ktm 500 stripped oil filter cover thread

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by mortaldemon, Mar 28, 2019.

  1. mortaldemon

    mortaldemon N0M4D1C

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    Hello. I did an oil change today and over torqued the oil filter cover thread. Upon backing out the bolt I noticed there was a loose spring coiled around the bolt??? I'm assuming the previous owner stripped the threads and threw a spring in there to snug it up? Now I'm not sure what to do. I applied loctite and was able to snug it by hand, but obviously want a more permanent solution. Should I use a helicoil? Is this something I should take to a shop to get done? Would a longer bolt work? This is on a 2012 ktm 500 exc. Any help appreciated. Thx! 20190328_165735 help.jpg
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  2. Lewilewi

    Lewilewi Ride it like you stole it......

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    Make inquiries about a helicopter or retaping one thread size up, and using a bigger Bolt...


    The spring you see is a helicoil
    Can you not reuse...


    As it's been stripped once already, make sure some one experience does this is if you bugger it up again it's gonna get expensive....


    Get a torque wrench on every thing in future,

    my be on this Bolt go lighter on the torque if it's a helicoil, possibly loc-tight it
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  3. shinyribs

    shinyribs Thumpers for life

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    It probably wasn't a helicoil that came out since that would leave too large of a hole for a bolt to go back in to and grasp any material at all. Often times when you accidentally pull the threads out of an alloy hole it can appear like a spring or coil of material wrapped around the fastener.

    If there's a bit of material left, and it sounds like it is, you could green loctite a stud in there and it'll be stronger than a bolt. Just an option if you want to avoid thread repair, though that's not really a hard job. Since you've got it glued back together for now,you won't have to worry about it until your next oil filter change. You've got time to pick up a helicoil kit and practice on some scrap before getting busy on your engine.
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  4. Fast1

    Fast1 Twisted Throttle

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    I would not use lock tite.. Go up one size using SAE sizing over the current metric size and tap it. You most likely will not need to do any drilling prior to tapping that way. Get the appropriate SAE bolt and you should be good. Get yourself a good accurate torque wrench and use it for all fasteners on your moto.
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  5. timeOday

    timeOday Long timer

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    I have done this to both of those screws on my Husaberg, the m5 tapped into the aluminum block is just so fragile.
    The only question is has it already been Helicoiled? According to this table you would drill a 5.2 mm hole to fit the helicoil. Does that drill bit already fit into that hole or not? (Hopefully not.)

    https://www.thorintl.com/Drill-Sizes-HeliCoils-Metric.shtml

    If you do a helicoil I suggest practicing in a block of wood first. It uses up an insert but it's worth practicing, it's all too easy to crossthread the coil into the new threads, or snap the tang off only partially by using too small a punch, etc.
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  6. mortaldemon

    mortaldemon N0M4D1C

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    20190329_090844.jpg
    Yes I believe it was the threads 0_o. I glanced over the torque specs and assumed all bolts had 11 ft lbs. I had already snugged them up so the leverage of the torque wrench just went through it like butter. Live and learn. thanks all.
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  7. shinyribs

    shinyribs Thumpers for life

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    99% of all stripped fasteners I see are torque wrench related. Either someone reads/ prints a torque spec wrong, or they use the wrench wrong. It happens when you just keep pulling on the wrench waiting for it to click vs feeling things for ourselves. Trust your hands, not a number. Torque wrenches are fine for critical components, but they are big, clumsy and offer no feel. A nice 1/4" ratchet and focused attention are all you need for most maintenance. 11lbs through a little 1/4" ratchet would've feel like you were obviously pulling on that little bolt very hard. The torque wrench masks that. JMO.
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  8. Fast1

    Fast1 Twisted Throttle

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    You do know there are quality 1/4" drive torque wrenches that only provide torque settings for less than 20 nm that are designed for light weight torque applications.
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  9. Fast1

    Fast1 Twisted Throttle

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    Filter cover bolts are 6 nm or about 4 lbs..

    You could easily tap that with the next size up from the current metric size with a SAE (american) thread. I've seen it done and have done it myself many times. If you feel some practice is beneficial, take striped out metric nut in the size of the filter cover fastener and practice a few times.
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  10. SRG

    SRG Long timer

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    Did the same thing to my Husaberg. I had not done a helicoil before, so I took it to a local indy shop. They did the repair in a few minutes. Don't be tempted to retap to a larger/different bolt, that's bush league. This isn't a KLR (I wouldn't do that to a KLR anyhow). The proper repair is a heliciol or sim.

