Klim Baja S4 - opinions yet?

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by spuh, Jan 24, 2020.

  1. spuh

    spuh Been here awhile

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    As the title implies (I hope), wondering what the collective thinks about the new Baja S4? Saw one at the dealer and I found it to be well designed and well made. Quality materials and mesh with Superfabric abrasion panels implies good street protection with cool wearing at off road speeds. The ideal dual purpose clothing? What do you think?
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  2. shrederscott

    shrederscott Long timer

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    Hi

    Have not yet seen in person.

    I currently ride in a full mesh klim kit. I wear the Mojave pant with the Induction jacket

    I have reviewed the klim specs and you tube video.

    My thoughts.

    Set has a lot mesh ! ! And that is great.

    There are a some nice features on the jacket that are a missing on my induction. Collar snap down, hydration pouch.

    The mesh fabric choice is interesting. On both the Induction jacket and Ralley Air, Klim makes BOLD claims about the mesh strength.

    Klim makes no statements regarding this mesh. I have concerns regarding the abrasion protection of this mesh ... Particularly it's melting point. In I forget if nylon or polyestermesh has this problem.

    The pants look good, overall, nice to see leather inserts.

    Weak point of pant may be boot closure, difficult to tell how it will work with larger MX boots that many of use like a Sidi crossfire.

    Reflectivity, is something Klim struggles with, they use a good material, but not enough of it. The reflectivity areas need to be bigger and better placed.

    I will update this after I see this in person.

    My Mesh Klim Induction jacket, with mesh Mojave pants are off to Baja on Wed .... Wish I set of the new stuff to try out

    Scott
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  3. Ocho NA

    Ocho NA Been here awhile

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    I went ahead and purchased the kit (including the Enduro S4). I've been looking for a mesh suit (Texas) and this seems to fit the bill. It also doesn't get too cold so I wonder how far I can stretch the suit with the Enduro kit (plus some heated gear). Ships in February.

    @shrederscott makes a good point about Klim not making "statements" about this mesh. However, the impact zones seems to be padded enough. CE1 armor seems fine to me, but some might want to upgrade to CE2? I assume it should be possible?

    I will be pairing the jacket with some Klim Switchbacks for lazy riding/commuting, and the full set for my ADV trips.

    The only problem I have with the gear is color. I wanted to move away from black, but the grey one doesn't impress me and I almost like the green color for the Baja/Enduro but seems to me black is still the best for this suit. I like the blue accents.

    Here's Kyle Bradshaw's impressions:

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  4. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    I posted about this somewhere else, but this looks like the best mass market mesh suit - beating out the Revit options. Dynatec mesh is really beefy stuff, the superfabric they're using here looks about the same as on the Badlands which scored nearly 4s of abrasion resistance in MotoCAP's testing, the best of any textile tested, and the stretch areas seem to be the same 1000d Cordura based fabric that makes up the chassis of the Marrakesh jacket. About the only downside to it is not using LP2 armor for the price point. The waterproof shell is a bit $$, but honestly not terribly priced for a 4 way stretch laminated jacket made from c_change - and it has pit and rear vents - otherwise unheard of in motorcycle overshells. If you buy the jacket & shell, you're slightly higher price wise then a Rallye full price, but with much greater flexibility and abrasion resistance (although the Rallye does have better armor).

    Regarding reflectives, this jacket has tons - and it's mapped to present the profile of a human torso.
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  5. Ocho NA

    Ocho NA Been here awhile

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    Another reason why to get the black suits.
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  6. dragos

    dragos Master of disaster.

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    Looks like a worthy competitor to the Touratech Companero. It's basically Klim's version of that design, from a distance they even look the same in cut and layout. I'd still prefer some honest heavy duty material in abrasion areas instead of SuperFabric. I guess at some level of price they need to put SuperFabric so the suit looks "technical" enough.

    This would have had me very interested some time ago. Especially because of the large stretch panels, those would make it great offroad.

    But after a full season of dual-sporting with the Klim Dakar jacket, I'm no longer that interested in mesh for hot weather. The Dakar, with its huge vents that channel air, is cooler than mesh in very hot weather while not dehydrating you that much. The only time mesh would be better is very slow technical riding, when you need static evaporation. But then I'll take the sleeves off the Dakar or I'll be in a jersey.

