How effective is the canister at controlling pollution?

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by New Adventurer, May 18, 2007.

  1. Pir8te

    Pir8te over forty victim of fate

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    Interesting are the none US bikes less green or is this something that is required by US code and therefore not exactly the genie in the bottle described by some
    #21
  2. SCQTT

    SCQTT Zwei Kolben

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    Save us from the big two strokes. I was at my dealer toady and that is all he had on the floor. Damn those big two strokes they are going to be the ruin of man.

    The icebergs are melting and the sun is going to burn a hole right through the top of my skull.
    #22
  3. SocalRob

    SocalRob Long timer Supporter

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    Not sure where I read about the parked 1999 cars, but think it was an LA Times article a couple of years ago. I do know the parked cars in the hot sun is enough of a source of pollution that LA city now has a code regarding tree cover in new open to the sky parking lots (cars in shade emit much less emissions). Remember, they are talking about all emissions, including outgassing of interiors, paint, & everything else.

    May be an urban myth, but supposedly a new car's tailpipe emissions are cleaner than the ambiant air. Of course they do include more CO2, not a smog pollutant/poison. I do know for a fact that underground vapor extraction systems, used to clean toxic pollution sites, are run through the air intake on standard car engines as that is the cheapest / cleanest way to scrub the air.

    I put up with what on the surface seems silly stuff by the government here on air pollution (like I can't buy the old Honda spray cleaner/polisher in CA), but cannot argue that the result has been wildly cleaner air here in LA than when I grew up, even though I am guessing the metro population has doubled. In the 70's LA averaged almost 150 smog alert days (days that are unhealthful to children & respritory challenged adults), now we are only averaging about 1 per year. There also used to be high alert days when kids were not allowed to play outside at school. I still remember the indoor days. My kids have never had that experience.

    I live in LA. I don't believe in screwing with smog controls unless absolutely neccessary (I will admit to rejetting my Honda XR400 (green sticker bike, BTW) to a 49 state jet so the thing would actually start prior to my having a stroke). I live with crappy oil base paint that turns yellow, crappy BBQ lighter fluid, & a long list of compromised products, but the fact is I get blue sky almost all the time as a result.
    #23
  4. Jelly

    Jelly Super Dork

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    My 1100 started spitting a little fuel on the ground after fill up due to a clogged canister? I put a new one back on. $90 but worth it I feel.
    #24
  5. DriveShaft

    DriveShaft Long timer

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    Not sure if spitting of fuel onto the ground after a fill-up is due to a clogged canister. It depends on which tube it's spitting from. If it's spitting from the tube coming off of your canister itself...yes. But if it's spitting off of the over-fill drain, that's fairly innocuous.
    #25
  6. Jelly

    Jelly Super Dork

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    To be honest, I had the dealer look at it when in for some service. It was worse on warmer days. I filled the tank just as high as I always had and would notice a small amount of fuel spilling out on the pavement before I started off again. He pulled it off along with the hoses & plugged everything. He said that’s what most people do? I asked what he felt, as I have a good relationship with him and he replied “Its good for the environment” and I had to agree and had him throw the new one on. Never had a problem since. The bike has been dumped a few times offroad so I don’t know if that’s related or not? Oddly my Haynes & Clymer manuals only show this piece on <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:smarttags" /><st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">California</st1:place></st1:State> models? I live and bought the bike in <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Michigan</st1:place></st1:State>? Maybe BMW just made all the <st1:country-region w:st="on">U.S.</st1:country-region> bikes <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">California</st1:place></st1:State> compliant?
    #26
  7. MarkV

    MarkV Been here awhile

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    some factory has to process the oil to create the plastic, process the rubber/silicone, smelt the iron ore, and stamp out the steel brackets... never mind that any of those man made products out gas themselves, but i'm sure those factories all conform to some strict environmental code to be toxin free when manufactured in china. just like all the other highly regulated overseas industries that inexpensively produce the processors in your pc, the screens of your TV's... if you think you're saving the world from the destructive nature of a venting gas tank go right ahead by all means.
    #27
  8. 2wheelsrule

    2wheelsrule youth survivor

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    Right, it's the VOCs from all that outgassing that leads to the nasty photochemical smog you guys suffer from in LA, and evap controls have done a lot to reduce the smog (as you've experienced). However, cars and trucks have much larger fuel tanks, with a lot more air to expand and spew out vapor. Plus, motorcycles are what... 1% of registered vehicles in CA? I'm pretty sure if you removed the evap cans from every motorcycle down there, you wouldn't notice a difference.
    #28
  9. New Adventurer

    New Adventurer Been here awhile

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    Thanks for the information. I decided to keep mine on because:

    1) all the dirty mcnasties of manufacturing it have already been produced. Taking it off would just create another issue either in clogging a landfill or cluttering my garage.
    2) every little bit toward keeping the environment clean helps.
    3) Even though motorcycles only comprise a small percent of all vehicles, it is a vehicle that only gets roughly 40 mpg, so the level of environmental impact for this particular vehicle is significant, not miniscule compared to a cage.
    4) I really like clean air, too. Keeping it on seems like a small price to pay.
    #29
  10. SCQTT

    SCQTT Zwei Kolben

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    God I'm glad i only have 30 or so years left on this mudball. By the time we get there the younger generations will be consuming their oun waste because it might damage a blade of grass.


