Honda PC800 - Pacific Coast riders - opinions and pics please

Discussion in 'Road Warriors' started by The PacRat, Apr 18, 2008.

  1. Ever Onward

    Ever Onward Older,Wiser, Smarter

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    Say @procycle, didnt you do a before and after dyno run with your PC 800 ?

    I seem to recall you mentioning something about it. I remember a decent gain for mods done ?
  2. procycle

    procycle Long timer

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    Yes, from January last year. The saga starts here and goes on sporadically for a couple of months.

    *******************************************

    Back from the dyno. The chart looks really good.

    [​IMG]


    I've got a 15% increase in peak horsepower and almost 20% increase in torque between 4500 and 6200 rpm. It makes more power from 5200 to 7800 than it did at the old HP peak. To translate that into real world riding - it pulls harder now in 5th gear than it ever did before in 4th gear.

    AFR through the meat of the power is improved running in the 12.8-12.9 range. I think that could be leaned out a fraction since I've been doing all my testing in 45 degree weather. Warmer weather would drop that AFR number a little bit.


    The boys at the KTM shop also did a half throttle run to give further indication on the needle setting.
    I think they were surprised when I told them the needles were at the stock height and wanted to see for themselves if the AFRs were reasonable. It also looks good with half throttle acceleration running in the 13 range. My friends at KTM thought the jetting was spot on - but their focus is primarily on tuning race bikes. IMO, it could also be leaned out a tad (if that were possible) without hurting anything.

    [​IMG]

    If I wasn't planning on some alteration to the muffler I would probably drop the mains to 192 or 190, do a little more data collection to verify the change and call it good. With luck, de-restricting the exhaust will be just enough to lean out the AFR numbers a few 10ths.
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  3. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    "Sigh" Much better.....
  4. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    I would love to. Can't find a local dyno. I live in the boonies.
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  5. procycle

    procycle Long timer

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    Sounds like a perfect excuse to take a nice long motorcycle ride. That's what these bikes are for, right?
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  6. Ever Onward

    Ever Onward Older,Wiser, Smarter

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    Yep !

    Especially when you take the long and scenic route ! :clap



    P1230106.jpeg
  7. Zooker

    Zooker Adventurer

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    I'm back after a little while to give report on the IMaScot mods I made some time ago. I really enjoy the power and the absence of the power drop off around 7K rpms. I installed a 96 engine about 6 months ago due to 3rd gear giving me some trouble... now I'm getting 43MPG WOT around town and back roads and at least 49 on straight hi-way running. It sounds great and I really love the way it rides. I truly enjoy seeing people turn around to see 'what is coming'... before I arrive! The only thing I don't like about it is the way it hesitates ever so slightly in 5th gear when I upshift and don't give it gas right away. If I roll on, no problem... Oh... and If I go hog wild in passing in either 4th or 5th, my clutch slips. I need to add a washer to the clutch spring. This happened on the original engine and the new one ('96 with less than 10K when installed).

    Also, I've gone to the darkside - love that as well.

    I was on a NT700 - I may buy it... but was more comfortable in the twisties on the PC - I love how it really pulls now coming out of a turn.

    I'm waffling a bit on the NT... I have an opportunity to buy one for $5K out the door (15K miles - no ABS), but it has all the other bells/whistles....

    Any thoughts?

    Zooker
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  8. Ever Onward

    Ever Onward Older,Wiser, Smarter

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    My stock PC gets between 55 to 60 MPG. The stock muffler is whisper quiet. The Metzeler tires are round profile and work just fine. :lol3
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  9. Zooker

    Zooker Adventurer

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    In my humble opinion... it's safer being heard. I do like the rumble as I work through the gears. My fuel economy suffers, but I'd much rather have the torque.

    I just filled up... running back PA roads yesterday... WOT... just over 45 mpg. I'm taking a trip soon with some highway miles, just to see what it will do. I never run highway... It took me 8 hours to leisurely make my way from central PA to western Va... it's a 3.5 hours ride on the highway. Great ride!