    One thing to check once the repair is done - Measure the depth of the hole and compare it to the length of the bolt. Make sure that the bolt is not bottoming out in the hole. Mine was, by a fraction. We took a tiny bit off each bolt.
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  11. Fast1

    Fast1 Twisted Throttle

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    helicoil is optimum for higher toque applications not something that requires 6 nm torque.. now if it was a drain plug, head bolt, spark plug.. etc yes go with helicoil.

    Have you personally done a helicoil or re-tap? Just checking your experience level...
    You do know that they have to tap the hole first with threads to install the helicoil??

    The fastener was not bottoming out unless the OP was using the wrong fastener.

    How do you think the original threads got there that were stripped? maybe a tap?


    .
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  12. SRG

    SRG Long timer

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    Fast - slow down and read. No, I have not done a heilcoil, as I said above. That's why I took it to someone who has done it many times. The shop is 10 minutes from my house, they did it while I waited 20 min, charged me $20.

    I have used a tap and die many times

    I do not want mismached fasteners on my bike even if they are adequate for the job. SAE bolts on a metric bike = bush league.

    On my bike, a Husaberg, the (correct) bolts that secure the oil filter cover actually were a tiny bit long. Have you personally inspected them on a 70* Husaberg? Just checking your experience level.
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  13. Fast1

    Fast1 Twisted Throttle

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    We are talking his KTM 500 oil filter cap fasteners not your Husaberg. Just staying focused on the OP's issue.

    There is more risk to drilling the oil cap fastener hole to a larger diameter, then tapping the larger hole and inserting a metric helicoil than taking the existing hole and tapping it with a SAE thread and having a SAE fastener head. OP certainly can make that decision for himself. In fact if he fails on the SAE tapping procedure he can then move on to a helicoil if necessary and have a metric fastener head.

    "Bushcraft" starts when that helicoil backs out during later fastener removal due to poor installation.

    OP, remember only 6 nm on the oil cap fasteners. The owners manual on your 500 should list most if not all fastener torque. A torque wrench that measures only lower torque values is suitable for those low nm torque settings. Good luck on your fix.
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  14. mortaldemon

    mortaldemon N0M4D1C

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    TY I will try the SAE idea first.
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  15. shinyribs

    shinyribs Thumpers for life

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    Please don't. No offense to anyone, but this is horrible advice and I don't know why anyone consider offering this as a solution. There's nothing about a stripped M5 hole that matches up to any SAE thread. A stripped hole doesn't fit any fastener, and moving out of the metric system doesn't miraclously help. The only solution is a thread repair. The kits are readily available, simple to use, inexpensive and proven reliable. There's really no reason to start forcig random fasteners in there with the hope that it will somehow create a healthy thread on its way in.

    I'm really not trying to be rude about this, but this approach will only make things worse by chewing out more material, or wedging in and possibly creating a crack in the case. Please think long and hard about this before proceeding.
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  16. SRG

    SRG Long timer

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    ^^Someone gets it^^
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  17. nk14zp

    nk14zp Long timer

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    I have had good luck not using a drill but instead just the helicoil tap in aluminum. Only a 5 min job to helicoil it and use a stock bolt.
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  18. mortaldemon

    mortaldemon N0M4D1C

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    Well after an hour at the hardware store(s) I found that the 12-24 SAE measurement only comes in a coarse thread, not a fine thread like the m5x0.8 bolt. I ordered this helicoil kit https://www.amazon.com/Rocaris-Thread-M5-x0-8mmx1D-Compatible-Repairing/dp/B07F1DPZ7P/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

    Does this help the tap align better instead of drilling first??
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  19. Chadzu

    Chadzu Lost In Space

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    I have had to repair a few stripped holes in cases over the years. Mostly m6 on my stuff. I have found that the heli-coil kit is the way to go. you get the right size drill bit, the right sized tap, and the installation tool. Makes for a really nice repair and you keep stock hardware. The kit wasn't expensive and it had 6 coils in it. I hope that that is a lifetime supply for me.
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  20. shinyribs

    shinyribs Thumpers for life

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    I have always drilled with the included bit and never had a problem. Everything in those kits are specific to the kit and work together nicely. I have installed several hundred helicoils throughout the years with zero issues. When we'd buy new aluminum heads for the drag car engines we'd helicoil every bolt hole right off the bat (and head bolts for aluminum blocks). It's gonna come with the bit anyway, so it's not an additional cost. I don't see any reason to skip that step, personally.
    #20
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