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Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by GreyThumper, Aug 22, 2018.
It will probably be half that price by the time it needs replacing.
Or 4 times the capacity.
By the time it needs replacing, new bikes may well come with batteries that are both those things. No guarantee it'll be backwards compatible though. It's just as likely that by then even finding a drop in replacement will be hard, and carry an inflated price to match that effort. It's not a knock against electrics, I'm sure the batteries are super reliable, but if repairability in 10 or more years is a concern for someone when buying a new bike, it is a potential problem.
Pick one. It's faster, it's cheaper, it has better brakes, it has higher quality suspension, depreciation is reasonably predicable, it can be used for a whole lot more than only commuting a few miles in traffic.
And I just feel compelled to reiterate, I'm not an electric bike hater. I just don't like pretending that the decision to buy one today is based on anything other than you think electric motorcycles are cool. Which is a good enough reason to buy any motorcycle. Let's just all be honest about it. Do you think Ewan and Charlie are doing it on electric motorcycles for any reason other than that?
I wouldn’t worry about the battery’s. Lot’s of good data on Tesla battery’s out well past 100k miles and it’s a 10-15% drop in charge, the battery’s will last the life of the vehicle. It’s using a different chemistry then cell phone battery’s which are designed for hour life at the expense of lifespan since they know you’ll replace the phone in 2-3 years. I remember getting asked this by people when I owned a Prius (had one for 12 years 200k miles) how I was stupid and would be replacing the battery pack in 5 years. The pack was fine when I sold it at 200k miles. That was the most reliable car I’ve ever had by far, one set of brake pads, one serpentine belt and oil changes with mid 40’s average mpg over the time I owned it. I called it the soul eating Prius for it’s shear thrill of driving, saved me a motorcycle in gas costs though (approx 13k dollars in fuel savings vs prior SUV).
The zero FX would make a mean commuter.
For other than commuting yes I would definitely look for something that has a thrill, although I’d argue plenty of thrills can be had on a z400. For commuting I’m definitely working off the spreadsheet since I’m looking to save cash and redirect it to other hobby’s or bikes. I’ve commuted quite a few miles by motorcycle and car’s are more cost effective unless you go small cc and lower consumables costs. The bikes that are exciting tend to cost way more in consumables and maintenance plus initial cost.
Used E bike would be fine too, hard to find like you said though. Really the only thing going against them is initial cost right now. They definitely have way more power and maintenance is amazing with them. It’s that 10k initial cost that bites hard vs even a new z400 at 5k.
I think the Livewire is more for someone with plenty of money who wants to take a quick trip around on the weekend. If we ever start to see charging stations that range could realistically increase. It would be cool to see chargers at popular moto destinations.
"It's faster" - false
"it's cheaper," - so is shit
"it has better brakes" - false
"it has higher quality suspension" - false
"depreciation is reasonably predicable" - so is Zero's
"it can be used for a whole lot more than only commuting a few miles in traffic." - did you fail to understand "range aside" part?
I think the long way up has already ignited a discussion about electric bikes and it hasn’t even aired yet. This will probably be mentioned as an objective in the first episode lol.
I am a dentist and buying a $30k bike isn't happening for me. That's a lot of money to spend on a toy! I'm intrigued by the possibility of electric vehicles but until the range/charge time/charging stations infrastructure gets to the point where traditional vehicles currently are, electric vehicles will be for commuting around a city only.
I own both, and the Zero is better in every way except charge time (range is identical). When I rode the FX for the first time, I didn't think "what can I buy with $10k", I said "I have got to find $10k to buy this bike" So far this year - 600 miles on the DRZ for long off road fun, 5000 miles on the Zero for everything else
Anything else makes boring tv
There are already companies that rebuild EV batteries. Each EV battery may be unique, but they're basically just cases to contain generic 18650 cells which are used in a wide range of everyday applications. A Tesla S has 7104 18650 cells in its "battery".
This is the guts of a Zero "battery".
EV enthusiasts make their own "batteries".
18650 is the size. There are lots of variations on the chemistry. Tesla 3 has a higher power density in each cell than the S or X for example.
For local availability it depends on ones location. Here in the Seattle area they are widely available. The interstate network at 70 mile intervals for long trips is already fairly well established.
Yes, my point is because of that they can be rebuilt or upgraded. One doesn't need to worry about a battery becoming NLA.
This is great for areas where there is population.
Ain’t gonna work on the Al-Can, Dempster or Dalton
And areas of population are where most people will be riding. Viability isn't determined by the 1 in 100,000 user.
Yeah. Your KLR is faster, depreciates less, has better brakes, and higher quality suspension than the Zero.
But you win on cheaper.
I've already seen Zero with milk crate luggage, so KLR may be a cheaper bike but it doesn't have a monopoly on cheaper riders :)
KLRs have been discontinued, that will lower demand for milk crates, and make them cheaper for cheap Zero riders.