PPE for stops while riding

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Grinnin, May 11, 2020.

  1. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades... Super Supporter

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    You may not work in an area where your breathing isn't a problem, but a lot of us work where this is a very serious issue. I am a teacher and am regularly exposed to anything a teenage kid may have. Kids sneeze, kids have runny noses, kids aren't always the cleanest of people when it comes to a runny nose. Kids get hands all over everything. We have to lean in relatively close when helping students at times. It also seems they are quite a carrier of any kind of general sickness and this is one that still isn't well known and possible treatments developed. Same thing went on with any variety of diseases over the decades.

    Now for this current problem. Perhaps you missed just how many people died in a month and a half. If general flu took that many people you would see a similar situation... in fact that is exactly what you are seeing. Do I need to panic? No. Do I need to realize as much as possible about transmission of this disease? You bet I do. I'm 66, I figure I can survive being infected, but there don't seem to be too many guarantees.

    Now when there are relatively effective treatments that increase odds of survival things can be a lot more relaxed. Right now if I get flu, which I did in February, I'm down for a week with some meds and the week off is to get past being contagious and get rid of the fever. We have to stay out as teachers, we are to go 24 hours fever free before returning to school because of the contagious nature of those sorts of illnesses and the proximity of people in the halls and classroom. It is the people who ignore the necessity to avoid affecting others that is the problem. Too often they are the ones passing around the bacteria and viruses. That is why the mask. Right now it just makes sense. If it reduces chances 50% I'll do it.

    Again kind of like wearing a helmet. Odds are high that I don't need one, but if I do I think I want to have a good full coverage. Doesn't make me a fear monger or coward.

    As for protection, I need it because if people like you should contract this virus and are glad to spew it about I need to try to stay healthy as I can. If that means I slap on a cloth mask to try to knock out as much of your broadcast sputum I guess I have to do it. Being around about 100 kids a day, good chance I'm wearing a mask and using a lot of hand sanitizer next year.



    If it weren't for the fact that the sick are overwhelming hospitals I'd say let people do what they want. Would you sign off your access to emergency treatment before you go back to crowded bars, beaches, restaurants, races, concerts, sports events, would you be so willing? You go to the races and sign a waver of life saving support if you contract Covid. Willing to take that chance now? Maybe promoters should consider having face mask/temperature zones and non-face mask zones, that way you can exercise your rights to go without while I have the right to not be exposed for now.

    Not everyone. I personally am about knowing what makes sense to do and not do. We didn't panic and hoard toilet paper and paper towels, hand sanitizer and bleach, or run out to buy more guns. I saw what not doing anything did in New York and now I'm seeing what trying to use some safety gear here in Columbus Ohio has done - or not done. Seems we don't have the New York/Detroit problems. Main difference was calm approach to doing what was needed to gain what control was possible over the spread of the virus. So we wear masks, so we try to sanitize hands rather frequently.

    I don't understand why people who claim to have "common sense" and all, ignore risk and benefit. Of course I've not understood it for decades - helmet use. This isn't a new situation by any means. With what is known I have no understanding of why people wouldn't take the opportunity to cut chances of ending up in the hospital or dying from not wearing a face mask or helmet when it has demonstrated far more value than not wearing them. Same kind of situation. But I guess I do understand there are always those who rationalize it all away and call us cowards. I guess they can let natural selection take its course - but then again part of natural selection is taking advantage of what is available to be safe. And I know what I think will help. I'm not planning to be in the running for the Darwin award in the near future.

    I am not happy about not being able to go out to dinner and I'm not sure how it's going to pan out, but I'm not going into some restaurant where the ventilation blows down to the floor spreading whatever anyone coughs out all around the area while there is a virtually untreatable debilitating disease spreading about. I am also going to be wary about going in stores and all. We just looked at what made sense and have done it. How to minimize our risks.

    I hate that there are so many people who have lost jobs, although it seems there are other possibilities for some. I am not happy that the money needed hasn't gone to those who are out of work not by choice. Issuing checks to everyone wasn't the way to do it. I gave my $1200 to the Mid Ohio Foodbank to help anyone out of work. To me it isn't charity it is a correction in where the money should be going. It is helping when someone needs help. When someone applies for unemployment they should get a check in two weeks while being checked out for approval. Maybe have a set up where the unemployment is paid out through the employer with the responsibility for legal dispersal being on the employer to stop fraud. They pay the laid off workers, the unemployment agency verifies the employer is doing the work legitimately.

    I am optimistic that there will be a way to lessen suffering and death rate in reasonably short order, but until then I'm not going out and "blasting around without a helmet"... if you know what I mean.

