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KLR discontinued?

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Bama67, Sep 15, 2018.

  1. PittsDriver

    PittsDriver Fuse lit.... Supporter

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    I'd heard that the KLR650 was grandfathered in to some emissions regulations and that exemption expires with the 2018 model year. That's too bad. I've taken my KLR650 on the full TAT ride and many other ADV type rides hauling camping gear and kit for weeks on the go. I've never seen another bike that sucked so badly that would inexpensively and reliably take me and my stuff anywhere I wanted go whether it was 1,000 mile of interstate or the Alpine passes in Colorado or through flood waters nearly to the seat or just running errands around town.
    shinyribs, Adanac rider and atravlr like this.
  2. adam728

    adam728 Long timer

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    Absolutely not true. There's no grandfathering, and there's been no tightening of regulations since 2010. If I get on the computer later I'll post more detail. EPA test results and certifications are out there too.
  3. PittsDriver

    PittsDriver Fuse lit.... Supporter

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    Interesting. I'd love to see whatever information you can dig up. I heard that from someone that's usually a pretty reliable source of KLR knowledge. *shrug* However, it's not difficult to believe that even the yen 2 KLRs wouldn't pass emission inspections, especially the newer Euro regulations.
  4. Bell driver

    Bell driver Long timer

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    The KLR meets Euro1 emission specs. In July 2004 Euro2 specs came into effect, so the 2003 KLR650C was the last KLR in Europe.
    Euro3 followed in January 2007 only to be succeeded by Euro4 in January of 2017.
    Euro5 will follow in January 2021.

    Europe hasn't seen carburators since 2007.
  5. adam728

    adam728 Long timer

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    I should add, my comments apply only to the US.
  6. Cuttlefish

    Cuttlefish Riding to disappear.

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    [QUOTE
    Europe hasn't seen carburators since 2007.[/QUOTE]
    I have a KTM Freeride 250r 2014, 2 stroke with a carburetor. I believe they were sold in Europe. The KTM 2 stroke enduro bikes have only recently changed to efi.
  7. Bell driver

    Bell driver Long timer

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    The Freeride was derated to 7hp (yes, seven) to make it road legal. It's an offroader.
  8. CMS

    CMS Been here awhile

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    0r carbs, should be ABS and water cooled, I understand the real small bikes 50 c.c bikes are going away also. Doesn't really matter here but some counties depend on them. Emissions will ,and are changing everything. cms
  9. Oilhed

    Oilhed MarkF Supporter

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    What will happen in those countries that rely on cheap, small motorcycles & scooters? No more new ones. Used ones will get older, more problematic and more expensive. Just to satisfy a global emission standard. Or a sketchy gray market will sell non-compliant products.
  10. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    In the US all machines emissions are an avg max that must be meet by the corporation.

    Kawasaki is a performance company and right at the max. For new bikes to come in some must go out. This happened before with the old 250S.

    If the carb KLR motor did not change it could remain in the list as long as the max threshold was not surpassed. It was bumped for new machines.
    disconnected and caliform like this.
  11. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    KLR & DR are long gone from EU, my description is US regs only.
  12. Kyler

    Kyler Geezer

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    My experience with ABS on dual-sport and/or adventure bikes has not been good. It is ludicrous on off-road bikes. On street bikes, I can see the advantage but it should be an option or easily set to a default off position.
  13. adam728

    adam728 Long timer

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    While there are lots of games played, credits created and used, etc, the KLR is under the standard, and therefor didn't "cost" Kawasaki anything in terms of EPA credits to produce. the 2018 model scored a 0.5 HC+NOx (g/km), the corporate average must be under 0.8 g/km, and no bike is allowed to be over 5.0 g/km. Now, it also wasn't super clean (many bikes come in with numbers that are in the 0.1-0.2 range), so it wasn't buying them much for credits either.

    Test results can be found here - https://www.epa.gov/compliance-and-...ification-data-vehicles-engines-and-equipment under "Motorcycle, All Terrain, Utility, and Recreational Vehicles", and then the "Certified Highway Motorcycle Test Results Report Data (Model Years 2006 - Present)". Note, they screwed up some columns in this last update, hopefully it gets fixed. Right now the CO score is under HC+NOx, and the HC+NOx score is under the Tank Material column. I have many of these saved, and did a quick double check on a few older ones, including 2018's June update. All was well until this latest one. I simplified things down to this -

