Favorite Premix Oil and Ratio

Discussion in '2 smokers' started by craydds, Mar 26, 2013.

  1. Valleyrider

    Valleyrider I Survived The '60s

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    Hell of a Racer back in the day!! The only time I rode the 350 class was a 6 hour production race at Ontario. Scott was teamed up with Bob Tigert and I was teamed with Dale McCreay. We beat them!!
  2. stainlesscycle

    stainlesscycle Long timer

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    hah, yeah, there's only about 5 or 6 guys still doing vintage work - i'm sure there's gobs that'll do a blaster/banshee/etc - finding quality old school porting that works is a whole 'nother thing..
  3. Londoncalling

    Londoncalling n00b

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    Been following this thread with a lot of interest, and have been thinking for a while that my RD400 may well run stronger if I used 20:1 mix rather than the 30:1 I am using at the moment?

    Not heard of Mr Jennings, but that article seems to support the idea that using more oil is a good thing? Still cant figure out the main differences between pre-mix and autolube oils though, and wonder which one is better to use?
  4. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    I think testing carried out in 1978 is pretty much irrelevant today, other than as a matter of historic interest possibly?

    In terms of the Jennings testing, the regime employed by JASO to test 2T oils in the present day is far more exacting, and I would guess would result in almost immediate engine damage, if 1978 lubricants were being used!

    That the trolls posting on this thread seem to be relying on data from the 70s seems to very ably qualify their troll status, as does the fact that not one of them has been able to clarify why an autolube oil with 30% solvent content, will work better than a pre-mix oil with little or no solvent?

    I have explained numerous times already that autolube oils mixed using twice the amount of oil that would be used if a proper pre-mix product was being used, will work perfectly well for play bike use, or for any application where best possible throttle response, and reduced service are not things that matter particularly.

    Finally I challenge any of you trolls to post up some accurate (recent) technical data, suggesting autolube oil mixed at 50:1 is likely to work noticeably better than a proper pre-mix oil mixed at 100:1!

    If you cant do that, then I think the views of Amsoil tech department are probably correct, in the suggestion that pre-mix oils are the best thing to use in pre-mix bikes....................
  5. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    From your own woeful lack of understanding of simple technical issues, I would suggest great caution in relation to anything to do with engine "tuning".................
  6. slideways

    slideways España

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    You are wrong on all counts.

    The old air cooled motors put much more demand on oil than the newer water cooled motors.

    You keep talking in circles and regurgitating amsoil propaganda with zero real world experience.

    Even Spectro who makes a premix only oil wants it mixed at32:1.


    2 Stroke Oil
    Golden SX 32:1
    Golden SX 32:1 Semi-Synthetic Pre-Mix is a super-premium two-cycle engine lubricant formulated for today’s two-cycle moto-cross motorcycles equipped with exhaust power valves specifying a 32:1 pre-mixed fuel-to-oil mixture. Synthetic base stocks replace the high-density bright stock used in most lubricants — thereby reducing smoke and carbon residue considerably when mixed at the specified 32:1 ratio. A recent breakthrough in additive technology also provides exceptional ring groove and power valve cleanliness. Meets manufacturers’ warranty requirements and exceeds JASO FC, ISO-L-EGD + and API TC test requirements.

    O.SX321P 12/16 oz bottles/case


    You really should go trolling elsewhere .
  7. mtothef

    mtothef Been here awhile

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    reader's digest condensed version.
  8. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    Unlike yourself I dont choose to be regarded as a troll, who is simply interested in futile argument, with little if any recourse to fact!

    Part of the JASO test procedure for 2T oils is running a water-cooled motor without coolant, which in engineering terms places far more reliance on lubricant than any sort of testing carried out in the 70s, which pretty obviously is of little value today (other than to a troll perhaps?)

    Personally I dont place much faith in any of the oil manufacturers BS, and simply use the best possible full synthetic pre-mix only 2T, that is available to me (Castrol XR77), at a mix ratio appropriate to specific application. Those that are easily blinded by BS, will of course continue to use autolube oils at ratios which are far from ideal for pre-mix applications (I have outlined the different requirements for PM and AL, in previous posts, but this has been ignored by the trolls).
  9. joexr

    joexr Banned

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    You're the only TROLL I've seen here. You're not saving anyone from anything. We're not all pompous jackasses like yourself. The more you blither the more any small amount credibility you may have had fades. Maybe you can find someone to impress with your drivel on a childrens website.:lol3
  10. Valleyrider

    Valleyrider I Survived The '60s

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    And with that, please understand, we all have opinions and preferences.
    We've heard yours and you've heard ours. If I choose to use a brand, type and ratio of oil that doesn't sit well with you, please understand that I have made a decision and I'm willing to live with the results of that decision.
    Time to let this go Twin-shocker....
  11. slideways

    slideways España

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    Twintroll you are the only troll in this forum.

    Even Castrol does not recommend the use of XR77 in any of the offroad racing KTM 2 stks

    Check out their website, this is the oil they recommend.


    CASTROL POWER 1 RACING 2T
    Features
    Fully Synthetic 2-stroke motorcycle engine oil
    Fast burning, high protection formula
    For increased acceleration
    Excellent engine cleanliness
    Designed for both oil injection and pre-mix systems up to 50:1
    Exceptional resistance to seizure
    Castrol Power 1 Racing - increased acceleration, ultimate performance for extreme riding
    Castrol Power 1 Racing is an advanced, fully synthetic 2-stroke engine oil for use in modern, high speed, high performance 2-stroke engines.
    Its fast burn, high protection formula is designed to release the full potential from highly tuned motorcycle engines.
    Performance

    And no oil of theirs did they recommend be run at more than a 50:1 ratio.
    Unless you got a link to some reliable info which you have not provided yet nobody will accept your genie in a bottle beliefs . Your just a modern day snake oil salesman.