    The waterproof oversuit is interesting. I had a chat with the Klim dealer in my area and he told me it's designed for durability (because this is in the end an adventure/expedition suit, not a dual-sport one). So kinda the same thing as with the Companero, it will take more space in the luggage than a basic rain shell I'd use for an afternoon ride (but not as much as the huge Companero oversuit, though... )
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  7. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    At this point the only thing I've seen test better then the specific superfabric Klim is using is leather, and layered fabrics using an aramid or similar technical fabric under layer. The Touratech/Stadler suits are way more $$ if you just want the protective parts (heck, the jacket is more in the US then the full Baja suit with waterproofs), are using a more technical GorePro outer (very bulky), and I have yet to see the Cordura Air/AFT material tested anywhere but based on the garment I have made using it I doubt it's even as abrasion resistant as Cordura 500. The Dynatec mesh is significantly stronger - on the Airflow jacket testing, the mesh segments appear to outperform the standard Dynatec areas.

    And heck, if you don't want to spend the money for the matching outers, you can grab just about any Goretex Packlite top/bottom (which will generally have bit zips) for ~$300 combined and wedge them in your pack with ease.
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  8. dragos

    dragos Master of disaster.

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    In Europe the Companero jacket is something like 70EUR more than the Klim Baja S4. (also the price you quote for US is the Companero jacket with the GTX overshell).

    Considering that it's coming with a complete set of Level 2 SasTec protectors, including a giant, full coverage back protector and a hydration backpack, the EU price seems fair to me.

    The Baja is more expensive in Europe (being an US import) and the Companero is more expensive in US (being an EU import).
    I'm sure Klim's superfabric tests well. In a real world crash, I'd prefer the Cordura 2000.
    There's quite a bit of pics around of Badlands with those great-testing SuperFabric patches simply ripped off in a crash.

    Anyway, I really like the suit (except the BS SuperFabric), it's well designed, nice materials and good price, even in EU (and since I would use it with separate armour, the crap protectors wouldn't matter anyway) and at some moment I would have bought it.
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  9. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    TBH, I would've preferred they just use some thin leather. I haven't seen any tests of the cordura 2000d (which isn't linearly stronger then 1000d), but the generic 1680d "ballistic nylon" tested to around half the abrasion resistance of Klim's superfabric (although I AM doing a bit of assumption that the patches they use on the S4 are the same as the Badlands which may not be true). THere's a cheap AUS market jacket that uses leather patches over the shoulders/elbows, and they were >6s abrasion, or 50% better then the superfabric.
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  10. dragos

    dragos Master of disaster.

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    This might get a bit off-topic, but for me the term "abrasion resistance", in isolation, means very little.
    There are materials (SuperFabric is the star here) that in tests that isolate one particular characteristic (the pure abrasion resistance) are doing amazingly well, but in real life scenarios are completely dependent on various factors (in case of SF, the underlying material which needs to stay together on impact if SF is to do its thing).
    I agree with you that leather (on street) or super-tough textiles (offroad), which both should offer tear resistance and abrasion resistance in the same material, are better.
    Plus, SF is less breathable.
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  11. spuh

    spuh Been here awhile

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    Agreed, real world "testing" quite often leads to different results than lab tests. But they're anecdotal. So we need lab tests for their standardisation. The best compromise I've seen is the Aerostich test involving dropping a fabric sample behind a moving pickup truck. I'd like to see someone repeat that test with today's range of available materials. Mosko Moto started doing that with their luggage prototypes but didn't continue the testing with their clothing line. Maybe an inmate here could pick up the torch?
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  12. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    You need to test more then individual fabric samples though. MotoCAP's testing regime looks like the best compromise we're going to get; they buy garments themselves off the shelf, test each fabric on the item (as long as they can get a large enough sample size) to failure, use the more realistic testing that approximates a 70mph impact, also assess material/seam burst/tear strength, and independently test the included protectors.
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  13. levain

    levain STILL Jim Williams Supporter

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    I have one of these jackets in my hot little hands if anyone has any questions. There's snow and ice on the ground here so it'll be awhile before I use it.