    KLR_Emissions.PNG
    A few things I found interesting:
    • I didn't know the bike was made in Thailand (never researched much on the KLR)
    • The stock bike has a catalyst element, and air injection. The XR650L just has air injection, the DR650 has neither (and BARELY squeeks by the standard)
    • I threw rated power on. 32 kW (at the crank) mean 42.9 hp. XR650L is at 40 hp, DR650 is 42.0 hp. Again, crankshaft ratings, so drop 15-18% for rear wheel measurements.
    • Most interesting to me, Kawasaki certified with a bike in 2008, and ran on that data for a decade. As long as there's no emissions-effecting changes you can do that.
    EPA emissions on motorcycles over 289cc became more strict in 2006 and again in 2010 (current CO = 12.0, HC+NOx = 0.8 g/km). Again, as far as I know there is nothing on the books for the next step, although rumors are bubbling that the US will slide in-line with Euro in the early 2020's. Nothing official yet, and they typically give 3 or more years notice so that the manufacturers can comply.

    The reason so many bikes are choked off, have catalytic convertors, etc? Typically so they can meet emissions in other markets. The US is pretty easy, really. Euro III standards for big bikes are much harder. Even China has tighter standards on bikes than the US.
    https://www.delphi.com/sites/defaul...tandards-passenger-cars-light-duty-2016-7.pdf

    • EPA - CO < 12.0 g/km, HC+NOx < 0.8 g/km
    • Euro III - CO < 2.0 g/km, HC < 0.3 g/km, NOx < 0.15 g/km (so comparaly HC+NOx < 0.45 g/km)
    So that's 1/6th the CO allowed, and about half the HC+NOx. The test drive cycles are different, but in my experience the same bike on both will score higher hydrocarbons and slightly higher CO under the Euro drive cycle than the US one.


    The point of all the ramblings? US emissions did not kill the KLR. It passed them easily, without burning company credits. It wasn't grandfathered. Used old test data yes, but was passing today's standards. If emissions is to be blamed it's because it couldn't meet them in other markets, lowered worldwide sales.

    And sales is what I believe killed the KLR. I don't know a good place to find US sales, but MCNews puts together excellent summaries for Australia, and the numbers are sad.
    MCNews 2017 sales.PNG

    The one set of numbers I saw for the US wasn't too much better. The DR650 is what I remember, and it was in the 600's for 2015(?) sales in the US. The KLR was a little behind, but I don't recall if that was 300, 500, or what. Add in the other markets it's available in (South America?) and frankly, I'm surprised companies even bother making motorcycles! No wonder everything new tries to meet standards worldwide.
    cyclopathic, shinyribs, 996DL and 3 others like this.
  14. Kyler

    Kyler Geezer

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    anyone know what the sales numbers are? My bet would be declining sales and it no longer generates the requisite profit.
  15. Bell driver

    Bell driver Long timer

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    Jack90210 and adam728 like this.
  16. Kyler

    Kyler Geezer

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    looks to me like that is the answer. Lack of sales.

    I had a love/hate relationship with my '00 KLR. I wouldn't go back but IMHO, no one is making a decent replacement in the 650 class.
  17. Grreatdog

    Grreatdog Long timer Supporter

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    Maybe Kawasaki is just suffering from the same issue hurting Harley Davidson: a market flooded with too many garage queen used bikes.

    This market isn't huge to begin with. But I still never see less than three KLR's on our local Naptown/Balto/DC Craigslist. That can't help new bike sales.
    The_Precious_Juice likes this.
  18. PittsDriver

    PittsDriver Fuse lit.... Supporter

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    Love/hate pretty much describes my feelings about my '14.5 KLR 650. Here's how I described the bike in my 2015 TAT ride report:

    I've been saying for 3 years that I'm going to get rid of it and replace it with a 250 enduro of some sort. But now I'm trying to decide if this winter I'll put the 685 kit in it refresh the suspension with the Cogent stuff. There's even an option to strip off all the fairings and instruments and put a very light weight replacement on it. I could easily put a couple grand into it and I just might because as Kyler said, there's nothing else out there quite like it. And it's got some sentimental attachment as well:

    [​IMG]
  19. twinrider

    twinrider Pass the catnip

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    Or a KTM!!!
    cyclopathic and Lesharoturbo like this.
  20. Adanac rider

    Adanac rider O.S.T.R. Supporter

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    Maybe they are doing what they did with the Klx 250 , They took a year or 2 off and came back with the fuel injected version . I mean whats the difference between the KLR and a Royal Enfield Himalayan ? I rode a Klr the other day on some steep logging spur roads . Sure do miss that torque .