Honda Reflex Forum questions and answers

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by olographics28, Jul 13, 2014.

  1. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    Hello, guys and girls, I am creating this forum Exclusively for the Honda Reflex Scooter, I recently bought ( a few days ago) a 2003 Honda Reflex with 4800 miles on it, one original owner, and apparently almost everything is working smoothly EXCEPT for the takeoff, when I am completely stop and I start running the scooter (under 10 mph) a vibration shakes the whole scooter, even the windshield shakes but after I gain speed everything is smooth like butter.
    Is this normal or is there a problem there?
    Thank you for your help in advance and hopefully this tread can be a guide for all the AWESOME Honda Reflex owners.
    #1
  2. longhaul747

    longhaul747 Long timer

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    Welcome to the Forum.....The Reflex in my opinion is one of the best scooters ever made!

    Your problem with the Reflex is extremely common and other then being annoying its not usually a serious issue. Its caused by glazing on the variator plates and it gets a bit grabby on acceleration. Usually caused by really slow takeoffs where things hang longer. Scooters actually like aggressive takeoffs.

    The fix is really simple. As you ride and stopped at traffic lights grab the front brake and kick up the RPM's to about 3,000 to 3,500 for about 20 seconds at a time. Do this about 3 or 4 times and it will really smooth out.

    Also a good blast down the freeway usually smooths things out at least for me it did. You may notice that the problem will come back pretty fast at least it did for me but repeating the steps above and or a good run down the freeway cured it for a period of time. It always comes back unfortunately. Nature of the beast on the Reflex.

    Some have fixed it more permanently by removing the variator plates and sanding them smooth. This prevents the belt from being grabby but because of the metallurgy it will likely come back again at some point.
    #2
  3. Chillis

    Chillis Long timer Supporter

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    Variator plates?

    Are you sure this is not a clutch/clutch bell issue?
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  4. longhaul747

    longhaul747 Long timer

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    It could be the clutch but I was always told it was the metal parts that spread to allow the belt to move up the variator. They get grooves in them preventing the belt from moving smoothly causing the bouncing on take off issue.

    The fix is the same with varying degrees of success!
    #4
  5. Chillis

    Chillis Long timer Supporter

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    The way the scooter transmission is designed, the rollers/sliders wear(plastic) and not the variator's ramps. If there is an issue on the backside of the variator usually it needs a cleaning and maybe new ramp guide bushings.

    If you are getting that stutter on take off I would be looking at the other end though. The clutch/bell. If it is glazed over it could be slipping to too high of an rpm. Rough it up with sand paper, both shoes and inner side of clutch bell.
    #5
  6. bikeridermark

    bikeridermark Long timer Supporter

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    It's the clutch. Hold the front brake or put the front wheel against a wall. Crank up the throttle for a few seconds then back off. Do this a few times, should make the take-off smoother. One of my Reflexes shuddered on takeoff and this solved it instantly.
    The yahoo reflex owners forum has a lot of good info, but post up here ,too. We'll help you out all we can.
    BTW, one of the best mods you can do to the Reflex is the Face 'B' from the big ruckus scooter along with Dr. Pulley 19g sliders.
    I have two, and I absolutely LOVE these scooters!
    #6
  7. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    Today I dissemble (is it the correct word?) the left side covers (skirt, air box,belt cover, transmission cover) and I leave the variator and the clutch at the open air and the first thing I have noticed was a lot of black dust also the belt is not tight enough, if I press it up and down moves about and inch up and an inch down, I can't make contact with the up and down sides of the together but it looked loose enough.
    I decided to do a little test and I crank the engine with all this components exposed and voila... the sound heard and the vibration came from the belt shaking inside the case.
    Is there a way to tighten it up or I should order a new one?
    Any suggestions on brand and where to buy it?
    Thank you all for your help.

    Attached Files:

    #7
  8. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    I forgot to tell you that the "disks" (sorry, I don't know the real or technical name of them) in the inside of the variator and clutch are smooth, nothing seems stuck or making their surface weird.

    Attached Files:

    #8
  9. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    here is the picture of the inside walls of the clutch disks.
    They look very smooth at touch, is that correct?

    Attached Files:

    #9
  10. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    I am a little confused because I really don't know what is the correct belt size that I should buy to replace the "shaking" belt in my reflex now.
    on eBay the " correct" size is listed as 906 22.5 30, but the belt installed now reads 23100 KFGA 0030.
    Any help here?????
    Thank you.

