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Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Navin, Oct 23, 2017.
Because it's Chinese it's only a Five Days model.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Zongshen enter this year's Dakar 1000? Day 3, a failed rider fix caused the bike to catch fire? How well did it actually hold up before that? We all know bikes break down in the Dakar regardless of brand, but for those unfamiliar, that's saying something about the engine that they'd put their necks out there like that. I wonder if Pitster actually makes the frame, or just assembles once here. We know it's a KTM clone, but do we know who makes that?
Us fat guys like me, might have to take that into consideration. I don't want issues bending if I hit an illegal bear drag at 50mph. Did that on the WRF this year and tore off the entire sub-fender cause my suspension bottomed out. Front tire skipped over it, rear tire not so much.
Wasn't it determined the Dakar bikes were WR450's? Or 4 of the 5 were? Something like that.
Zongshen has also had race teams on CBR600's. They didn't try to hide the fact. They just raced other manufacturers bikes.
Hey, if they are learning thats a good thing! If I was going to build a new off road or MX bike today without worry of infringement, KTM all the way. Everyone else is playing with ten year old designs, or older.
Seems AJP using the same engine boasts 30 hp at 7000 rpm and 20ft pounds of torque.
32 at 8k and 21ft pounds doesn't sound unrealistic, despite what the guys in the CSC RX3 thread say. Might have lesser compression rings to get those 3,000 mile oil changes.
Wonder if it's just a slightly more aggressive cam lobe or what. On another note, Michigan has an AJP dealer too. I didn't know this. I doubt they stock bikes, but it makes me go hmm.
If you are serious, maybe a trip or call to PA about shipping is in order. They have had a demo PR5 for sale for a while now. It shows up on my local CL from time to time.
Hey Guys, I don't get on ADV much but had a email from one of you mentioning this thread, so I thought I would jump in and try to answer a few questions.
I don't claim to be the "know all" of efi etc..etc... but if I don't have the answer I will try and get it for you. I will read through the thread an quote and reply, thank you.
but it is the EXTREMEEEEE edition AJP? Seems AJP is highly rated. If we've got evidence the motor is solid from all accounts, how much can you screw up a chasis? I mean I guess it's possible, but it seems that the hard part is already done for you. I can't see how this could suck any less than a CRF250L chassis even if it was done half assed on a Friday afternoon before a holiday. And that too is half the price.
My biggest concern would be the availability of commonly needed parts like oil filters, sprockets and fork seals. Are most of these already cross referenced to where we can order them and have them readily available? Others may have other questions of course, but knowing I can do simple things like routine maintenance or change gearing comfortably without headache is something I'd worry about.
I read the engine uses XR600 or 650 clutch plates. Im betting its standard stuff, they dont reinvent the wheel when they build stuff.
I will try and answer your questions the best I can. The engine is manufactured by Zongshen, which is one of the largest engine manufactures in the world. They also build for Daytona Japan. The 250 four value motor has been around for about 9 years now, We tested some of the first version of this motor back in 2009. The motor is used in many applications and some of you have mentioned.
Suspension is manufactured by a company names Fast Ace, We have worked with them for 13 years on our pit bikes models. I don't claim to know what other models may have similar or the same internals or parts such as, forks seals, springs etc... etc.. I am sure a good suspension guy could better identify what would cross over with other models. When we need suspension parts we order direct OEM parts from Fastace, including optional springs rates etc..etc... As the LXR 250f becomes more popular we and others will have a better understanding of what crosses over with other models. We do have oem forks seals, engine internals, gears, levers, plastics, etc..etc.. (basically all parts in stock) If for some reason we dom not have them in stock we can get parts with in 5-7 business days.
As far as common parts that we do know crosses over with other models, Chain, sprokets, wheels are common Honda crf 250f patterns, Plastics Ktm, levers common. Radiator, I am not familiar with a common replacement at this time, but believe it also is based off the ktm version, I need to compare.
I am sorry for the confusion, the website needs to be updated, the original efi systems we tested where deplhi, however the production models are manufactured in house and our own brand. I am not great at EFI, stuff, so I am sure some of you will have questions I cannot answer, however I can contact our engineers and get you the answers. The engine is the same as the RX3 but EFI and a little hotter cam.
They are offroad use, however depending on your state you may be able to get them plated for street use. You would need to check the local DMV for this.
Thank you, like i said I dont get on the forums much but we will try and help as much as we can. As for the xtr 250lc and sc, we have had these models for about 6 years now, they have been very good for recreational guys, trail riding, and some have converted them to street use. They also share many things in common with the honda crf 230, ( engines are very much the same) However the xtr models have disc brakes, alloy swingarm, beefy wheels, adjustable suspension, better foot pegs. The LXR 250f is the liquid cooled 4 valve EFI 6 speed models and the xtr 250 are the air cooled 5 speed models.
I haven't confirmed this, as far as the xr 600,650 clutch plates, but you are right, they almost always cross over with a common model. In fact many of the suppliers also supply the "big brands" too. Its actually a very small world when you start digging into where all the parts come from. Many of the things people think are "clones" are actually from the same suppliers as the "originals". For example take a look at a honda CRF 50, yes its Made in china, and take a look at our xjr 90ss, both look similar and share many of the same parts, (when I say "same" I literally mean the same supplier) However our version is beefed up so adults can also beat the hell out of them.
I know this was a joke, but actually many of them are!!
@Pitster, expect some good natured joking here, thanks for the replies.
I just crawled all over a SSR 250 with the same engine, carbed version. In my opinion, they went 75% in the chassie. The bolts holding on the foot peg brakets are at the least suspect, the left side was already falling apart from the weight of the huge kick stand. Nothing besides the actual frame was very nice, crude in fact IMO.
The engine at least looks tight. Only oddity I saw was tiny (5mm?) studs to hold on the oil filter cover. KTM uses a bolt, just looks more finished but not for the ham fisted threading into aluminum so maybe this is a better solution considering the customers.
The intake is industrial in appearance, which is fine here. Its not racing the pro 250f SX class.
So, the SSR looks pretty much like a $3800 bike would look in person. In photos and vids it looks like a CRFX, not so.
@Pitster. Have you had a SsR next to a Pitster to compare and your opinion on how they stack up please.
Our factory makes the frame. I am not claiming this is the strongest most amazing frame made, but I will say for sure, it is 100% on par with anything else in its class. and much more refined then a crf230, or klr which are still more expensive. Is it going to win any supercross races? No, This bike is designed to be a "x" type model, like a crf 250x, wr250x, type bike. Smooth power, plush suspension at a great value.
Something to note for the rest of us:
AJP uses Fast Ace suspension as well. I remember reading that when I was comparing their bike to the Pitster Pro. If it works for them, it should work for Pitster.
@Pitster I don't mean to bombard you with questions, but is the EFI or ECU possible to remap? Some reports are that the chinese software and cable are not compatible, but if you're using in house EFI now, this may no longer be the case. In the case of uncorking the exhaust and/or air box slightly, wondering if we can tune it to be slightly richer, or if it's compatible with an EFI mapper just to prevent popping on deceleration.