    Does anyone use the beads for balancing? I have and I don't like it - maybe I'm doing something wrong. I get a wobble around 80 mph... I'm taking it to my shop for traditional balancing and an inspection hopefully this week.

    I have an extra stock muffler just in case I didn't like the setup I mentioned. PM me if interested. Ebay has them for well over $200... I don't need that much for it.

    Zooker
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  10. SmittyBlackstone

    SmittyBlackstone Long timer

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    I use the beads in all my bikes. No issues at any speed. The bikes range from CT90s to an Ultra Limited. A ZRX, KLR, Six different BMWs in that mix too.
    The issue I've had with one of my PCs, is that it gets a random thump from the front end. Not rythmic like bad balance. Changed out the rim and tire, checked for runout and balance before and after mounting the new tire.
    Was in process of further diagnosis, but a fork seal let go, and that bike has been parked for over a year. That's why I haven't tried any of the performance modifications yet. I have a rebuilt set of forks ready to go into it, but I've been messing around with BMWs for quite some time now. Plus getting bikes ready for shows.
    Now that there are no shows I'm repairing all the bikes that have been sitting. Hopefully I will get to the bottom of that thump. It does not appear to be related to wheel balance at all. Because I balanced statically, then also added beads later on to fine tune it.
    I am a huge fan of the beads. I have a 2010 Fatboy and that big disc wheel and tire can be a bear to balance. Just the addition of beads to that front tire has made that bike feel incredibly planted and smooth. I'm not saying the beads can fix huge out of balance conditions, but they sure do fine tune it well. Sorry to ramble on.
  11. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    Hi Zooker! You are getting about the same gas mileage as me. If you drive a lot on the freeway, consider installing a final drive from a VT1100. 10% overall higher gearing and the extra horsepower you have now will carry it easy. I'm getting 48 mpg at a cruise speed of 75 mph. Your hesitation when shifting into 5th gear sounds like a slightly lean condition. If it bothers you, consider changing the low speed jets two steps up, or raising the needle jet an extra 0.020". THE CLUTCH: Iv'e that sucker apart so often that I have spare gaskets on the shelf. But I have found the solution. Here it is. The factory friction plates are crap. Buy a set of friction plates made by EBC. They are much more agressive and don't cost a mint. Install them with a new set of Honda clutch springs and add ONE washer to the springs. I can drive as hard as I want, two up, full load, and no slippage. I strongly recommend it for any PC800 owner. Beware one thing. When you pull the clutch case cover, the shifting rod will pull out of position. Verify the shifting before you tighten down the clutch cover. Your "wobble" at apx 80 mph. I can't feel your bike from here but I belive I know what's wrong. Your fork springs are slightly sacked and your bike trial geometry is wrong. I'm confident about this because I had the same problem. The fix: Get a machinist buddy to cut you two round shims that fit inside your fork tubes. I made mine out of aluminium tubing 19mm long (3/4"). Lift the bike on a jack. Drain the oil and suction out the grime on the bottom of the forks. Add new fork oil (Belray #10) and install the shims on top of the fork springs. You will need to push down firmly when screwing down the fork caps. The extra 3/4" height on the forks should cure your wobble.
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  12. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    On the NT700. If you have to sell the PC800 to get the NT, don't do it. Too many people have said that they regret selling their PC800. I met a couple last summer at a local takeout. They were in their seventies. They followed me for over 40 miles and stopped behind me when I did. They used to have one I was told. Bought it new in 1989. The silver model. They circled my bike a few times while talking, and then they offered me a ridiculous high price for my bike. I could have bought a good used Goldwing. The PC800 did look good. I reconditioned it a few years ago. I considered it, but I declined. I knew what I had. So they knew what they lost too. The PC800 is a very special bike. One of a kind.
    If you can keep the PC and ride the NT as well, that would be great. Let's hear a comparison.
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  13. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    I agree. Had a trip planned for Maine this summer. Does not look good. The US / Canadian borders are pretty much closed and no end in sight due to Covid -19. However, I will post a chart as soon as I have a chance. Did I mention that I swapped out the engine for an RC51?
    Just kidding.... But it would be awesome.
    Maybe it would fit if I just moved the .....
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  14. Zooker