    In short, it's the type of jacket I've been waiting for someone to build. Most of the higher abrasion resistant jackets on the market have a ton of vents, pockets and a waterproof membrane. I don't want that. I want high abrasion resistance in a lightweight package. Mesh would not have been my first choice because of the dehydration factor, but vents are holes. In a riding suit. The one that is supposed to protect you, so tons of vents aren't an option for me either.

    This jacket is pretty badass. The fabrics are impressive, the fit is great, that green/orange is unique, but it's heavier than I'd like. This is the first Klim jacket I've ever tried that didn't have any odd fit issues. Collar is nice. The jacket top to bottom is proportioned well. Sleeve length is spot on. I'm a pretty standard 6'1", 195#, 43"chest with an IPA loving spare tire. Size L is perfect with enough room for my waterproof heated liner. Always, my first line of defense.

    The construction on this jacket is impressive. Too impressive IMHO. Maybe, if there was a manual to explain what the random pockets, zippers, elastic loops and holes in the liner are for? I think I have it figured out, but yeah. That's a lot of sewing and zippers I'll never use. I would've preferred they kept it simpler, gave us level 2 armor and dropped the price a bit. I'm only guessing the crazy construction and "features" like a pocket for a hydration pack that will put tremendous strain on ones neck, and the numerous "hidden" pockets lead to the high cost.

    This one is good boys and girls. Can't wait to ride in it. As usual, @Brtp4 is the drug dealer of choice for knowledge and service. If anyone has any specific questions, fire away.
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  14. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    Bet it’d be a lot lighter if you took the D3O out, I still think its the heaviest viscoelastic armor based on the last time I weighed the samples I had.

    Really tempted by teh Baja myself - as you said, it’s the mesh suit a lot of us had been looking for.
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  15. levain

    levain STILL Jim Williams Supporter

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    Maybe. I don't know. I just put level 1 d30, Forcefield Isolator and Knox micro lock on the scale. Not sure what the equivalent Level 2 D30 weighs, but it doesn't matter to me. I don't like it. I'll likely go with Knox Micro Lock in this cos its so damn comfortable no matter what the weather is. It'd be what? 200grams maybe? At that point, I'm ok with it. It's the overall comfort, over multiple temperatures, that the knox armor gives that is most important for me. The weight is in the complexity of the jacket. I don't think there's much that can be done about that. Still, I wouldn't call it a "heavy" jacket. I just wish it was lighter is all

    D30 -Level 1- 101g
    Isolator-Level 2 104g
    Knox-Level 2 134g
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  16. levain

    levain STILL Jim Williams Supporter

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    For anyone interested in the weight, this is with stock D30 backpad/shoulder, forcefield isolator in ONE arm and Knox Microlock in the other. I'm a couple beers in, so someone else can figure out that weighs with stock D30 elbows:lol3:drink

    IMG_20200229_181018.jpg IMG_20200229_181031.jpg
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  17. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    The back protector is the heavy part armor wise. I think it was straight up double the weight of the isolator level 2 one I had.

    Regardless, all that stretch should mean it’s pretty close fitting right? Weight nicely distributed throughout your torso?
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  18. levain

    levain STILL Jim Williams Supporter

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    Yeah. It's great. It seems to fit about the same with a tshirt, or my heated jacket. It's snugger for sure, but I can easily cross my arms comfortably and have plenty of movement. I even tried it with my Arc'teryx AR, which is my go to winter jacket from 20-60. It was bulkier, but not crazy. Sidenote-I don't know how Arc'teryx does it, but that is the most versatile piece of clothing I've ever owned. I just wore it on a windy 72f night in mexico two nights ago, got off a plane and cleaned 8" of snow off my car in a parking lot in comfort. It's an amazing piece for a guy like you:lol3:lol3:lol3:lol3:lol3:lol3
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  19. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    Ah yeah, those new monolithic insulations are great. I have a patagonia jacket using Toray's version of it (3DeFX+/Patagonia Fullrange), and it's fantastic. It doesn't really get that cold down here in VA, so I can't justify anything warmer though ;).
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  20. Madman4049

    Madman4049 Been here awhile

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    Got one on order in large gray, been wearing an induction for several years in large, hopefully the fit is about the same. Looking forward to the hydration bladder feature, means no backpack which is awesome. I have CE lvl 2 back protector from the induction that will go in it so a huge issue it comes with lvl 1. We shall see, I'm pretty picky about riding gear.
    #20