Monster battery too much drain on charging system?

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by GearHeadGrrrl, May 8, 2018.

  1. Steve 1

    Steve 1 Adventurer

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    The only time it's unplugged is when I am riding it.
    #61
  2. fredintoon

    fredintoon n00b

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    Late to the game but here's what happens to my bike batteries in Saskatoon where it's too cold to ride from October to May.
    Overwintering my XS650's stock battery.
    Used to have a 12 step procedure that started with removal in fall, went through careful indoor nurturing and ended with recycling the dead battery next spring.
    Streamlined to a 2 step procedure. Remove & recycle in fall. Buy a new el-cheapo next spring.
    OTOH, the big ol' Canadian Tire truck battery in my XS11 sidecar rig gets taken indoors in the fall, connected to a low power smartcharger all winter and goes back in the rig next spring.
    It's lasted 6 years so far, now trying for 7.
    #62
  3. redfishguide

    redfishguide Old Dirt Biker Supporter

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    Hi Fred....welcome aboard....:wave

    Jack and Buck
    #63
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  4. BigFatAl

    BigFatAl Long timer

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    I have a backup in the sidecar that’s charged via a solar panel on the sidecar.
    IMG_5773.jpg
    #64
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  5. _cy_

    _cy_ Long timer

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    too funny .. better than an oil thread :D
    #65
  6. foxtrapper

    foxtrapper Long timer

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    Which is very important to understand. For this is indeed why many an oversized battery has killed the charging circuit.

    Spend the weekend or even a night using the battery to power lights and a sound system. Start the vehicle (car or bike). Now the charging system is working as hard as it can to recharge the battery. The battery is big, so the system works at full capacity for a long time. Things get hot, things break down.

    Give the battery time to start breaking down internally, as they all do. Minor shorts and such. Basically, it's a leaky bucket. Now the battery can start pulling harder on the charging system, even when it's topped up. Not hard for this battery, a few years down the road, to burn out the charging system because it's working so hard to keep this leaky battery charged.

    Nothing wrong with carrying and using a large battery. Just understand some of the things that can come with it.
    #66
  7. jfman

    jfman Long timer

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    I run a much bigger Harley battery on my Versys (not a rig)

    I like it but now my bike pulls to the right everytime I pass a bar.
    #67
  8. GearHeadGrrrl

    GearHeadGrrrl Long timer

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    BTW, the bike in question has a "total loss" charging system that dumps any excess current to ground... A lossy battery would perform the same "function".
    #68
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  9. Johann

    Johann Long timer

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    A total loss system would be a bike running straight off a battery with no alternator/stator in use at all. It would work fine with the obvious downside of limited range. I think it was common in some racing setups, it also gave the option of modifying the flywheel. I´ve known people put another battery in their topbox as an emergency get you home fix to workaround a dead stator when spares weren´t available.
    I couldn´t imagine doing it long term but if you have a spare battery in the chair it is at least another emergency fallback, probably good enough to get you to at least a populated area where you can get the problem permanently fixed. If you needed to you could potentially get a long way by planning regular stops where you know you could recharge.
    #69
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  10. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    upgrade the reg/rec to a 847!
    https://www.roadstercycle.com/
    #70
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  11. GearHeadGrrrl

    GearHeadGrrrl Long timer

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    After replacing BMW's poorly designed stator for the second time I installed one on my F800S, working well so far. From what I've seen (actually not seen) on the S10 forums it looks like Yamaha actually debugs their designs before they sell them, so the S10 doesn't need these aftermarket fixes.
    #71
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  12. rg sw wa.

    rg sw wa. Long timer Supporter

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    Help,
    My battery is dead / low in my car / motorcycle and it does not even click the solenoid. I get a jump start. Now the charging system supplies all the car / motorcycle systems electrical needs plus it’s recharging the battery. Never have I had a charging system component failure / problem. What am I missing ?
    #72
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  13. DRONE

    DRONE Dog Chauffeur

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    That other people's experiences do not mirror your own? :D

    Though I must admit that I'm in your camp. Never had any charging problems. But that doesn't devalue the problems that others have had.
    #73
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  14. Hookalatch

    Hookalatch Born Under Bad Sign

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    What are you missing? Well, riding old British bikes for one thing.
    #74
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  15. Ridn3

    Ridn3 Lopsidd

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    And I the same, but, if you look at the warranty on a new alternator, it states that it does not cover the "misuse" of not charging a dead battery before using the alternator.
    #75
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  16. Kruzof

    Kruzof independently poor

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    Charging a dead battery on my Ural would definitely be misuse because the [large] alternator is driven by the timing gears.
    Overstress those gears and it's suddenly teardown time.

    On my Honda with its small crank-driven alternator--not so much.
    So YMMV.
    #76
  17. joefriday49

    joefriday49 n00b

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    [QUOTE="Only question is, will that big battery overstress the charging system?[/QUOTE]

    So very many people do not completely understand the typical motorcycle charging system... Unless you ride something like a Goldwing which now has a massive alternator that looks like it belongs on an F-150 ford truck then our little stator/diode, regulators all work the same way... The magnets spin, the stator makes all the AC voltage and current it possibly can from whatever rotational speed it is given, then it is rectified and changed to DC... All this current is directed into the battery up until it reaches a preset voltage (usually 14.2 to 14.4 volts) then the regulator starts dumping the stator's output to ground. I know, sounds kinda drastic doesn't it, but that's the way they have always worked even before the Zener Diode and Thyristors were invented they used mechanical relays to accomplish the same thing.
    So the load your stator see's is basically constant. It puts out all it can all the time, any power that's needed to keep the battery at full charge goes there, what's left over goes up as heat in the regulator... Lets say you add a set of driving lights that draw 10 amps to your electrical system. This actually puts no more load on the stator when they are on, the regulator simply has to dump less to ground!...
    What actually fries regulator/diode packs on bikes is actually loose and corroded connections which produce a lot more heat than the zener diode/thyristor combination that is designed to prevent overcharging your battery...
    Learn more here: https://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/how-it-works-charging-system-fundamentals
    #77
  18. BMWBUD

    BMWBUD Should be old enough to be better.

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    ^^^^^^^

    Great first post. Welcome to the insanity.
    #78
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  19. Kruzof

    Kruzof independently poor

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    Not to split hairs but the load on the stator is only constant if the engine speed is constant.
    A perm-magnet alternator's output is more-or-less directly related to its speed of rotation.
    So hopefully the designer has sized the regulator to handle the alternator output at continuous maximum engine speed.
    More likely, it's somewhat smaller but adequate for most of us.

    Good call-out on the loose/corroded connection thing.
    My Honda had a particularly inadequate connector for the stator output.
    Luckily, I fixed it before it became incandescent.
    #79
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  20. nk14zp

    nk14zp Long timer

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    The caps in my amp are oil filled.
    #80
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