Help me achieve perfection - WR450 twin Adv conversion

Discussion in 'Some Assembly Required' started by MotoPolo, Apr 22, 2016.

  1. MotoPolo

    MotoPolo So many places, so little time Supporter

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    OK I got my cheesecake shots and now it time to get it dirty. Body wrap came out really nice (but took a while). Not sure how well it will hold up in the dirt but it should offer some protection for the tank. The front fender had to be wet sanded to 600 grit and then professionally painted white to match tank - then wrapped. Wrapping would not stick to stock fender. It will probably get a few stickers before I'm done.

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    I installed a Profill tank filter - WAY TOO SLOW to fill. It is coming out . Maybe a necessary item for RTW but for US travel I'll take my chances with clean gas.

    The SpeedoDR did the trick for calibrating my speedometer. A nice unit - recommended.

    Next is to see if suspension needs anything - I'll be loading the bike with full panniers for that.
  2. readonly24

    readonly24 Been here awhile

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    Epic build.
  3. 2old2Bbold

    2old2Bbold was 2bold2getold

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    WOW !!! :clap:clap:clap

    Yeah you're gonna have to put some kind of naming stickers on it and you are still going to get a LOT of... "what the hell is that ?"
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  4. Scutty

    Scutty Talent-limited bike builder and rider Supporter

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    Ronald called, he wants his bike back......
    ronmacd.jpg

    Only kidding, looks great :)
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  5. redneckK20

    redneckK20 Been here awhile

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    So awesome, what a great build. Looks great.
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  6. Gedrog

    Gedrog 1000 mile stare a 1000 stories to tell

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    looks awsome
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  7. MotoPolo

    MotoPolo So many places, so little time Supporter

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    I also saw a DHL truck (lorie) pull up beside me and thought maybe I need them as a sponsor. I’ll check with Ronald too.:-)
    scot_douglas, JagLite and 16VGTIDave like this.
  8. greasyfatman

    greasyfatman Long timer

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    What's it called when insanity works out? Genius?

    Thanks for bringing us along I reread a chunk of this today. Outstanding!
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  9. Son of MotoPolo

    Son of MotoPolo The mountains are calling...

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    That's a rolling work of art. Amazing job!
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  10. IdahoRenegade

    IdahoRenegade Long timer

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    Daym, that is nice work! Well done, looks great.
  11. polishadam82

    polishadam82 black sheep

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    dude that is badass!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! so when is ti going for sale? lol
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  12. MotoPolo

    MotoPolo So many places, so little time Supporter

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    So we found some dirt around Mt Hood - tho not as much as we would have liked. Went about 150 miles. Here is the ride report - mostly good but I have a problem I hope you can help with.

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    Here is my riding buddy Bart and his KLR 650. Pretty easy trail, a couple of 18 " water crossings and some small rock patches. We did not have full packs - just enough to make it hard to throw a leg over and feel the bags as I stood on the pegs. Handling felt great to me. Much more stable than my WR 450 loaded. The low CG is noticeable. We didn't hit anything with any speed so did not ever bottom suspension, but suspension felt good. Rear spring may need to be a bit stiffer with full load. Engine is very tractable. One time I started off in third gear and it didn't seem to care.

    On the highway the engine is smooth, we cruised about 65 MPH. Wind buffeting is noticeable as is front end wobble. On acceleration above 65 MPH front end wobble is really noticeable. I think it is caused by the wind buffeting around the fairing. Wind noise in my helmet decreased substantially when I stood up. I cranked up the steering damper and steering wobble diminished to minimal. Off road this is not an issue so I am labeling this as a non-problem.

    Fuel mileage was right at 50 MPG. But that was 80% highway.

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    The Problem: It was pretty hot - mid 90 deg F. I noticed that on slow up-hills the bike was running about 220 deg F., which is where the fan would come on and that would kick it down to 210 F. Never had water come out of the radiator or into the overflow bottle. That is just a data point.

    The bike would cut out periodically. Felt like I hit the kill button for a micro-second. A quick momentary bog and then instant recovery. First occurrence was about 40 miles out, and throughout the day they became more frequent. By 4 o'clock, hottest part of day, the bogs lasted longer and occurred more frequently. Eventually the bike quit. At first I'd re-start and continue, and then it got to point where it would start in neutral (but not in gear with clutch pulled in - very weird), but would stall as soon as it went into gear.

    I didn't have any of these issues a month a go when I did my test rides and put 250 miles on her. Here are the things that changed since then (not counting complete disassembly/reassembly)
    1. Shortened intake runners to breath better inside air box
    2. Installed skid pan
    3. Installed SpeedoDR
    4. Installed breather tube onto gas cap
    5. Installed Mosko Moto luggage on top of gas cap
    6. It was cooler a month ago

    Our first thought was that the breather tube was getting pinched and not letting the tank breath. - disconnected breather tube.
    Next we thought the top bag may be covering the cap breather hole - loosed cap
    Disconnected SpeedoDR
    Disconnected gear selection switch (why was it stalling when in gear)
    In the end the only way to get it to run was to let the bike cool considerably (160F). It would then start (in gear even) and run until it warmed up and repeat the cut out. If it got hot enough it would die. Had to let it cool 3 times to go 20 miles and water temp never got over 190 F.

