KTM 950sm '06 - 1190sm-r project

Discussion in 'Dakar champion (950/990)' started by Ezhik, Feb 23, 2017.

  1. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
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    Moscow, Russia
    Yesterday i wrote my first post about this bike in LocuL's Ultra gravel-traveller topic and i didn't expect any interest about this information. It was a mistake, so i'm now starting my own thread (sorry LocuL).
    I bought my 950sm '06 (not sm-r) in april 2015, it was my dreambike for two years before.
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    This bike is crazy, you can go up to 230km/h and after it ride some stairs or jump bigairs - it seems to me that it's possibilities are endless, it's all up to you what you can do while riding it.
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    So i got fun for all the 2015 and spring of 2016. In July i killed my stock engine, and i can write a lot about trying to repair it, but that will be not very interesting.
    By that moment i've seen the "rc8r sm prototype" on youtube and i was inspired by this project.
    Guys have put complete rc8r engine inside the 950sm frame. That is great!

    But i don't like sportbike engines, i like maximum torque at low and middle rpm, and i like short supermoto gears - so it's clear that i must use the engine from 1190 adventure.
    And after it i've got an idea - i can use not just it's engine, it's interesting to get brakes with ABS, traction control, fork and shock with EDS, spoked wheels with TPMS - I decided to built complete 1190 adventure in supermoto style - as for me such a bike is my ideal.
    I spent some time and money while looking for necessary parts, but i got complete 1190adv engine, complete wiring harness with speedometer, all electronic units and injectors, wheels, brakes with ABS, fork and shock, swingarm,..
    So the project starts from here.
    The first thing was adapting the frame to new engine and swingarm.
    I found a workshop that engages in repair of frames after crashes, guys are very skilled.
    They cut out of the frame the swingarm bushings and placed them for nessesary width to put the 1190 adventure swingarm inside.
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    But there is no such free place in the frame, and i had to reduce the width of right arm of swingarm on 3mm.
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    After it they produced bended tubes near the rear cylinder head, so the engine fit inside the frame.
    Also they produced the engine brackets and moved the shock mount.
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    Then because of using new swingarm they moved the shock mount to the center of the frame.
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    While the frame was in progress i assembled the wheels. Front 17*3,5" and rear 17*5,5". Of cource with Outex.
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    More than that i knew that the stock 1190adv airbox will not fit under the fuel tank, so i bought powercellpermomance s3 airfilter kit with tuning velocity stacks and SAS delete kit, Scarichi silencers and Bazzaz control unit.
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    So the assembling of the bike has begun.
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    And here is the photo with original fuel tank and other plastic, complete bike must looks like this.
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    Here you can see how i cut the tail end to put ABS and control units inside. This is just the beginning.
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    In general i have two problems before i'll take the first ride on the bike.
    The first one is the fuel system. I have three ideas how to solve it. I can drill and cut the fuel tank and try to fit the adv1190 fuel pump inside, i can use fuel tank (and some other parts) from 990sm, and i can use external high pressure fuel pump with adjustable pressure regulator. I'm starting to buy parts for experiments.
    Here are two diagrams how i think to connect this parts. One is for 2-port pressure regulator, and another for 3-port. But it seems to me that both of them will work fine.
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    The second trouble is the exhaust. I want to save the geometry of stock 1190 collector, but after connection of both cylinders pipes it will pass inside the swingarm like 950sm exhaust. And then it will be separate again for 2 tubes and pass both sides of the shock to save the location of my two silencers, but there is very-very little free place inside the swingarm and between the swingarm and the shock.
    That's all for this time, good luck everyone
    #1
  2. Steffen_S

    Steffen_S n00b

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2017
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    #2
    micky1 and LocuL like this.
  3. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    Thanks for this information friend, i've never seen this bike before. In spite of this project is just a visual styling of 1190adv it is interesting and looks very good. Especially i like how its headlight is looking. Today i put mine on my bike and it was not so good because of the stock adventure front mask, it's too wide. I'll try without it
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    #3
    426john likes this.
  4. LocuL

    LocuL Gnarly Infantry

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    Hi and welcome.

    Don´t excuse anything. Your are doing it way better than i am. This will be one to follow.
    #4
  5. LocuL

    LocuL Gnarly Infantry

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    I assume you are using the cooler from the SM 950?
    #5
  6. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
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    Thanks ) yes and i'm not sure that it will be productive with 1190 engine, and i have no any free place in width to use bigger watercooler with my 950sm fueltank
    #6
  7. LocuL

    LocuL Gnarly Infantry

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    Well i´m sure it will be enough. If you just use a fan with the lowered water temp activation. 86 degrees i think. Someone might hit the right number.
    #7
  8. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    Thank you, i'm glad to know this. I'll look for that sensor.
    By the way i forgot to attach a photo of the fan mount panel. I had to cut it and move it upside for about 2cm. Otherwise the fans rest on the front cylinder head and push the watercooler towards to the front fender.
    #8
  9. alongat

    alongat Fesh Fesh

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    Use your favourite parts source to search for this: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Suzuki-03-08...fb108f&pid=100012&rk=3&rkt=12&sd=141448516905 - that is a Suzuki ltz 400 fan switch. It's the lower fan temp and bolts right into the KTM radiator. Most KTM aftermarket suppliers are at least double the price of the Suzuki switch for exactly the same thing.
    #9
  10. motoman250f

    motoman250f Been here awhile

    Joined:
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    819
    Ezhik, can you say what weight you gained with this transplant? do you know what the engine weight difference is alone? Thanks for sharing!
    #10
  11. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    Thanks a lot!