    So I pretty much believe that everything you write in this forum is misinformation.
  12. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    As to trolls, those who have no understanding of current 2T design or technology, and rely on wholly irrelevant 1970's testing, and ridiculous advertising blurb, it seems pretty clear they are well qualified at least in the area of trolling, if not in anything related to 2T engines!

    I have outlined repeatedly the exact reasons why proper pre-mix oils are more appropriate for pre-mix use than autolube types, and why mix ratios need to eb almost doubled if you chose to use autolube oil, rather than the proper thing.
  13. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    I have researched 2T lubrication, pretty carefully and all the information I have posted here is 100% accurate. If you feel that makes me a pompous jackass, and a troll, then thats entirely up to you!

    Many might feel though posting up BS related to 70s testing, and taking issue with manufacturers MSDS, and information provided by tech departments, seem to suggest far more accomplished jackass trolling, than anything posted up by me?
  14. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    The JASO test procedures are fact pure and simple, and I would suggest taking a careful look, before posting up anything more about autolube oils being superior to proper pre-mix only race oils.

    In regard to this thread on 2T lubrication, it seems to me those who shout loudest end up having whatever they have suggested taken as fact, even though this is far from being the case, and not one of the autolube trolls has been able to post up anything to support their curious claims.
  15. PSchrauber

    PSchrauber Long timer

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    This threat has gotten long and the discussion about 2- stroke oils is very interesting.

    Maybe I am a Noob in the case of 2-stroke oil for premix and autolube as I never had thaught about this difference in adding Oil to the gasoline.

    And that has too happens to me, a. rider since the 80's, having a TY which has a seperate oil tank and an autolube system and some various other two strokes which uses premix oil.

    Anyway back in the days the use of as less as possible 2-stroke oil was big in Germany as with all more environment friendly products and the ban of substances that where dangerous for health and mother nature.

    It surly had to do with the new upcoming green parties that won a lot of percentage in political elections with their statement that the earth doesn't need us in future but we need the earth ...

    Therefore using as little 2- stroke oil as possible was appreciated. Maico came out with a 1:100 lube and even Bultaco had a special oil with which you could use the Sherpas, Alpinas and Matadors with a premix of 1:100.

    In own experience the oil worked quite well I never had a problem with seizures and also never heard about any problems from others.

    Sadly this fashion lasted only for a couple of years and oils with a recommend blending of 1:100 vanished likewise did Bultaco.

    An I nearly seized Montesa when I bought a different oil try to use 1:100.

    Now as gas is not gasoline anymore, instead a gas - alcohol mixture. I don't trust this gas blending as alcohol dissolve oil I now using 1:50 - 1:75 premix with good result.

    And I use a French oil, just because it smells so nice after strawberrys, IPONE (that's the brand of the oil), makes extra advertising about their destinctive strawberry smelling 2-stroke oil. This to my first world problem I have.
  16. slideways

    slideways España

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    JASO TEST
    Castrol RS TTS


    FEATURES:
    Full synthetic 2-stroke motorcycle engine oil
    Creates a tough, heat-reactive layer of protection
    Designed for both oil injection and premix lubrication up to a fuel/oil ratio of 50:1
    Exceeds API TC, JASO FD, and ISO L EGD
    http://www.castrol.com/castrol/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9045373&contentId=7079433
    What more support do you want.

    The OP wanted to know what every bodies favorite oil and ratio was . Which 99% of the posters here provided.

    Except you who think you are some kind of petro chemical expert.

    When really you are just an idiot troll.
  17. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    For trials applications you can quite safely mix Castrol XR77 at 100:1 ratio. The main thing here is to opt for a proper pre-mix only oil, which has reduced (or no solvent content), which is far more suited to use in pre-mix bikes. If you have an autolube bike, then use autolube oil..................if you dismiss the BS advertising of the oil manufacturers (which is largely determined by "greenwash"), then choosing a 2T oil is really very simple!
  18. Twin-shocker

    Twin-shocker Long timer

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    Its an uphill struggle, butI have pointed out to the troll element numerous times, that if a 2T oil is a low smoke autolube type (all JASO, API, ISO rated are low smoke). then its not fully synthetic at all as it will contain PIB additives, and from 20 to 30% solvent content. These oils are very thin, and not ideally suited to use in pre-mix bikes, as an autolube system works in a completely different way to pre-mix (as clarified in previous posts).

    I guess as almost al posters here are from the US, due to greenwash BS, its probably impossible to buy a proper pre-mix only 2T oil such as Castrol XR77, so most choose to use autolube oils at double the mix ratio required for a proper pre mix product.
  19. anotherguy

    anotherguy Long timer

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    So let's see if we can settle this once and for all. You contend a mixture (using Belray H1R a pre mix full synthetic and VP U4.4) of 40:1 will make more power than one at 32:1 on the same bike on the same day. Throttle response is subjective. Jetted correctly of course. Is that correct? Care to make a wager? A large one?

    I'll volunteer my bike (YZ 465) on my dyno (DynoJet 250) tuned by me. You can choose the witness of your choice to verify I did indeed perform the testing as stated. Now put up or shut up.
  20. joexr

    joexr Banned

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    He WON"T put up and he CAN"T shut up.:rofl