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Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by cabanza, Sep 26, 2019.
As someone with a 125 autoclutch motor (that likely puts out less power than the one this new bike will come with) in a CT90 I can affirm you likely won't need the low range transmission (unless you're trying to haul some serious weight uphill). With the power my bike has it loses traction well before power becomes an issue. And it'll do 50-55mph before it runs out of gear. So those disc will be welcome additions to this old design.
On the ease of dropping in a low range to the Cub motor/trans, of that I'm not so sure. But I can tell you the old Cub and CT motors weren't one in the same with the addition of low range. The trans housings appear different on the ones I have and one of the mounts to the chassis had to be relocated for CT use from standard Cub configuration (presumably to accommodate the casement changes necessary for the low range fitment).
So with what would be added expense for an engine that's already plenty powerful for the application (that may not be selling in large numbers), I can't see Honda giving the go ahead. But I'd sure like to see it.
What about the CT's the early ones. They had two rear sprockets. Not sure how, but somehow you put the chain on the larger sprocket and it was like a low range???? right?
Yep, if a person were to machine up an overlay sprocket and carry it along with some appropriately sized fasteners and the extra length of chain you could do that. Probably take you 20min to make the swap, but certainly feasible. The lever is so much more convenient though. A compromise would be to carry a tooth or two smaller CS sprocket which you could change it in under 10min.
Well if anyone has one of these , I'd like a video of it working and how it all came together... and did you need two different chains?
No imagery of it but if you Google image search of maybe even check YouTube you can find an example. Basically there's a sprocket that goes around the normal one and you splice in some extra links for it to fit.
From what I understand, the CT125 of 1977 had gearing like the TL125 Trials bikes; gears 1,2,&3, were very low and tractor-like, and 4&5 were higher for road riding . Maybe Honda would drop in that gearing to the Monkey/Grom/Super Cub motor?
I have never seen a 125cc manual transmission bike that would not climb anything in first gear. At that point, traction becomes the limiting factor. I see this as being a mild trail bike that you wouldn't likely be trying to climb the side of a cliff with. However, considering what one of these would likely cost if it ever made it here, a slightly used VanVan or TW200 would give you more power, and more rear wheel traction. Depends on whether you want it to use or because of it's looks. Honda sold the Super Cub and Monkey as boutique bikes, meant to be looked at as much as ridden. The models they sold in other countries were a lot plainer, but also a lot cheaper.
There was no factory 125cc underbone CT, afaik. CT90 until they went to CT110 (105cc) in 1980 or thereabouts. 4spd only, N1234.
I think you're thinking of a bike that used the vertical cylinder 125 which has no relation at all to the Cub frame or motor, and only shared the Cat's name.
I'm curious what the CT125 gearing will be like, if indeed it goes into production and comes to the US.
FWIW reported ratios for the Grom (I couldn't find ratios for the Super Cub 125) are
1st : 2.500
2nd : 1.550
3rd : 1.150
4th : 0.923
reported CT90 ratios:
Primary gear ratio = 3.722
1st gear ratio = 2.538
2nd gear ratio = 1.611
3rd gear ratio = 1.190
4th gear ratio = 0.958
The dual range sub transmission has a ratio of 1.000 : 1.867
If the Grom gear ratios are used in the CT125 along with sprockets to provide a similar final drive then it might have limited off road abilities. If I recall correctly the Australian couple that rode Groms across the US burned out at least one clutch. Slipping the clutch isn't a good substitute for the right gearing for conditions. The only '68 or newer CT without the sub-transmission was the little sought after '80 - point being that despite similarities to the old CT90s/110s the new bike might not be capable of much more than campground type duties without it.
Honda, and I think for only 1 rear... had an ATC 3 wheeler with a 125. It even had reverse. I also believe that it had dual range. For sure it had reverse and it was pull start.
We have an atc125 over in the barn. Dual range, I believe, and e-start. No reverse, though.
Already started setting some cash aside for this purchase.....hopefully Honda tells us soon!
Anyone remember the timeline between introduction of the Monkey and Super Cub at the Tokyo Motor Show then an announcement for the US market? I seem to remember we were left hanging for a month or two after the new Super Cub was announced but I can't remember the Monkey. I put my deposit down on the Super Cub I think it was November of 17. Purchased March of 19 so it took a while!
For anyone looking for some more ct125 media... The auto-translated subtitles are pretty funny. I'll be selling one of my ct90s and buying one of these if it comes to the US.
The announcement was like June 18
Now that I think about it maybe I put my deposit down in June of 18 and not November of 17. It was literally the day it was officially announced for the US Market. All I remember is waiting on what felt like forever for it to come out. 9 months was really not that bad but of coarse it ends up being a long time when you are waiting for something cool like the Super Cub.
Making a guess they may announce it at the Long Beach Motorcycle show or slightly before? This is 11/22 - 11/24 It will of coarse be in attendance and if its there I imagine it greatly increases the chance it will be coming to the USA. If it is official in November and it may be coming next Summer. Damn in another life I had more free time and spare income I would likely take a trip down to Long Beach just to check out the whole show. Our motorcycle show leaves a lot to be desired and it has not even come to town the past few years!
That guy in the video make me want to QUIT riding. geeeshhh
I didn't understand a single word, but I want one.
What is he pointing to at the Honda roundel? 5:18 mark. It looks like it opens. I like the bolts for mounting a tank bag. Ingenious.