    Sorry, i don't know the total weight yet, but there is no doubt that it will be more heavy than original 950sm. Also i didn't measure the engines weight difference, but subjectively 1190 is heavier than complete 950 with oil tank for about 5kg
    #11
    motoman250f likes this.
  12. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    Well, as a russian good tradition i have two news - good one and bad one. Lets start with good. I found an intersting and elegant decision of the fuel system. I used an external fuel pump Bosch 0 580 464 038 with VAG fuel filter 6Q0 201 051 C. This fuel filter has an integral pressure regulator for 4.0 bar, and there is information that the normal pressure 3,8-4,2bar in the KTM specifications. The Bosch fuel pump is bigger than the stock one but it fits in the bracket on the fuel tank. As for the filter it seems to me that i have to put it in the front of the airbox.
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    And now the bad news. Yesterday i was very happy about the fuel system decision and immediately after its complete i started to lead the wiring harness to start the engine and make sure it's all ok wih the fuel pressure. When i connected the battery terminal i've dropped down a wrench. And one side fell to the battery terminal and another side touched the vehicle control unit, and it has metal case! Immidiately there appeared a strong spark.
    After it when i turned the key there is no any signs on the speedometer, there is no any sounds of the throttles. All the fuses are ok. It seems to me that i burned up the VCU. It was very-very-very stupid fail at the last winter day, it's a shame to tears.
    Now i will be very glad if smb knows how to diagnose where is the problem. I'm afraid that the problem might be not just in VCU, but in ECU, or EDS unit, or in speedometer,..
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    #12
  13. jhalfhide

    jhalfhide Been here awhile

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    Someone else was on another KTM forum about a week ago, saying they too had fried their clocks. Will try and find a link and see if they cured it.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    #13
  14. jhalfhide

    jhalfhide Been here awhile

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  15. JakesDad

    JakesDad Adventurer

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    Aug 8, 2016
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    Looks great Rooskie.
    Couple questions: Do you need to use the 1190 swing arm? Im looking to do this on a 950 adventure so things might be different there anyways.
    Is there a way to use carbs on the 1190 in an effort to use less electronics?
    Thanks for taking on this project so the rest of us can dream!
    #15
  16. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    Thank you very much, i've studied it.
    In addition to my last post, it's all ok with all the electronic control units. I'm a stupid idiot and didn't recognise that the connector of the starter relay fell down. So i continued with the fuel system and it seems to be ok with it - the engine have started, the fuel pressure is 4.05-4.1bar, there is no fuel pump error on the dash.

    I used the swingarm from 1190adv because of 3 reasons. The first and the most important - i wanted to use the shock with EDS from 1190adv, and it is longer than my stock one from 950sm for about 2cm. But the 1190adv's swingarm has lowered shock mount, so it allows to use shock from this bike without any changes of bike geometry.
    The second reason is that the swingarm from 1190adv is longer than 950sm's, so there will be less sudden wheelies and more acceleration.
    And the last reason - it is looking very cool, i like it :-)
    I have not thought about using carbs, but i think it is possible. Definitely the intake holes on the 1190 cylinders are much bigger than on 950 engine, and the distace between these holes is different.
    #16
    zzzak2 and Pete640 like this.
  17. wiseblood

    wiseblood Quid Quo Pro Supporter

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    :lurk
    #17
  18. wiseblood

    wiseblood Quid Quo Pro Supporter

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    How hard was it to get the new swingarm modified for the SM frame? Sounds like you needed to narrow it slightly (3mm). What else?
    #18
  19. Ezhik

    Ezhik KTM 1190 SM-R in progress

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Location:
    Moscow, Russia
    It is not simple. 950/990sm/se/adv frames have the same bushings on the same width. 1190adv swingarm is wider by about 2cm, i don't remember exactly. As for me it is impossible to reduce the swingarm width for all this distance, you must adapt the frame bushings. I moved apart these bushings as wide as it was possible, but it was not enough, the swingarm didn't fit inside, so i had to reduce it on 3mm.
    #19
  20. alongat

    alongat Fesh Fesh

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    And the lower shock mount is in a different spot (left to right perspective) compared to the 950/990 as well, right?
    #20