:time> on a beautiful January afternoon in Colorado, on way to lunch with some friends, I turned my bike to enter the interstate. As I accelerated up the on-ramp to the highway, I felt the urge to "open it up" a bit. Well, once I merged onto the highway, I accelerated to the left lane where to my surprise -save a semi in the center lane, I saw no vehicles until past my intended highway exit -two exits from where I entered the highway. No vehicles for the next mile and a half!! Well, still feeling spirited, I lay my chest on my bikes gas tank, wound the throttle as far as it would go, shifted to fifth and glided.

    As I approached the semi in the center lane, I glanced at the speedometer. It read just over 130 mph. Passing the semi, I noticed another vehicle in the right lane traveling the same speed as the semi. A police car!! Knowing that I would never slow in time before passing the police car, I intended to break enough to perhaps pass it at 90-100 mph and perhaps when he recognized the situation, I may have slowed to 65 mph.

    Well, I don't remember touching the brake lever -just the intention to brake. My thought finds me tumbling down the highway. A very surreal experience. Everything slowed down. I clearly remember my thoughts. First thought: Oh crap! I may die. As roll, I see the sky. Next thought: What a beautiful day! -Yes, really that's what I thought! Roll again and see the sky. Next thought: It is a beautiful day! Roll again. Next thought: No, I will not die. I'll be okay. So, I relax and just go along for the ride. Once I stop tumbling, wary about the semi in the center lane, I stand and immediately run to the median. I reach into the side pocket of Ultra II Kevlar pant and takeout my cell phone. Miraculously, only the antenna suffered any damage. BTW, my wallet -in the other side suffered minor damage as well. I still use both today.

    Next, I look for my bike and "holy smokes!!!” I see my bike a very long ways down the highway. The police investigator who arrived later estimated that my bike slid over 1100 feet - miraculously on one side without tumbling. All the witnesses of the accident approach me in stupefied disbelief that (1) I'm up and walking, (2) I'm calm and coherent and (3) that I'm not dead! BTW, the police investigator accurately calculated my speed at a "conservative" 130 mph. They ticketed me with enough points to lose my license, but fortunately, the district attorney reduced the points enough to keep my license. I do not feel proud about this accident. No bravado here. Pretty dumb and very lucky.

    The cop who I tried to avoid never saw the accident and just continued down the highway. Within a few minutes, six police cars, two fire trucks, and two ambulances and of course two tow trucks arrive. I called a friend to collect me. The cops ask me to sit on the highway until the ambulances arrive. I did briefly, but I insisted that I felt fine. The ambulance arrived removed all my gear and found only quarter size road rash on my wrist. They attempt to take me to the hospital. I refused. I insisted that I felt fine. One of the paramedic called a doctor to try to force the issue. The doctor instructed them them to test my mental condition. I passed with flying colors. They even asked me what international leader recently suffered a stroke - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon. Afterwards, the other paramedic admitted that he did not know the answer to half the questions.

    Everyone at the scene believed that my gear saved my life. My helmet, gloves, jacket, pants and boots. Here's link to an online photo album that I created from pictures of my accident.

    <http: //pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/woshodin/album?.dir="/633a&.src=ph&.tok=ph_0DPEBwQWVlmJa"></http:>

    If you want any full-size images, please inform me.
    My pants:
    Prior to my accident, I held some skepticism about the effectiveness of the seemingly thin tri-armor and fabric. Well, I am a huge fan. I know that my knee slammed on the asphalt with tremendous force. In the pictures, you can see this. Yet, I suffered little to know bruising. In fact, the next day, I awoke and went to the gym and exercised. My shoulder did feel sore for several days. The fact that I unhesitatingly replaced my Ultra II Kevlar pant with another one and added the Kevlar Jeans proves my commitment to your gear. Though I did not wear my GP-2 jacket on the day of my accident, now I feel extremely confident whenever I wear it. BTW, I love my Kevlar Jeans. Great recommendation. I wear it much more than my Ultra II pant.

    I cannot imagine how much in hospital bills that my gear saved me. To anyone considering buying some “ballistic” material that's covered with polyurethane: My advice: Don't do it!! Spend the money!! Buy good gear!! Though I believe in Cycleport's gear and will likely not stray, you don't have to buy Cycleport, just by good gear. Good gear costs more, but it's worth it. How much did avoiding the ambulance ride to the ER save me?

    BTW, I still arrived timely for lunch with my friends.

    <st1:city><st1:place>Wayne</st1:place></st1:city>: Thanks for all your recommendations. I feel very fortunate that I listened. In many ways, I did die that day. Ever since my accident, I value each moment more than ever. I live life with uncompromising joy! On that day, I thanked God/Universe for granting me my life and promised her that I would not waste it. In the seven months since my accident, my life has been and is absolutely perfect! I pursue my dreams with abandon and I succeed!!! I treasure riding more than ever.<o:p></o:p>
    Life’s short. Live it!!!<o:p></o:p>
    “The function of man is to live, not to exist.” -- Jack London<o:p></o:p>
    --
    Will
    #18
  19. Redne Dab

    Redne Dab Poseur Extraordinaire

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    Got a link for this website?

    Too lazy to goggle,
    #19
  20. grace

    grace Been here awhile

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    I assume you that you mean a link to Motoport's website. It's not the best website in the world. Wayne believes that if they spiff it up he couldn't acquire enough material to meet demand. If you really want to learn about their gear, call them and talk to Wayne.

    Here's the URL for their site:
    http://motoport.com/
    #20