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motorcycle salesmen—is it just ME??

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by sshbsn, Aug 1, 2019.

  1. sshbsn

    sshbsn Been here awhile

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    I don’t know what I was thinking when I started this thread—just wanted to vent I guess. I had wanted a new bike again, and was disappointed the buying process has become revulsive.

    I wish now, though, that I hadn’t said anything about it. We all know that the sales profession is designed to exchange goods or services for hard earned cash. I just wish our local salespeople were better at it, but it’s not really THIS big of a deal.
    Electrical likes this.
  2. dietDrThunder

    dietDrThunder Why so serious, son? Supporter

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    Look on the bright side: you got an answer to your question. It isn't just you :)
  3. DR Donk

    DR Donk Been here awhile

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    To late! You've opened Pandora's box! :augie
  4. mitchxout

    mitchxout Long timer

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    I've gone into dealerships with the intentions of buying until the salesperson soured me on the whole process. It's not just you.
    Vistavette likes this.
  5. VX Rider

    VX Rider Long timer

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    As am outside observer
    The defensiveness shown by and for the sales profession...insteaf of seeing room to improve they are happy to justify crappy practices and blame the consumer.

    In short they are missing the opportunity to improve.
  6. st3ryder

    st3ryder Long timer

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    More swill from "victimized buyers" buyers.

    It's not venom, it's called a "reality check", but I can see how in your state of victim hood, you would see a description of some customers as venom.

    But, you don't see any "venom" going the other way? LOL YOU started this thread, but can't take criticism coming back your way.

    Grow up and take responsibility. No one is forcing you to buy anything from anybody at any time.

    And what about private sales? Owners are all angelic, truthful, model sales people? LOL.... how many "horror" stories of PO's can we post too.

    But it all comes down to buyer beware, like it or not, for everybody all the time.

    And for your information I'm not in sales anymore, because people are such twats I don't want to deal with them anymore when my livelihood is on the line.

    And more information about me: I buy things that I want. Nobody sells me anything. They are just my purchase facilitators. But then again, I have a mind of my own, and free will.

    Maybe you and all others who want to blame sales people for the way they feel or for what they buy, don't
    eight90eight, jefmad and husky390 like this.
  7. windmill

    windmill Long timer

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    I'm in Washington, the dealer is in Oregon. Apparently neither state has any restriction on providing the MSO to the customer.

    Businesses are required to keep records of many transactions. I'm unaware of any other that inflates it hundreds of times its actual cost, and makes it a negotiable billed service. The doc fees many dealers charge are often more than what we charge in total on the transactions we're required to keep records of in the transportation industry.

    I purchased from an out of state dealer because they have a good reputation, and fair prices.
    I specified what I wanted, they quoted price, I paid in full, they ordered it, they mailed me the MSO when they received it, I went to the DOL to do tax title and licence which was no more complicated than transferring title on a private sale, I walked out with my plate and registration, they mailed title. When the bike was delivered locally I attached the plate and went for a ride.

    Other than stopping at the DOL for 20 minutes while running errands, the entire transaction was done from the comfort of home by e-mail.
    Eatmore Mudd likes this.
  8. Patek

    Patek Long timer

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    What's with the interjected "LOL" here and there? A bit confusing or are you actually laughing out loud and want people to know?
  9. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    I'm not going to get swindled by a sales monkey BECAUSE I do my research and know what I'm willing to pay. If they can get close to that number by whatever method they want, then we'll make a deal. If they are constantly throwing up smoke and mirrors and refuse to give me a concrete number, then they're wasting my time. They're wasting their own too, but that's not my concern.
    When some twatwaffle - be it a sales monkey or anyone else - decides for whatever reason that my time has no value, then we're done.
  10. sshbsn

    sshbsn Been here awhile

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    st3ryder, you may have retired but you kept a modern salesmans deaf ears and lack of insight. i never said i was a victim, i said i wont support your industry’s sleazy methods with my money.

    you are the perfect sample of what i ran into down here: arrogant, entitled, and disrespectful of any perspective that differs from your own. i will keep my cash, and you can keep your current lack of sales job. isnt THAT the basic and final economics of all this?
    DirtMedic likes this.
  11. windmill

    windmill Long timer

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    Vehicle dealers know what they have to charge for a product to make a profit, and be competitive just like any other business, but the industry has worked hard to keep it a shell game.
    husky390 likes this.
  12. Navy Chief

    Navy Chief Long timer

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    Yep and the game is rigged to ensure that they have tools to maximize profit on each and every sale, there is no reason on earth that if you and I walk into a dealer to purchase a bike that we should not leave paying exactly the same for it (excluding discounts from organization affiliations). However the industry has worked hard to ensure that that does not happen and they can determine the price of a bike or car on a case by case basis based on what they think they can take a customer for.
    DirtMedic and Clem Fandango like this.
  13. klaviator

    klaviator Long timer Supporter

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    I was a salesman for a while and a customer for much longer. There are assholes as well as great people on both sides of the counter. I know there are many salesmen, and dealerships that are very deceptive and trying to get all the money they can out of you. There are also salesmen and dealerships that are honest and keep the buying experience pleasant and straight forward. I choose to buy from the good dealers and have had nothing but pleasant buying experiences for at least the last 20 years.


