My personal Adventure copying Odyssey...

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by meat popsicle, Feb 12, 2008.

  1. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    HERE

    Well it was past time for me to do some maintenance work on my suspension. I have been a bit schizoid over the past 1.5 years, but I think I am recovered enough to dismantle my bike in the old sway-back “barn” behind the house:
    [​IMG]

    A rustic skylight provides lighting:
    [​IMG]

    There was some plywood propped up to one side so I laid it down for flooring. I didn’t want to do this over dirt and not be out on an adventure. Here is a shot of the work area; notice the shelving off to one side that would be a great area to lay stuff out if it wasn’t disintegrating (also see the background of next pic):
    [​IMG]

    I had to get a stand to work on both the forks and shock/swingarm at the same time. This Rino stand is working out well in some ways and not well in others. It is simple, cost ~$125, rated to 500lbs, and if you lower the Rino with the bike’s centerstand down it props up my baby’s backside:

    [​IMG]

    Makes it real easy to work on the rear suspension, just make sure the Rino’s foot pedal is not pushing on the spin-on oil filter. But when I had removed the forks I found there was nothing to stop the bike from rocking forwards, I think because the engine sits forward of the frame’s flat bottom. I found a solution for this (see below).

    Before I get into the suspension just one little note - I had some minor spills in Tennessee, where I found out rutted and dried clay will dump ya without warning on your ear:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Déjà vu… I didn’t expect a thing before they happened, even the second time when there wasn’t any grass covering the ruts. Well I wised up and paid attention to my line after that. Anyways I didn’t know this happened until I started disassembling:

    [​IMG]

    I’ll try to repair it and see if it holds. Ok, back to suspension maintenance. So I started at the stern because I wanted to get my shock off to Rob at Infinity Machine & Design for service and upgrades, which brings up the fact that I am finally getting my suspension tuned! The stock spring will be replaced with an 8.0 (I am 200lbs) and Rob will revalve it. While I am on the subject of upgrades, during fork servicing I will be replacing the stock fork springs with some 0.50 springs courtesy of KTMnate :beer, and installing Infinity Machine & Design subtanks up front. The only thing I will be missing is a revalve up front, but who wants to be perfect?

    More to come...
    #1
  2. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    To get ready to work on my bike’s backside, I re-familiarized myself with creeper’s guide to servicing your rear. After reading it several times, and getting the feeling I am completely unprepared to do it, I finally launched into it. While breaking some of the linkage bolts free was tough I found the process and the linkage itself to be completely unimposing:

    [​IMG]

    Remove rear wheel, remove linkage and swingarm, remove shock. Not bad actually, but I do not want to disassemble the linkage. So I tried to grease it via the zerk with my 10-buck hand gun – yeah right. My plan is to take it to a bearing shop and see if they can zap it for me. The movement seems fine on the bearings but it is (past) time to re-grease it. The movements of my swingarm bearings also seem fine, but the needle bearings for my dog bones look terrible:

    [​IMG]

    Bone dry. And just look what those grease-free rusty needles did to the dog bones’ shaft:

    [​IMG]

    Damn… well, there are some replacement parts needed. I was hoping to not have much of this, but it has obviously been too long (for insight into why these look worse than the others see HERE). :bluduh Replacements ordered and this section is on hold until I get them, a trip to the bearing shop completed, and my shock back from Infinity.

    Onto the front.
    #2
  3. SpringOly

    SpringOly Old Swede

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    :lurk
    #3
  4. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    Might as well see what’s going on up front. Off come the forks, but not easily. My triple clamps still held the forks strongly even with the triple clamps loosened, so I had to pry in a little bit of something to keep them spread so I could slide out the forks! Oh, and don’t forget: it is easiest to loosen the fork caps by using the lower triple clamp to hold them; just loosen the upper so it’s not pinching the threads. I probably should reverse those tips in a how-to… note there is no link in this section to a How-To Thread.

    [​IMG]

    One last out of order item: I found it easiest to dismount the handlebars so I could use my ratchet to access the fork caps, but if you have a 24mm spanner you can leave your handlebars in place (until you start working on the steering head). While I was taking the forks off I didn’t find the bike stable on the Rino stand. Swaying port/starboard was not a problem, but the bike wanted to rock fore/aft. Even with the stand down so the bike’s leaning from the centerstand onto the lowered Rino she would simply fall forward. Without the forks to stop it tragedy would have come into the sway-back barn, so I used a bungee cord to stop this and it seems to work well. I can shove the bike to rock her forward and she will simply rock back. Here is a close-up:

    [​IMG]

    OK, so I finished opening the fork caps and then simply inverted them over my oil drain pan and let them drain themselves. I gave them a few pumps every now and again but I am not sure this is completely necessary when you leave them upside-down overnight :dunno The fluid was beautiful; why am I doing this? Oh yeah, because it's time. Now onto more disassembly; I then completely removed the fork caps. Infinity Machine & Design has a very pimpin’ wrench designed to fit on the lower nut, which is on the inner fork, where you would hold it to detach the fork cap.

