Ouch.

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by atc250r, May 16, 2020.

  1. Jim Moore

    Jim Moore "You ain't black!"

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    Yeah, sorry, no. That was just a bad rider who rode off the road in the middle of an extremely mild curve. Nothing complex. No multiple mistakes. No decreasing radius. Just a bad rider. Inexperienced? Probably. Bad? Definitely.
    #21
  2. Husky360C

    Husky360C Been here awhile

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    I'm not going to argue with you, because you're wrong on several counts and I have learned that arguing about stuff like this is pointless. Claim what you like, I and other people who watched the video know better.
    #22
  3. uski

    uski Been here awhile

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    I am very sorry to read something like this.
    Humans make mistake, by definition.

    If you think you are above everyone else, or that motorcycles riders never make mistakes, you are terrible mistaken and awakening will be rude.

    Additionally, motorcycle training is generally insufficient and I would say the problem may not come from that person but from its training (or lack of).
    Your attitude of shifting blame to the individuals will not help improving the safety on the road. If it happened to that person, it will happen to others.
    We should think of what we can do as a community to prevent this, instead of doing fingerpointing and showing off how good of a rider you are because you never make mistakes.
    #23
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  4. Husky360C

    Husky360C Been here awhile

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    Yeah, sure, whatever you say ...:rofl
    #24
  5. Barry

    Barry Just Beastly

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    Yup. Call it as it is. Dumbass mistake. Dude probably has zero skill and less judgement.
    #25
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  6. Husky360C

    Husky360C Been here awhile

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    In a previous post, I tried to point out the multiple mistakes ( bad line into the corner, refusal to use more lean angle ) that acted to made the crash inevitable, and the reason I did that was to try to help inexperienced riders understand the mistakes so they could avoid making the mistakes.

    Some of the replies want us to believe there's nothing to be learned from the video, but that is not true. Some of the replies are trying to claim that mistakes are inevitable, and that any of us can and will make the same mistakes, and that is simply not true, with respect to the sort of mistakes made by the rider who crashed. Those mistakes are anything but inevitable and can be easily avoided.

    I see the value of this thread as a way for some riders to learn from someone else's mistakes. Better to learn what not to do by examining what happened to someone else than to learn the hard way like the guy who crashed in the video.
    #26
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  7. SenorCollin

    SenorCollin Been here awhile

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    Not all of us will, but any of us can make the same mistakes. For many riders all it takes is a small distraction or other loss of focus before they snap out of it, attempt to correct, and subsequently learn how fast they run out of talent the hard way.

    I agree with you about everything else. Anyone can make a boneheaded mistake, even highly experienced riders. The riding community has such a great opportunity to learn from videos like this, but too many people have a reaction along the lines of "meh, what an idiot." and forget all about it since it would never happen to them.
    #27
  8. Husky360C

    Husky360C Been here awhile

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    Certainly what you say is true ; any of us can make almost any mistake. And it doesn't matter what we did right in the past, what matters is getting it right in the present moment, throughout the entire ride.

    As a hobby, I've studied aviation accidents for many years. Aviation is similar to motorcycling, in that there are some mistakes you only get to make once, because the result of that mistake is the end of your life. It's notable that some air crashes have resulted from mistakes made by very experienced and competent pilots who have many thousands of hours. Below is one of the worst examples, which was caused by a captain putting his aircraft on the runway and taking off before he was given clearance to do so.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenerife_airport_disaster
    #28
  9. Jim Moore

    Jim Moore "You ain't black!"

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    That makes sense. You should have said in the beginning, "I'm a ghoul who gets off on the pain and suffering of other." Then we would have understood your fascination with this little mishap.
    #29
  10. Husky360C

    Husky360C Been here awhile

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    You just don't get it.

    I don't "get off on the pain and suffering of others", I study the mistakes of others so I don't end up making those mistakes myself. Aviation safety has been increased directly due to what has been LEARNED from past mistakes. It has nothing to do with ghoulishness and EVERYTHING to do with wanting to make aviation safer. Ask anyone who works for NHTSA and they will tell you this is true.

    The same line of reasoning can be applied to motorcycling safety. That was the reason I wrote about the mistakes which can be seen in the video.