    Attached Files:

    • belt.jpg
      belt.jpg
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    #10
  11. Warney

    Warney Been here awhile

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    The Bando belt pictured is the correct original belt but the new part number is 23100 KGF 641. The width of the old belt should be measured with a caliper to see if it is still serviceable. Also, turn the belt inside out and check for breaks between each cog.
    Beware ebay bargain belts or "equivalents", Mother Honda knows best.
    There is much online information on Honda Reflex Variator mods.
    Totalruckus in the Big Ruckus section has lots of pertinent info.
    Yahoogroups has or had a Honda Reflex site.
    #11
  12. Bronco638

    Bronco638 Nobody Home

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    I have a 2002 Reflex with just over 18K miles on it. It's awesome, IMO.

    Mark is right, when it comes to shudder issues from the clutch. This should help resolve the problem or greatly reduce the shudder.

    With 4800 miles you should have another 7000 miles on the belt. However, belts can wear prematurely based on use. The pictures you posted aren't anything that's unexpected. However, if the variator (to the left in the first picture) faces are severely glazed, they can cause the belt to slip/howl under acceleration. When I changed the drive belt on my Flex, I used 400 grit wet/dry sandpaper (wet) to break the glaze. You will notice the variator faces change from a shiny, mirror-like surface to something more dull and aluminum looking. This will allow the new belt to break-in properly and eventually, the variator face will become polished once more.

    My scoot also shudders some when the ambient temperatures are cool/cold and the engine hasn't warmed up quite yet. FYI.
    #12
  13. Wentwest

    Wentwest How's that work?

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    The "loose" belt isn't. It's normal. These belts are different than car belts, and they look like yours. Measure the width of the back of the belt. It should be 22mm, if I remember correctly. With less than 5000 miles that belt should be fine. Try the clutch slipping methods in the earlier posts, then ride that scooter. You are worrying too much. These are not fragile little flowers, they are hard working, durable machines.
    #13
  14. bikeridermark

    bikeridermark Long timer Supporter

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    olographics28, the pieces in you picture you refer to as 'cluthes' are your variator and driven pulleys. The clutch is mounted out side of the rear driven pulley.
    Look for some videos of how a variator works, or watch yours running. You'll see the clutch engage as you increase the rpms. :1drink
    #14
  15. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    Hello, today I got delivered all the parts I ordered for my Reflex fixing (new belt, new air filter, new spark plug,variator removing tool and Synthetic motor oil and gear oil).
    I follow the steps on the video posted on Youtube of Thomas Leib K Mod part One and Two.
    I remove the variator and sand paper off the glaze on the surfaces, I remove the Black rollers and just left the beige ones, install the new belt and so on...
    The shake at take off is better now but not gone copletely let's say till a 30% of shaking left but I noticed a more noisy scooter (yes, it is faster now) but I feel like driving a 2 stroke engine more peppy but more noisy.
    Is that the result of the K Mod?
    To be honest I just want to eliminate the shaking and end up doing the Mod too.
    Do you guys have a word of advice about the K Mod results?
    Thank you in advance as always.
    #15
  16. Chillis

    Chillis Long timer Supporter

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    Not sure what kmod is but I believe it is just the removal of variator weights. You are causing your variator to turn higher rpm at any given speed.

    You did nothing with your clutch? That is where the shuddering is from.
    #16
  17. Bronco638

    Bronco638 Nobody Home

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    I have "K Modded" two Reflexes and have enjoyed the results. If you're running the scooter with the belt cover off, it will seem very loud because you can hear the cooling fan spin in the open air. Otherwise, it is not any louder once you have buttoned everything up. If you're still experiencing shudder, you need to follow Mark's advice in his earlier post.

    As indicated above ^^, the K Mod removes variator weights so that the variator will spin faster, thus accelerating the scooter more quickly. Unless you didn't de-glaze the variator faces properly, the shudder isn't related to that.
    #17
  18. bikeridermark

    bikeridermark Long timer Supporter

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    Variator turns engine rpm, regardless of the rollers installed. With less weight installed ( lighter or less rollers ), the variator doesn't close up as fast, keeping the scooter in a lower gear.
    #18
  19. olographics28

    olographics28 n00b

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    Today I revert my reflex to stock,I put back the black rollers inside the variator and remove the clutch pulley and bell,I sanded off the glaze from inside the bell and the pulley, also I sanded a little the clutch pads....
    Same shaking as always, as if nothing was done.
    How can I know if I need a new bell or/and clutch?
    I really don't know what else I can do, new belt,K Mod and back to stock,deglazed variator pulley, clutch pulley and bell, same old sh......t.
    #19
  20. Bronco638

    Bronco638 Nobody Home

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    At this point I'm thinking it's time to start looking at the carburetor. It's starting to sound like your idle (or pilot) circuit might not be working properly. The pilot jet could be partially clogged which means the engine isn't getting enough fuel at low RPM.
    #20