    [​IMG]

    And it matches my fork oil :tb So you pull down the spring to expose the lower nut (that holds the fork internals so you can unscrew the fork cap) and stick Rob’s sexy wrench here:

    [​IMG]

    Put your wrench on the fork cap and keep turning it until the cap comes off. Mine stuck at one point when I was using my fingers and I had to go back to using a wrench. Once the fork cap comes off you can stow it and any plastic spanners that were between it and the spring. You spring will now come off, and it was now that I found out the free .50’s I was given do not fit. They are ~5mm smaller on the ID (and ~30mm longer). They won’t go over the hydraulic stop. :cry

    Sidebar: trying to solve this mini-dilemma. So I call up Race Tech who says that is not the right spring, but since it was not bought directly from them it must go back to the retailer. Well that one is not where I live, the springs were bought long ago (from a shop with a Parts Unlimited account but really only do tires), and – screw it – I would spend more time and effort trying to get them swapped out than the correct springs would cost me. I got in touch with Super Plush, a local suspension shop that deals with KTMs, and they are helping me out. I like supporting the local small businesses anyways.

    Now I need to find out what uses these springs so I can sell them off (~28mm ID 33mm OD x 515mm length). So I pause my fork work and get onto the steering head bearings.

    [​IMG]
    #4
  5. Laromonster

    Laromonster Lean, mean pacifist machine

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    Good stuff :getiton
    #5
  6. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    Since fork work has stagnated, let me get along with LaramieLC4’s steering head bearing guide. It worked for me, and to my surprise I found a beautifully greased set of bearings and clean perfection inside.

    [​IMG]

    Yay. I haven’t wiped it down yet; those marks are grease. The only thing I found up front amiss was the steering head cap pinched and bent a bit on one part:

    [​IMG]

    I straightened it as best I could with some pliers. Let me know if you think I should replace it. Not sure what caused it in the first place. :dunno I am trying to minimize the amount of disassembly, so as you can see I am leaving things laying about partially attached:

    [​IMG]

    I need to clean and lube the bearings, but I am not a bearing wiz so I looked up some info on the web:

    Bearing maintenance info:
    http://www.bonesbearings.com/gap/maintenance.html
    http://web.skatefaq.com:81/bearings.html
    http://www.silverfishlongboarding.com/Articles/Longboarding_101/How_to_CleanMaintain_Bearings/
    http://www.mso.anu.edu.au/gsaoi/documentation/sdns/sdn03.10.htm

    Didn’t find anything motorcycle specific but the skate crowd has some. I think there is enough info for me to go about my business. I am just now sourcing a solvent and will get back at this shortly. More updates when I make some progress. Here is where I stand currently:

    1) Shock – on its way to Infinity Machine & Design; I should see it in a few weeks.
    2) Linkage/Swingarm – I will take to a bearing shop to have them try the zerk (not sure about what to do if they fail); I am awaiting replacement bearings and seals for the dog bones. Oh, and I am deciding what to do with the swingarm bearings – I really don’t want to disassemble them so perhaps I will ask the bearing shop to grease them too… :augie
    3) Forks - waiting for upgrade springs (will go with 0.52 since I am buying); I will be drilling and taping the fork caps for the Infinity subtanks, which is documented by creeper HERE.
    4) Steering Head – sourcing a solvent for cleaning before greasing and reassembly. EDIT: here is what I am thinking for cleaning products: primary soak in odorless mineral spirits and a rinse with 99% isopropyl alcohol.

    I think that’s it, besides a few other minor maintenance items. See y’all in a few.
    #6
  7. Luke

    Luke GPoET&P

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    C'mon, man, you're most of the way there already. How many miles on the bike? After 20k the shims in my midvalve were distorted. At 10k they were ok. The '03 shims work harder than mine ('02), so you might want to have a look to see what condition they're in.
    #7
  8. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    I knew I'd get taxed for a few things in my posts... I am at 10K, but as I said above I am shying away from disassembly due to conditions. With the replacement parts, and fork springs, my budget on this is already in the red. I will be talking with Super Plush, maybe I will have him do a revalve while I am up there picking up fork springs. But at $250+ I, well, doubt it right now. You probably want me to do it myself eh? :wink:
    #8
  9. Luke

    Luke GPoET&P

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    Fair 'nuff. It's maybe a day of work and $50 to revalve, but you have to be clean when putting the shims back together.

    I may be a militant doityerselfer but the Superplush suspension is niiiiice.
    #9
  10. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    half a C-note's not bad and I can make time, but clean, well maybe I could do the work on the back deck. Thanks for the inspiration Luke, and since I haven't said it before, thank you for your efforts helping everyone here - especially electrical stuff. Did you search the index for "Luke" yet? :D
    #10
  11. Luke

    Luke GPoET&P

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    Ha! You're this far into it, what's a little more?

    How about working in the kitchen?