    Here are our thoughts on possible root causes:
    1. seems to be heat related - the radiator exhaust blows right at the ECU. ECU is sensitive to heat? - For FZ07 owners - is the ECU well protected against radiator heat?
    2. Bad ECU - this is a crashed ECU and it does have a ding in plastic case?? Maybe the heat and age are causing intermittent breakdown?
    3. Skid pan is making engine run hotter - it does enclose the exhaust - ??
    4. Clogged fuel filter (seems unlikely as you would think that would not be intermittent)
    5. Faulty fuel pump (also doesn't seem to fit symptoms)
    6. Bad gas cap (long shot)

    I'll start to eliminate these causes starting from the bottom, but if you have any thoughts I'd love to hear from you - thanks fo the help - AGAIN!!
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  13. plumer1kt

    plumer1kt Adventurer

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    Heat does affect electric components
    Search your wiring and the neutral/clutch/side stand combo
    Wiring/ECU went too hot while engine was at normal operating temp
    IMHO perhaps you didn't wired that combo as it should be.And all you need is a tiny short(or open) at that B/R wire on that crashed ECU...page 60.
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  14. MotoPolo

    MotoPolo So many places, so little time Supporter

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    Thanks Plumer - will search for short/open - maybe heat is opening up short/open?? Seems to be no problem until it gets hot.
  15. redneckK20

    redneckK20 Been here awhile

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    I would shield the ecm and double check your fuel system. Sounds like a pump getting hot and failing maybe.
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  16. MotoPolo

    MotoPolo So many places, so little time Supporter

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    Working on the ECM shielding.
    Pump getting hot - I have heard that is an issue with low fuel level. Not enough fuel in the tank to keep it cool. I always had more than 2 gal in the tank and the problem actually was worse after refueling (probably unrelated).

    I would imagine only solution is a new pump? Any thoughts on how to test ? - maybe pull off fuel hose from throttle body when in "won't start " condition and check fuel pressure?

    I could start replacing items - ECM, Fuel pump. that would be a lot easier if it weren't intermittent.
  17. plumer1kt

    plumer1kt Adventurer

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    Yes!Heat related.
    When a bike shuts down if you put a gear?When the side stand is open.
    Your bike "thought" you had the side stand open and with first gear ,for security reasons, killed the engine.Your solution was to "fool" the bike by making it think that was in neutral.You did that removing the gear selector.
    Then the engine could run with gear.That tell us that you have already a fault at the "neutral/clutch/side stand combo".
    And in that "combo" there is another wire that probably made the cut-off .B/R.
    Now search all the circuit again for a ground open ( i did check the diagram again) in the wires (melted?) ,and the ignition relay (damaged again?) but probably there is something going wrong inside the ECU.
    Repeat all the tests again .
    If you find a problem like a damaged ignition relay then replace the ECU.
    MotoPolo likes this.
  18. shinyribs

    shinyribs doesn't care

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    Just for reference regarding your coolant temps. MY FZ07 stays at 178 degrees year round, winter or summer, unless I'm in slow traffic. It's currently in the low to mid 90's here with the heat index hovering around 105-110f. I was running some errands in town the other day and always keep an eye on engine temperature. The bike never got above 190f in a couple hours of running around slow city streets and tight traffic. My fan has come on once ( yes, at 220f) inthe 16k miles I've put on the bike, and it's only been over 200f a couple times. This is with a stock ecu, Arrow exhaust and airbox snorkel removed, which only gives you some intake noise. Playing hard on the mountains - I mean nonstop flogging @7-9k rpm for an hour or more- and the temp still stays right at 178. The 07 seems to cool very well with even the slightest of airflow. It takes a LOT of sitting in traffic to trigger the fan. I would suspect that air is not flowing through your radiator as well as it should. It doesn't look like your bodywork should be blocking airflow, but aerodynamics are funny to gauge just standing back and looking.It doesn't sound like you are sitting on a time bomb, but it does appear it could use some attention. Good luck on the teething issues- all new builds have them!

    p.s.- the stock ecu location is directly above the valve cover on the throttle side. Basically directly behind the Yamaha emblem on the "tank". There is no heat shroud between it and the radiator.
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  19. redneckK20

    redneckK20 Been here awhile

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    I wouldn't just throw parts at it, try to duplicate the issue and diagnose it. You might be able to piece together a fuel pressure tester from stuff at an autoparts store, then hook a gauge inline and let it sit and run, getting heat soaked, see if you start losing pressure.
  20. Gedrog

    Gedrog 1000 mile stare a 1000 stories to tell

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    To me without experience of the specific bike the symptoms are common too what @plumer1kt suggest as the F650 Dakar has that same combo and can drive peeps nuts

    Another one I found was when you start the bike remember you are pulling the right side of the handlebar towards you when starting a bike and generally operating things at stand still, when you start experiencing the problem try pushing it towards the left and see if the problem resolves itself but this all depends on the way the wiring loom is routed and your natural arm movements. It wont give a direct point to the problem but will give you a more or less location to concentrate on. We can sometimes be a bit over zealous with crimping and in the end the only thing holding the two wires together is the insulation insulation gets hot and the two points separate. It is gonna be a biatch to find though if it is that

    Don't just attack the fuel pump there are so many cheap fuel pressure testers on fleebay that it will be a worthwhile investment I bought this set and it worked well for me with an X-Challenge that would run normally at low stress pushing it caused it to starve and in the end the pump was dodgy instead of giving 3.5 bar it was pushing 2 bar
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