    Here's an idea. How many of you greenies have kids? What do you think their effect on the enviroment will be?

    Stop having kids.

    Our pollution (and energy) problems could be quickly solved with a little virus or flu.
    #30
  11. SocalRob

    SocalRob Long timer Supporter

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    I don't see it that way Scqtt. I think it is the duty of smart people to have kids, not good if only stupid people breed. Also, if we manage our resources in a responsible manner there is plenty to go around, and plenty for a much larger global population. For instance, here in LA they already treat the sewage to good enough levels to be used as drinking water. Not done because of squimish people, apparently like yourself. I would not mind in the least. Its all about sustainability.
    #31
  12. DriveShaft

    DriveShaft Long timer

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    That's not a correllation, Mark. A correlation usually involves an equal sign.
    #32
  13. Harry Swan

    Harry Swan One more time

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    How bad? My 1150 GS has been sitting for three months and I evidently have fuel in there ... The last few days I've run it for about ten minutes each time and I still can't get the engine to smooth out. I stop because the box with the converter heats to a red hot glow! I'm ready to trailer the thing to a dealer before I do anything further. As other Angelenos have said, I'd rather keep the catalytic converter than not.
    Any thoughts on the 'best' course?
    #33
  14. markgsnw

    markgsnw WTF?

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    misc thoughts:


    We have an alternative commuting challenge at work every year. I step up with my "I ride a motorcycle" attitude, and they send me back a long article from an engineering journal which shows that contemporary motorcycles are way dirtier than contemporary cars. Even bikes with cats are much dirtier.


    Back in the 70's, when this first came up (as far as I know), it was estimated that 10% of the smog in the SF Bay Area was from evaporating gasoline.


    Also back in the 60's and 70's, air pollution was horrible in the SF and LA areas. San Jose had ground level smog and visibility was a few blocks. The air is much much much cleaner now than it was then, in spite of there being a lot more cars and a lot more people. Pollution controls help a lot.


    I've been to Europe a couple of times and Africa and the UK once in the past few years. Air pollution is much worse than in the US. Seems like they are just getting around to addressing car pollution. Italy uses a lot of diesel and the air reflects it. Shanghai has air that you could saw into blocks and build a garage out of.


    When I pulled my canister plumbling apart, it was completely clogged with charcoal. I concluded that it was not doing anything at that point and removed it. I assume that I would need to buy a new canister to make that all work again.


    The cat stays, period. New can, nice sound, a bit more torque, a bit less weight.
    #34
  15. GSman of La Mancha

    GSman of La Mancha So!? My dog loves me...

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    My bike fell over in my driveway. Actucally, I was just back from a lomg ride and I was attempting to navigate around my wife's car and a chaise lounge on my way to the garage. I let the engine die and the bike and i decided to lay down.

    Anyway, my driveway stupidity caused something to spill onto the catalytic converter which caused a lot of smoke.

    I looked long and hard for the source and finally discovered it was coming from a black rubber hose attached to the canister. Evidently, this is some sort of drain.

    The stuff that came out was sort of like oil. Almost like brake fluid really. It did not smell like gasoline. There was maybe an ounce or two of stuff that came out.
    #35
  16. Mac

    Mac Long timer

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    My canister is 100% effective.

    It has been preventing a cardboard box from emitting poisonous gases for over 6 months now.
    #36
  17. Airguitar

    Airguitar Thumpin'!!

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    Seems like guys are gonna do what they want to anyway and justify it by whatever means are convenient.. It is quite a hot moral topic, to remove or not to remove,, that is the question...
    So far neither side has come up with hard facts and figures,, kinda makes it hard to reach a firm decision...
    #37
  18. jaek

    jaek knucklehead

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    At least in California, your motorcycle comes with a 5 year / 30k km emissions warranty, so if your canister fails, you should be able to get a new one for free.
    #38
  19. DriveShaft

    DriveShaft Long timer

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    Whether evap control systems help the environment is frankly, not a question of debate anymore amongst those who are literate in the field. It is not an issue of morals. Don't let the thread degenerate further unless you really enjoy pointless internet arguments.

    It's economic and environmental impacts have been researched ad nauseum, over the past 30 years. Emissions estimation models like COPERT III, EMFAC2002, and MOBILE6 have been around for years, and all point to one blatantly obvious fact; adding 3 lbs of steel and carbon to your 400lb hunk of machinery does the environment more good than bad (and seriously...can you think of *anything* on your bike that is as simple/rudimentary/cheap to make as a can of charcoal?). Finding folks who argue against those studies is like finding that rogue japanese soldier on a remote island who still thinks Japan is at war with the States. Whaddya going to say to him? :dunno The war is over, bud. Game over. Almost infallibly, as this thread so demonstrates, you get the skeptics. There are plenty of debates raging these days about energy and environmental policy. Biofuels...natural gas...solar...evaprative emission controls are not one of them. You could make it one...but it'd only be in your mind. The rest of the world has moved on.
    #39
  20. rideLD

    rideLD The further the better!

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    +1

    :lol3
    #40