    One thing that does make it sufferable is the ability to throw on the helmet and go for a ride without any concerns beyond what have always been involved in riding.
    #61
  2. Mountainhound

    Mountainhound Long timer

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    Perhaps you missed just how many people died in a month and a half. If general flu took that many people you would see a similar situation... in fact that is exactly what you are seeing


    Missed nothing! People die, not sure the number in 1918 or whatever the flu pandemic was but pretty sure numbers were just as bad if not worse, and the world was a lot bigger then. The number of dead is to be expected with a brand spanking new virus such as this, but then things even out because the old and frail are now fewer and the rest build some immunity. Next year the year after we will get a real idea of how deadly or not this new virus is when numbers aren't being pumped up.
    #62
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  3. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades... Super Supporter

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    And the medical field learned how to work with that virus. Takes time, so I'm willing to give time and be careful in the meantime. Just makes sense to me. I'd rather wait until the bridge is built than ride through a river without knowing how deep it is.
    #63
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  4. dhally

    dhally Hammerhead Supporter

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    Interesting discussion. Makes me think about my choices.

    I believe there is a "karma" aspect to following your governor's orders. It makes me feel like I'm helping, and it reinforces the idea to others.

    In my area few are wearing masks even though we are a hot spot. My wearing a mask gets people's attention and encourages them to stay the fuck away from me!
    #64
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  5. Mountainhound

    Mountainhound Long timer

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    I've never said don't be careful, but besides the mask all the same precautions I was taught and would imagine most here were taught as a small child. Just because they build a bridge is built (flu vaccine) does not mean I will use it or trust it, the very same applies to, if and when, a vaccine for this one is available. I'll take the river!
    #65
  6. VanXR

    VanXR nOOb/NooB/noob/NOob/NOOB/ Supporter

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    If for some crazy reason, you wind up with COVID are you going to the hospital? I think you should just fight this virus off at home by yourself. My wife the nurse has NEVER seen people so sick once they contract the virus.
    #66
  7. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    Use a round the neck tube thing.
    Many use anyway for comfort and warmth.
    Pull it up and over when masks are required. That is what I see most doing any way around here any time out and about. 2 birds, 1 stone.
    #67
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  8. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades... Super Supporter

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    Your wife's and her professional associates' mental and physical well being is one of the bigger reasons I am willing to wear a mask around people and try to be more careful in what I do. What has been said by those people and what images have been seen, people making special hook devices to stop the behind ear skin damage to the point of bleeding, and worst is when they become infected and ill from helping those who contracted the disease - that is why I do what I do in addition to protecting myself.

    No way I want to contribute to a second bigger outbreak. I just can't be that self centered, that my going to a bar, a race, a game, a restaurant is more important than trying to relieve some of the load on those people. It isn't noble by any stretch, it is out of feeling empty because I am not contributing at a level remotely close to that of those people.

    Plus I sure as heck don't want to be contributing to another shut down of whatever businesses can open and function again. Is it worth it to be able to crowd around each other with the risk of shutting down industry again due to mass outbreaks? I don't think so.

    If all my sacrifice is, is to wear a small mask and be careful around others, seems like a small sacrifice. The kind of sacrifice you make willingly - freely - without having a government, elected by the majority of the people representing the good of the people, needed to attempt to force the uncaring to respect the health of the majority. I am making my free choice to give for the good of the people around me. I guess my sense of freedom's cost is a bit different. I make the choice with some sense of the good of my family, friends, and those around me - not just me. In a democratic republic that is what it takes to maintain the freedoms it provides for the society.

    I need to get some of them.

    The problem with most masks and such is that my beard stubble growth (clean shaven most mornings) works as little ratchets to pull the mask down. Hook, pull, release, hook, pull release... reposition mask... repeat.

    I'm just glad I don't need it most of the time.
    #68
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  9. Mountainhound

    Mountainhound Long timer

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    Bullshit! People crack me up like hiding behind some mask waiting for some talking head to tell you your safe. Nobody is safe and 90% of you are wearing and handeling them wrong. Unless we are all living in bio suites getting decontamination done we are carrying it with us and spreading it. Oh you know its funny when i asked my wife THE NURSE of 38 years when she mentioned loosing a couple patients to it I asked how many she had lost to the flu, crickets. Its a virus it is not going anywhere just like the flu. I know i know this is so much worse than the flu bla bla bla.
    #69
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  10. gsboar

    gsboar springfield miler

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    - my learning included how to intelligently weigh risks - how my behavior impacts others is part of the equation.....