    Zooker Adventurer

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    I'm afraid I just can't swallow the look of 'scooter butt' any longer! The wobble I mention doesn't happen on its own... well not really. If I shake the steering back and forth... even slightly going that fast, it makes the bike feel unstable. I was speaking to my mechanic today - he said that it sounds like air is getting up underneath somehow and making the front end lighter. I remembered then that I have not been riding with the disk brake covers... so I reinstalled them tonight. it's better... I took it to 90mph... but if I shook the steering a bit, it seemed to make the bike unstable. Maybe what I'm doing will make every bike wobble and feel unsafe...???

    I have a buyer for the PC... I need to fix the clutch issue without spending too much. I just dropped my price in lieu of a fractured mirror housing. The bike is beautiful and solid. The mirror is solid... just the outer housing near the edge fractured (and I lost a small piece) when It came in contact with my trailer wall as I was backing it down off the trailer... I was SO upset! I knew I wouldn't be able to find a replacement and that was now a blemish on my bike!!!!!

    Anyhow... my mechanic will ride it next Wednesday and I'll ask him what he thinks.

    Why would you need to change your geometry again?

    I really appreciate your experience... and I love your mods!

    Zooker
  15. IMaScot

    IMaScot Everything can be Stolen.

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    Your mechanic is wrong. Air is NOT getting under the bike and generating steering problems. I haven't laid down my "thing" before, but I will now because I belive that someone is leading you astray. That's wrong.
    Here's where I lay down my "thing": My grandfather was a blacksmith. My father was a millwright. I'm a millwright. Also an inmate instructor. And a security instructor. And a team leader for work forces inside the security perimiter. The site is worth apx $990,000,000. And employes 470 staff. Apx 1800 inmates. I am the chief mechanic for the facility, and have held this position for 12 years. That's my thing.

    Your geomtry: If you lower your front end the rake and trial will indroduce "headshake" into your bike at high speeds.
    Install the fork spring shims. You will see.
  16. RedRocket

    RedRocket Yeah! I want Cheesy Poofs

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    I made spacers out of white plastic sprinkler pipe
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  17. Ever Onward

    Ever Onward Older,Wiser, Smarter

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    Impressive !

    How did you find time to put in 40 years as a professional mechanic then ?

    And you say trail ( actually you call it "trial") will introduce headshake. Hmmmmm, interesting. :lol3


    Needle jets cant be raised or lowered. They are a fixed position tube.

    Fork spacers simply preload a given spring more. They do not cure the root problem of too soft a spring rate.

    The right way to solve PC forks springs is a heavier rate spring. Progressive makes a better pair, and needs no spacers.
  18. Zooker

    Zooker Adventurer

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    I'm still conflicted... I have seriously considered keeping the PC and going naked - just haven't seen anything that remotely looks good. I am so tempted to try. I took an '89 helix and went 'rat'...

    I have a need to know why. What changed... what did I do to bring about this behavior? I did switch out a pair of '89 front forks - with new Belray-10 oil and new honda fork seals... but I have trouble with time-lines.

    I still have my originals and the seals are good yet... actually... I don't know that they are. I'm rambling.

    Anyone every come across a sweet naked/rat PC? Problem is - the engine is ugly... capital U, Ugly!

    Peace out...

    Zooker HelixRAT1.JPG HelixRAT3.JPG.JPG HelixRAT1.JPG
  19. Zooker

    Zooker Adventurer

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    The blinkers and brake lights and speedo came from an early 80's Yamaha something or other.
  20. spuh

    spuh Been here awhile

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    Pardon me for interrupting all this discussion of ugliness and nakedness. Or thank me if you prefer.
    I'm pulling the carbs and can't quite figure out how to disconnect the choke cables from the carbs. It looks like they're held on by knurled plastic collars. Is what I think I'm seeing correct? What do you use to unscrew them? Are they right hand thread? Once unscrewed, should I prepare for anything to spring out and seek a remote hiding place? Thanks in advance.
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