    :hide



    I just lay paper towels out on a table in my carport for a workspace, and douse each shim with cleaner when re-assembling them. Invisible grit makes the shims crunchy but the solvent gets it all off.

    The hardest/riskiest part of the job is getting the shims off, as the bolt threads are peened from the factory. It takes a dremel and patience.



    I did see the index thread. Thanks, and nice work keeping track of everything!
    #11
  12. Odysseus

    Odysseus Stoic Philosopher

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    Meat, you are in danger of being kicked out of the "cheap bastards" club. First you buy the stock KTM folding mirrors, and now some slick Infinity Machine fork wrench.

    This is a proper fork wrench:
    [​IMG]


    :lol3

    Good job, I'm realling enjoying it so far! :thumb
    #12
  13. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    Ah, a dremel. Always wanted one, so that would be a new purchase. Sounds like the revalve job is not easy either. I'd better go look through the threads on it to see what's up before I think too long about it. But I will have good solvents about (see my edits above).

    How do KTM owners get into the CBC? And my folding mirrors are NOT KTM parts. They may have come from the same factory but mine were $13 - for the set - off eBay. Marked as some random Italian brand.

    Rob made me a good deal on the subtanks and I was curious to see what he had come up with... it's a pretty piece of 'luminum man - cut me some slack. And remember, I am the fella who thinks its odd trying to save $10/year using ATF instead of proper fork oil, which wouldn't match Rob's pretty wrench either! :rofl

    Yours is special too Ody. :smooch
    #13
  14. Luke

    Luke GPoET&P

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    Mmmmmmmmm.....solvents. :choppa


    Unless you have real skill with a file, the dremel is the way to go.


    If you want, I think I have another CBC application lying around. Put together a luggage rack out of something you find in that barn and you're a shoe-in.
    #14
  15. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    Well, I couldn't come up with 99% isopropyl - 91% will have to do. I am not going to soak it in the isopropyl anyways, so it could promote rust, it is just used to help rinse off anything left after the 100% odorless mineral spirits do their job during the soak. The technical link I posted above used acetone for the soak before an isopropyl rinse, but mineral spirits should work too. You can get both from big-box hardware stores, but not the isopropyl (damn it).

    Now if only I can figure out how to remove the lower steering head bearing so I can soak it... :scratch

    I wouldn't characterize my skills with a file as real; more tending towards imaginary :D

    There is lots of crap about, and once we dig up the garden area for planting there should be lots more... I'll get back to you on the CBC app.
    #15
  16. Luke

    Luke GPoET&P

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    You can't get pure alcohol in this state. Something about real hash importers not wanting any competition from ghetto-hash makers.
    I had a hippie neighbor who goes to Oregon to get Everclear for making herbal medicines.
    #16
  17. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    The Orchard Supply guy says, "Isopropyl is a non-toxic solvent; we only sell toxic solvents." using comedian Stephen Wright's delivery:

    <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XYffXv7jMYQ&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XYffXv7jMYQ&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

    Ooooooo, Everclear. It's been a long time. That stuff mixed so well. My favorite was spiking lemonade. If I remember correctly they wouldn't sell it in Washington, so trips to Idaho included Everclear pickups. Except on Sundays... :doh
    #17
  18. Allgo

    Allgo No Whammy,No Whammy,STOP!

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    Hey Meat ,

    When you pulled the links (dogbones) did you notice any lateral play in the shaft ? In other words, a gap between the inside of the connecting links and the frame. I pulled mine apart tonight since I had everything alse torn off already and I saw the pictures of yours :eek1 . Caca. If I pull the shaft all the way to one side there is about a 6mm gap. In the parts diagram it shows part # 51 as being a shaft sealing ring. I can see some sort of black ring on the edge of the needle bearings but is there supposed to be a spacer in there taking up the slack ?

    Chris
    #18
  19. meat popsicle

    meat popsicle Ignostic

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    Sorry Chris, I don't recall any lateral play, but I am pretty sure I did not specifically check for that... still learning.

    As far as I know that assembly has two bearings (side by side) and two sealing rings (one on each side). I don't think there is a spacer, which brings up the question: where did your 6mm gap come from? Maybe your fasteners are not completely seated and torqued? (Are you using aftermarket links?)

    Um, just trying to think of the easy stuff... let us know what you find.
    #19
  20. Allgo

    Allgo No Whammy,No Whammy,STOP!

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    The PO had put Kouba links on the bike and may have removed or lost parts during the process - who knows ? After lubing, I reassambled, disassembled, reassembled - still a significant gap. It's possible that the gap is supposed to be there but then I noticed a "rub" (actually about a 2 mm gouge) on the inside of the left connecting link where its contacting some part of the shock. :huh

    [​IMG]

    Although, one of my shock bolts turned loose on me since the last service and I retorqued it and kept riding. This may have been caused at that time. Not sure. Let me know when you put your links back on or somebody else chime in if ya know.....:ear Don't mean to hijack Meat.......
    #20