motorcycle salesmen—is it just ME??

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by sshbsn, Aug 1, 2019.

  1. borderlinebob

    borderlinebob Been here awhile

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    I’ve retired after over 50 years in retail sales. Automotive, ATV, motorcycles, marine, RV trailer, etc.

    In Canada, Ford very successfully runs their “Employees Price” sale every summer. It’s really a good deal generally and the negotiation is essentially taken out.
    However—-Here’s what happens
    New truck $65,000
    Employees Price discount. $5500
    Ford incentive rebate. $6500
    So $53,000 for the truck.
    Dealer now near rock bottom so offers true wholesale value on trade, say $20,000 so $33,000 difference for this deal.
    Customer insists he can get $25,000 to $30,000 for his trade elsewhere.:clap


    So show him this deal.....
    New truck $65000
    Trade in $31,000. (Higher than he said could get)
    Difference now $31,000.
    And a lot of customers like the big trade in better. :rilla

    So I still don’t know if customers want the no-haggle fixed price experience OR what, but since you offer no prize for correct guess I won’t try.:thumb

    I honestly believe most customers are really afraid they’re gonna pay more than someone else did as their biggest anxiety with the buying process.

    Man, I’m glad I’m retired.:drink
    The stories I could tell.
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  2. neanderthal

    neanderthal globeriding wannabe

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    "Mismanagement" is a technical way of saying GM didn't update the model(s) to remain competitive. And the market reacted accordingly. The Honda Civic and Toyota Corolla were always superior to whichever Saturn model they competed with and sold by the bucketload by comparison. That emperor was revealed to be wearing no clothes.
    To be fair, GM, Ford, and Chrysler back then, never really put much effort in their small cars and regularly put out trash. (thinking about it, I wouldn't want a singe car from any of them from the early/ mid nineties to about when the first Ford Fusion/ Cadillac CTS came, so mid aughties.)

    The truck offerings were better than the cars but not much, however, still very ... agricultural, as all trucks were back then. Gimme an 89 Toyota pickup, single cab 2 wheel drive, even today, and i'd take that in a heartbeat.
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  3. Tall Man

    Tall Man Clean up in Aisle 46.

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    Mrs. TM (who wasn't yet, at the time) wanted a Saturn. As my opinion (and she did ask) had some sway at the time, I advised her to get a Corolla or its badge-engineered twin, the Prizm. She did so, based on my view that Saturn's cars were neither competitive nor well-engineered.

    Prior to buying the Prizm, we visited the local Saturn dealership. Unbidden, the salesman took us into the Service area, where he proudly pointed out a newish Saturn on a lift, having its transmission replaced. He seemed to think that using that event as an example of the company taking care of its customers was a safe bet. It certainly kept my girlfriend's checkbook safe.

    I used to own a nicely equipped 1995 K1500. It was neither agricultural like its predecessors nor an overbaked large car like today's light truck offerings. To reproduce that same K1500 in 2019 would cost ~$45K. For a half ton. No thanks.
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  4. Clem Fandango

    Clem Fandango Been here awhile

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    What universe do you live in?
  5. Vistavette

    Vistavette Been here awhile

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    Whadda mean? Anybody who wants to can come in, pay sticker, and leave. Easy done deal. Prices are clearly posted on vehicles in the United States. Not always on motorcycles however. Of course, as an ex car salesman, I wouldn't recommend doing that, for most models. It can be done, and frankly, most of my happiest customers were the ones who just walked in, paid what we asked and left. Never heard from them again unless they wanted to buy another car or needed some kind of accessory, they were always the happiest with their purchases.
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  6. ddavidv

    ddavidv The reason we can't have nice things

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    Truth about the lackluster updating. True also about the competition you mention being better cars.
    But...
    My own mother-in-law purchased an SL2. The no-hassle pricing and US brand were what sold it. It wasn't a great car but it wasn't a bad car either. Never really had any problems with it.
    In my line of work I still encounter people who are driving SL's and SC's. Despite the falling headliners and Revell interiors they get truly upset when I total them.
    The same cannot be said of the later Aura or Ion models. Those were/are garbage. That was GM trying to live on with the reputation and owner loyalty they established with the first gen cars. And I've not met an owner yet who was upset when I sent their car to the crusher.
    Saturn as originally conceived was successful as a product and marketing study. How profitable it was I can't say. Had they stuck with the original game plan who knows...they may still be around today.
    I mean, VW manages to sell cars and their stuff is remarkably bad in most cases (and I say this owning a Jetta).
  7. A_Vasiliev

    A_Vasiliev Red, white and blue.