    I don't understand why you feel the need to make insulting comments. Maybe you don't feel good about yourself so you feel some sort of need to be ugly to people you do not even know. You should work on that : it's not a positive attribute.
    #30
  11. Jim Moore

    Jim Moore "You ain't black!"

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    Are you a pilot? What do you fly?
    #31
  12. JaguarG

    JaguarG n00b

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    I was recently out bombing down some dirt roads on my Wee when I came upon a corner going too fast. My mind said ride the ditch, but my eyes said giant sandstone bolders in the ditch. My brain finally caught up and I leaned way more than I would like on a dirt road and gave it a little throttle. The result was a pounding heart, adrenaline dump, and not even a hint of a skid from either tire as I made the corner. So yeah, ride that bitch out.
    #32
  13. rd400racer

    rd400racer Long timer

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    I went on a group ride back in March and was behind a guy that did the exact same thing. His was a case of object fixation on the rider in front of him and the fact that he was going too fast for the type of motorcycle he was on. He was fortunate in that he didn't go down but came within inches of the fence. Worse thing is, about 10 miles down the road he almost did the same thing again.
    #33
  14. Tripped1

    Tripped1 Smoove, Smoove like velvet.

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    Damn right. I will lowside the SOB before I will give up on a corner.

    Closest I have come recently was a front end slide that really got my attention......shit ALWAYS seems to happen when one particular guy is behind me.

    Going down a mega twisty road, something like a 12-15% downhill grade, moving for that road but likely really only going like 40-50km/h pass some road repairs, back off a bit.....sure as shit caught a pile of gravel in the middle of the lane a little further down the hill going into a switch-back at a pretty decent lean right as I was coming off the brakes. The front slammed into the steering stop as the front pushed for a good meter while I through a leg out and yanked the clutch and completely let off the brakes and it cleared with a wobble and I rode it out with just a slight excursion into the oncoming lane....and a hell of a cramp in my left hip from trying to balance that out with my leg.

    Of course the viking asshole following me "Trying to channel your inner Marquez?" :lol3

    I don't get that one, I find it SO Much easier to follow because I have the rider ahead of me as a reference point, which is super important in Japan where you are quite literally using cat-eye mirrors to see around the corner.

    That is something of an art, on a 3m wide two-way single lane getting the art of watching both the mirrors and the road at once.
    #34
  15. tastroman

    tastroman Long timer

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    Until he went off the road he was taking the safest line around that blind turn. Ride the yellow like the guys in front of him then good luck to you when you meet a car in the apex that's in your lane.
    #35
  16. JETalmage

    JETalmage Been here awhile

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    In other words: Don't ride in groups.

    Yeah, every rider in a group should do that. ;-)

    JET
    #36
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  17. Tripped1

    Tripped1 Smoove, Smoove like velvet.

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    Bingo, his line was "correct" following a late apex protocol up until he left the road, no reason that he shouldn't have made that corner.
    #37
  18. JETalmage

    JETalmage Been here awhile

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    I went to Can-Am dealer demo ride for Spyders. They had the most thorough, organized, well-staffed, and safety-oriented presentation I've ever attended. Very professional staff, motorcycle license check, video instruction, lecture, per-rider one-on-one orientation, one-at-a-time parking lot practice course, ride route on completely traffic-free rural road, staff riders leading and trailing.

    In the parking lot session, a lady totaled the machine by panic-grabbing throttle WFO in reaction to having lightly bumped a plastic road cone. On the group ride, a guy ran off the wide-open road, across a ditch, and into a farm field.

    I didn't learn anything from witnessing either. ;-)

    JET
    #38
  19. windblown101

    windblown101 Long timer Supporter

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    Looked like a pretty classic case of a panic freeze. The brain takes a pause in rational thought when taken by surprise by something scary and unexpected and issues a "freeze" order. At that point it didnt matter that the corner was easily taken becuase the rider was no longer riding the bike.

    He does the one thing most can still manage in that situation - He was able to get on the brakes because in that moment stopping was only thing the instinctual part of his brain was on board with.

    A cautionary tale to stay in the moment. If you dont have a plan for whats ahead some very old ingrained instincts come into play when the unexpected happens. The problem with that is we didn't ride motorcycles when those instincts developed. Fear is good, letting fear take over is bad, have a plan at all times because even a bad plan will keep fear in check.
    #39
  20. ZoomerP

    ZoomerP Been here awhile Supporter

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    Thank you.
    #40