    - really? no vaccine?
    - i suspect you have had one or more vaccines that have prevented your becoming ill, e.g., polio, mumps, rubella, measles, hepatitis, tetanus....
    - all pandemics require changes in behavior & knocking out diseases like polio require use of vaccines....

    - "talking heads" are trying to summarize the best current knowledge - i know full well that as more is known prescriptions & proscriptions will likely change...
    - i am trained to listen to experts (whatever the topic or field) with a critical ear & if i have questions i research them by going to peer-reviewed journals, evaluate & make my own decisions....

    - i look forward to the day covid-19 is just a flu like that which caused the 1918 pandemic, but until better treatments & hopefully a vaccine are available, covid-19 requires us to adapt our behavior...

    - some may feel safely distanced & insulated from this bug, but it is worth noting that people in one of the most isolated native american tribes in south america contracted it over 2.5 months ago.... chances of contracting this certainly vary, but isolation from population centers offers no guarantee....
    #70
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  11. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades... Super Supporter

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    Did you ask her if she wore any PPE and why she bothered wearing a mask when working with patients since you don't see the value?

    Did you ask her why bother when clearly in your mind there is no risk of contracting any diseases or that the PPE is a total waste of time?

    Does she not wear masks around people in public?

    Does she see the whole thing as a mountain out of a mole hill?

    Did you ask her how many people they lost to flu vs Covid over a two month period? Seems some in the medical field like her, find it to be far worse than any flu they've seen take people's lives.

    Doesn't it strike you at all unusual that after 38 years and seeing probably numerous deaths that this virus should bring up any concern on her part?

    Did you ask her how pleasant it was to see the illness in action?

    Did you actually listen to her?

    Or do you just force your opinion over hers.



    Just curious.:hmmmmm
    #71
  12. Mountainhound

    Mountainhound Long timer

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    Again crack me up! Yes she wears a mask gloves whole 9 yards working with patients. Since she didn't bother to answer my question on how many of her patients she's lost to the flu why bother. Like I have said yes it's a bad virus, but a virus none the less and is not going anywhere just like the flu.

    Again I will ask here, when are you planning on removing your mask? When is it going to be acceptable to gather in large groups? When is life going to get back to normal? I ask these questions because we are a social species, and we are not staying separated forever. And I'm sorry but if hospitals are not prepared by now to deal with the influx of covid patients they never will be.


    People die every single day by the thousands some hard, some easy but such is life or death as the case may be.
    #72
  13. Shawnee Bill

    Shawnee Bill Long timer Supporter

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    I have a hard time understanding how a mature adult doesn't realize this. I don't like it and would like to think that everyone gets to live a long happy life and pass away peacefully in their sleep. But I have been around long enough to know that is far from the case, thousands of people die horrible deaths every day, and did long before Covid 19 came along and will continue to do so long after it is gone.

    Doesn't mean I like it, doesn't mean I think people should put their selves in harms way with no preparation, but for some strange reason people like to put those words in others mouths.
    #73
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  14. squish

    squish Out of the office.

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    I've not ridden since this thing has been in full swing.

    Nevertheless
    SOP for me is a buff and bandana over my nose and mouth when I'm out of my yard and outside,
    If I'm going inside a store, I bring along my NIOSH rated organic vapor respirator, mostly because it's comfortable to wear for an hour or so and it stays in place without me having to mess with it too much, I'm also used to wearing for long periods of time and it doesn't fog up my safety glasses, and I can clean it quickly. Once it goes on it stays on until I can safely take it off, while assuming the outside of it is contaminated until I can clean it.

    I also have hand sanitizer with me.
    Cell phone is in a plastic zipper bag and I don't use it unless I have to, and it's decontaminated as well (I keep my phone in a heavy duty case with a screen cover I only clean the cover, I wipe down the phone with rubbing alcohol.
    Safety glasses, on before I go in, stays on until I can remove and decontaminate them.

    This wouldn't change on the bike, and I normally wear a buff around my neck while riding just to keep the sun off my neck.
    So while getting gas I just push the thing up to seal the area under my helmet and I leave my face shield closed.
    And I'm planning on heading inside it would be the same as above. Only I'd park the bike as far away from other people and i'd remove the OVR at my bike putting it into a ziplock bag before I cleaned myself up, decontaminating the mask as soon as I can.

    Like riding and feeling like everyone is out to kill you.
    It's the same deal with this virus, I assume everyone I don't personally know is a vector and stay as far away from them as practical.