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    I've never bought a new bike, but I have bought parts and gear from various brick and mortar stores, so I have had to interact with salespeople in some manner (also worked as a salesman at a sporting goods store that sold outboard motors and scooters and ATVs for a very short time). The worst one recently was going to a store that sold MX boots, having tried on a few pairs at a different store, and getting some 16 year old kid who sullenly listened to me say that the Gaerne boots I was trying felt very stiff compared to the other ones I had tried and that my calves were going numb just trying to move my feet in a shifting/braking motion for a minute. He proceeded to say that the other boots I tried were garbage, that all motocross boots were supposed to be stiff as a plaster cast, and that because he wears the same Gaerne boots as I was trying on, they're fine and I should just buy them already.

    In the end I thanked him for his time and went back to the first store and got the Forma Terrains I tried on previously, that actually fit well and didn't feel restrictive and stiff.

    Not the first time I've had poor service from that particular store. The owner is apparently a good guy but he needs to reconsider who he hires because I'm not buying anything from there any time soon.
  8. Vistavette

    Vistavette Been here awhile

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    I sold VW's from 1993 to 2003 on and off. Love the way they drove and how solid they felt, but quality wasn't a strong point during those years. For example: they used some sort of plastic in the window guides that would crack in heat. I live in Las Vegas and the service drive was packed all summer long with cars whose windows had fallen down into the doors.
  9. neanderthal

    neanderthal globeriding wannabe

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    The interiors were awful! Mechanically they were ok, a gruff and not as polished as the Honda/ Nissan? Toyota equivalents. They definitely had better response/ torque due and pretty much every compact those days came with a four speed auto an an option over a 5 speed manual.

    But yeah, those interiors; you could tell where they'd cut all the pennies from.
  10. windmill

    windmill Long timer

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    Or not,
    I remember when my father tried to buy an advertised Nissan with nothing extra, cash, no trade in.
    He said it was the worst car buying experience he ever had. They kept him there hours trying to tack on extras, and complained bitterly they were loosing money on the deal. He finally had to complain to the general manager to make the purchase.
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  11. cwadej

    cwadej Keeper of the truth

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    I bought a bike in CA, to be titled in TX, as I'm only here for military.
    South Bay Motorsports in Chula Vista told me that the state required them to collect sales tax, unless the bike was loaded on a truck headed out of state.

    screw paying tax in 2 states on the same purchase
  12. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    I'd be willing to bet that's a lie.
  13. st3ryder

    st3ryder Long timer

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    I was always amazed by how so many buyers had no ability to look at not only the "difference" as opposed to the trade in allotment, but also the equipment list. I rarely actually had some customers come back to show me the car they bought for "less" only for me to point out that the car they bought was nowhere near the car I had showed them, i.e. missing *a lot* of options. Then I'd point out to them that they actually paid more for less. They only focused on the trade in, not the difference and certainly not the list of equipment. Some people are just not intellectually able to figure shit out, and they blame the salesperson for "making" them take their business elsewhere, and then brag about what a great deal they got "down the road". And I mean major options, like power seats/windows/locks, stereos, tinted glass, etc, stuff you'd think they'd easily be able to notice wasn't on the car. But hey, they got "more" for their trade.