    People often put a lot of effort into researching which motorcycle they should buy. Maybe putting some time into researching the dealer they buy from might be time well spent. I am lucky enough to have a great Yamaha/Kawasaki/Royal Enfield/Genuine dealer nearby. I have bought 2 bikes from them and may buy another soon. If I wanted a Honda or Suzuki I would have to deal with the big box, crappy reputation dealer in town or research dealers out of town. I'd consider buying from the dealer in town but would be prepared to walk away if they tried to pull shit on me.

    Regardless, you have to walk into a dealer prepared. If you don't then you shouldn't be surprised if you have a crappy experience.
    JRowland and husky390 like this.
  14. Vistavette

    Vistavette Been here awhile

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    Well, in theory that sounds great, but it's not realistic. when a dealer has an aged unit he can't move in his market, he shouldn't be allowed to lower the price to get it off his floor? Or perhaps the trade is something he really wants...or doesn't want, so the numbers need to be worked a bit. Or the customer owes too much, or his credit isn't great, so they work on the price to get the deal done... When the dealer has unit that has more appeal, should that dealership be forced to sell it at a pre-determined price which is lower than the market would normally demand? What happens when the factory puts an incentive on a bike and you bought one 3 weeks ago, do you expect a refund?
  15. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    There are a lot of situations where the customer got taken.
    There are a lot of situations where the customer got a good deal and both sides were happy.
    There are zero situations where the dealer got taken.

    Sales apologists, comment on that.
    sixspeed likes this.
  16. JRowland

    JRowland reaching for the sky Supporter

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    Not a sales apologist, but that comment isn’t true. Maybe mostly true on a new vehicle (no trade situation). They call trades wrong all the time (miss damage, mechanical issues, etc.). Also the used market is cyclical and also subject to localized events (floods, hurricanes, etc.) that can sway the market temporarily away from the cyclical trend. What a used vehicle is worth one month can vary sometimes drastically the next month. If they hit it high and the market drops they lose. All dealers lose monthly on trades, all of them. I don’t mean they lose overall, but they lose on some. Also when a dealer has a great new month and takes a bunch of trades they must pay off a lot of those trades as well which leads to a cash shortage so they fire sale them at the block to avoid not being able to pay the manufacturer (who want paid almost immediately after sale). It’s not all roses and big wins for them by any means.

    This of course should have nothing to do with how customers are treated. It’s a service industry, even though they all don’t act that way. A customer in any retail establishment can be a complete douchebag, it doesn’t mean that as a service provider it’s a good idea to give what you get. It’s part of the gig, suck it up and swallow your pride or find another line of work. Unless, like I stated earlier, the owner lets that shit attitude fester.
    husky390 likes this.
  17. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    I stand by my statement. I was mainly referring to new bikes, but if the dealer lost money by being stupid on a used bike, it's not at all because the customer outwitted or took advantage of him. The dealer brought it on themselves.

    As far as trades go, friends in the business tell me they average about 50% margin on used bikes. They would far prefer to sell used bikes.

    Of course the margin on parts, gear, accessories and especially labor is where they make more money and if they'd treat the customer right on the front end, they'd make tons more after the sale.
  18. husky390

    husky390 Long timer

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    Taken? Is it the dealers fault the customer didn’t do their homework and bought on emotion? I don’t think so.

    Most retail margins start at 50%. If its a hot item, retailers charge more. What do expect dealers to do? Give these bikes away at cost?

    Again, no one’s holding a gun to your head to buy a toy. You as the consumer have the power to walk away if you don’t like the deal.
  19. wb57

    wb57 Long timer

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    You completely missed the point. And new bike margins are nowhere near 50%.
    3sum likes this.
  20. Navy Chief

    Navy Chief Long timer

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    You missed my point, if you and I were to walk into a dealer on the same day to buy the same bike with the same basic financial qualifications we would in all probability leave paying different amounts for that bike based on how much the dealer thought they could milk out of each one of us. It is a bullshit game and has nothing to do with taking care of their customers or building a relationship, it is about profit. There are dealers that seem to work to build relationships but they by far the exception to the rule.
    Vistavette likes this.