    Is it over reaction.
    Maybe, But I have friends who are well respected medical doctors in their fields and they say
    It's no joke. That they are taking serious precautions as well.
    This thing is no joke, I've had three friends who have had it all have thankfully recovered. You. Do. Not. Want. To. Get. It.
    #74
  15. Valentino

    Valentino Been here awhile

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    Using appropriate PPE is less about protecting yourself, and more about protecting other people (who may be more susceptible).
    #75
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  16. snglfin

    snglfin this statement is untrue

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    i carry a spray bottle of alcohol and gloves. i spray the pump handle, the key pad, and the touch screen before touching anything to start the refueling process (and give it 25-30 seconds to evaporate). i use one gloved hand to operate the pump, then toss it when finished. when i need to go inside a store, my mask is in a ziplock bag, and gets an alcohol spray after use.

    to answer your question as to when to remove the mask - it’s when the rate of spread is below 1, meaning that for every person who’s infected, they infect less than one other person on average. you’ve probably heard the phrase “flatten the curve”? that’s the point of using masks. some really informative data in this article you might find enlightening: https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

    stay safe, be well!

    johnnyg
    #76
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  17. Grinnin

    Grinnin Forever N00b Supporter

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    Sounds like you have a good routine.

    I had thought of disinfecting the mask with alcohol, but the alcohol doesn't evaporate from cloth very quickly. The option is either wait around longer for the mask to dry or put it in the bag and then wait at the next stop. I don't really want an alcohol inhaler.

    I'm not planning any trips soon, but I have been using motorcycles for errands and that often means multiple stops.
    #77
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  18. snglfin

    snglfin this statement is untrue

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    yeah, i have inadvertently taken a huge whiff of isopropyl fumes... i’m using 91% alcohol, so it evaporates more quickly than the 70%. i have the surgical paper masks and toss them after a few uses.

    be well,

    johnnyg
    #78
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  19. Sneeze Juice

    Sneeze Juice Been here awhile

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    Having owned diesel cars as daily drivers for the majority of my life, I know diesel pumps usually have disposable gloves. I try and use one of those for the keypad, and pump. If they are out, I will use a disposable glove I bring with me.

    I also carry sanitizer, and have only worn N95 masks since this started. On the bike, I won’t go into stores as I’m bound to destroy an N95 trying to carry it on my bike with minimal storage.


    It’s bizarre that so many knuckle draggers suddenly have medical degrees.
    #79
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  20. RoundTrip

    RoundTrip Unintentional deerslayer Supporter

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    MY world is neither black nor white. I neither live in fear nor fail to take reasonable precautions. I listen to the advice of others and try and make my own decisions based on multiple sources of information.

    I am willing and able to determine which vaccines are of most concern to me in my context and to make sure I get the ones that make sense and avoid the ones that don't, again in my context. For example, as a 68 year old male I will pass on the human papilloma vaccine, but I get the mega-dose of the flu vaccine each year. I believe that everyone should make those informed decisions for themselves. As for anti-vaxxers in general, I do not engage with people with closed minds. That is also true for those that I run into who blindly follow all popular memes without thought, especially ones that actually require science.

    I wear a mask around others as a courtesy and to remind me not to touch my face when out of the house. I do this because I think it adds to the general mental well being of the herd without asking me to perform unreasonable actions or damaging myself to a greater extent than the threat that I impose on others. I wash my hands often and use hand sanitizer. I do that primarily for my own benefit. I am against the "mask shaming" that is beginning to go on in our culture.

    Some believe that there is no way to operate our society while waiting for vaccines or having some Governor or Mayor make up rules that have no bearing on reality and are certainly not related to any demonstrable science or study. I do not understand the knee jerk removal of The People's rights when they are enforced in an arbitrary and unscientific manner. I completely fail to understand how large retail operations are safe but small retail stores are not. Or that it is ok to buy a t-shirt but not grass seed. Or play singles tennis but not doubles. It is equally hard for me to see how it is safe to have social distancing for stores but not for voting. No politics, show me the science please. And please don't tell me a 16 year old "climate expert" who has just magically become an epidemiologist this month is credible.

    We all die. Many make choices that make dieing more likely. Especially those who participate on this forum. The question of when to remove the masks is a valid one. I think that answer is also square in the grey and should be dealt with by the gestalt of the population. I notice areas where mask use is much higher than others. The People will decide when they want to stop and no .gov regulation will make that different.

    So back on subject, I use a buff when riding with others, pulled up over my nose at stops. I wash my hands with sanitizer after touching a gas pump or money or eating and I generally have a great life living far away from the zealous edges of either side's propaganda.
    #80