    You were in the business for 50 years, (seriously, you deserve a medal) so maybe you remember the "go man go", Clint McGee out of Texas. Mannnn, his sales techniques were so hilarious but he swore they worked on the dumb f*$ks he had to deal with. He'd put people on what he called "balls", i.e. a high ball or a low ball, depending on how they perceived value. If a customer wanted a high trade in value, he give them a high ball estimate before they left the dealership, if they looked at the difference, he'd put them on a low ball. (If no trade, he'd put a price on the back of his card that was unrealistically low and tell them, "you won't be able to buy that car for this much", and then they'd go to another dealership and show the salesperson the card with the price on the back saying that was what they could buy the car for!!! lol..sure enough, nobody could match that price and then they'd come back for actual negotiations) Either way, he knew they'd never get either figure from any dealer, so that way they'd come back. Once back, then the real dealing would start, but the idea was that either client wanted to leave the dealership with *a figure they could shop*, so he felt he wasn't going to help another sales person make a sale, and I could see his point. Easy for somebody else to beat your "best deal" by a little more/less, so he made that less likely. Most of the bozos posting here have never had any experience selling motor vehicles, and don't have a clue what a pickle they'd put themselves by "arming" shoppers with a price they'll go looking to beat. Chances are salespeople who do that, will end up making a "you did!" call, when they make a follow up call, i.e. the customers bought a car within 48 hrs, using that salesperson's "best price" as a metric for a good deal.

    Want a deal? If you're ready to buy, and not shop, sit down, make a serious offer, and back it up with a down payment. Easy. ;-)
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  14. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    Don't know about you, but I typically shop before I buy.
    Every single time I've set foot on a dealers lot, I get latched onto by one or more sales peeps. I try to tell them I'll come see them when I'm ready to talk numbers, but 80% won't leave that alone. The ones that do are the ones I go back to.
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  15. st3ryder

    st3ryder Long timer

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    I shop too, but I don't put salespeople on the spot, demanding their "best price" when I'm still *just* shopping. I shop "silently" by observation and research, "just looking" or better yet, "just killing time". I never mention price/talk money and when I'm ready to buy, I take more into consideration than price alone.

    Like I said, you probably have only seen sales from 1 side. I can tell you from experience, there's a ton of "shoppers" who never buy and do nothing but waste a salesperson's time talking smack.

    "Latched on to", not "served"? I can see you are biased.
  16. ozmoses

    ozmoses persona non grata

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    That's a lot of werdz! But yes, this^^ is the way to avoid all the bullshit inherent in purchasing a vehicle.


    However, I have sat down with a salesperson and said the following :

    "I am done shopping and am ready to buy."

    No reaction other than stunned silence. Nada.Zero.Zilch.

    The customer is not always the problem.
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  17. cwadej

    cwadej Keeper of the truth

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    Seeing how it's CA, I didn't doubt it too much. The bike left the dealer on a truck with a bill of lading for TX.
  18. st3ryder

    st3ryder Long timer

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    True. I could tell you stories of really great customers too, I had plenty, in fact the majority, but the thread was started with malice by a customer bashing salespeople, who aren't always the problem either.

    We help create our experiences and for those who've had *nothing but* bad experiences when making motor vehicle purchases, I suggest they are the problem, because no matter where you go, there *you* are. :-)
  19. lifeofliberty

    lifeofliberty If you're bored, you're not living

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    Hmmm. I posted my dealer experience in the Spokane thread here many months ago and was almost instantly banned for whatever knee-jerk time the idiot mod had decided was fair punishment for daring to have the gall to share it. I've never been back to the thread since (I hate fascists and frauds, even if they ride) - but will very likely never buy a bike new or used from a Spokane dealer. Seems like they don't like any kind of publicity.

    Good dealers are hard to come by, and good salesmen even harder. I don't know why that is, but it seems to be a common enough complaint. I am up front with a salesperson - I'll tell them if I'm just there to look, or if I'm actually ready to buy (cash in hand), but all too often, they don't seem to like the honesty. I can't tell you how many times I've left with my money in my pocket, but it's not just motorcycle shops, it was the same with other large ticket items like cars and trucks. Eventually, I did find a truck dealer I liked and bought a new Jeep. They treated me with respect, knew their product, didn't push anything and didn't waste any of my time. I wish they sold motorcycles.
  20. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    Really? Can you? What do you call it when you have to tell a sales dood multiple times that you're just looking and don't need any help right now, but he takes it upon himself to see if you *REALLY* don't need his help 3 or 4 or 5 times in under 30 minutes? That's not service; that's full-on pestering.
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