Proposed Colorado FS and other trail closings that WILL affect you.

Discussion in 'The Rockies – It's all downhill from here...' started by jjmead1, Nov 18, 2015.

  1. jjmead1

    jjmead1 now THAT"S a bike!

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    #1
  2. terry.mc

    terry.mc Stop ruining my vacation

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    Yow. 500 of 2,200 miles.

    I'm constantly amazed.
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  3. BuffHunter

    BuffHunter Been here awhile

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    I'd like some more details on this. They sure make it sound like a done deal.
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  4. _CJ

    _CJ Rugged Individualist

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    What's the deal with forest service settling these cases instead of going to court? Why weren't pro-access groups given a chance to defend their usage of the land? It's kind of smelling like there's some collusion taking place among like minded anti-access types.

    These anti-access people are well connected, and well funded. If the pro-access crowd doesn't get organized, and quick, it's going to be game over....if it's not already.

    It's looking like they've seen the success their friends had getting the Bear Creek watershed shut down, and they're doubling down with the same strategy. 500 miles of roads? Ridiculous. They made specific mention of the Pikes Peak region. Better get ready to kiss all of the roads/trails off of Gold Camp and Rampart goodbye. These are the same idiots who want Rampart turned into a wilderness area. That's not happening, so now this. It's just infuriating.
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  5. macmotor

    macmotor Whiskey Dick

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  6. big_sur

    big_sur Way faster than you

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    Easy solution guys....stop bitching and start donating:
    upload_2015-11-19_8-53-20.png
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  7. _CJ

    _CJ Rugged Individualist

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    Honestly, I don't think that's going to be enough. Grass routes enthusiasts chipping in a few bucks at the local level to fund pro-access legal defense as PART of their mission isn't going to get it done. Letter writing campaigns aren't going to get it done.

    There needs to be a pro-access group with a singular focus on retaining and expanding access further, for ALL users of public lands with funding from dealers, retailers, and manufacturers....just like the anti-access people.

    And with the Forest service settling these cases without going to court....we need pro-access people initiating their own lawsuits instead of just defending. How can you defend against something that never goes to court? We need an offensive strategy.

    At the end of the day, I don't know that it's even possible. These people ruined California, and fled the scene....to Colorado, and now they're hell bent on running this state into the ground too.
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  8. RockyMtnScotsman

    RockyMtnScotsman Been here awhile

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    "A coalition of environmental groups forced the settlement...." I can't find it just yet (so if someone else has it, please post) but remember the list of businesses that are active advocates for and contributors to the cause of keeping us out of the forest. These include REI, New Belgium Brewing, Sierra Club, Colorado Mountain Club, and a couple dozen more. Personally I won't spend a dime of my hard earned money with the enemy if I can at all help it (can't avoid some like Colorado Springs Utilities).
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  9. big_sur

    big_sur Way faster than you

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    Everything you mentioned can be accomplished with more money. If COHVCO had a multi-million dollar budget, I'm sure we'd win a lot more of these battles.
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  10. _CJ

    _CJ Rugged Individualist

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    Multi-million dollar budgets don't come from a small group of activity specific trail users, they come from "A coalition of groups....". The anti-access crowd has figured this out and put it into action. The pro-access crowd doesn't seem to understand. Motorized users alone are never going to be able to effect change by themselves. They (we) need to join forces with the NRA, Cabellas, Bass-Pro, Honda, Jeep, Ford, mountain bikers, hikers, and anyone else who believes in freedom and public land for public use.
    #10
  11. Rogue_Ryder

    Rogue_Ryder

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    Yes, but even if every OHV user in the state were a COHVCO member; the budget that COHVCO would have would pale in comparison to the amount of money rolling in from corporations like REI, Black Diamond, etc. etc. A while back I posted a list of corporations who donate to the anti-access groups, the list is LONG and the amount of dollars are huge (the list didn't include the donation amounts but believe me you and I donating a couple hundo isn't even a drop in the bucket compared to the corp donations). A big issue we have is that in Colorado if there's a few hundred thousand OHV users but there's millions of Hikers from around the entire US that care about how the land here is used. You might even have some wealthy fat cat living in a New York City apartment who makes a nice healthy six figure donation to the Sierra Club every year. We have Senators from places like Illinois and Massachusetts that sponsor bills to shut down National Forest land out here in the west to OHV users.

    I've been a member of the AMA for at least a dozen years and am a member of COHVCO (and use the Amazon Smile for them), and have at times over the years made donations to BRC. What's discouraging is even though I know these organizations are winning battles, they appear to be losing the war. I haven't seen ANYTHING re-open, and I've continued to see riding areas either be shut down or trails/roads closed year after year. Even in California where there is far more riders than here in Colorado they couldn't get Clear Creek fully reopened and that place was a premier riding spot not just in Cali but maybe one of the best in the US, really it's STILL closed to OHVs because only Dual Sports are allowed in their now. Right here in BoCo Left Hand has yet to re-open and the illegally closed wagon road has been off limits for decades now.

    I also want to say I was PISSED off to see that the upper part of the Iron Clads has been closed at the Bunce School area. If anyone is familar with that area the tougher hill climb (there was a few routes you could take from easy to difficult) that was an out back that lead to a gate beyond a meadow is no longer there. I rode this in the early summer and took a friend in my Jeep up there a few weeks ago only to find the road had been completely removed not just gated.
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  12. modette

    modette TrailTaker.com

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    Yep, that is what I been trying to work on now for the last few years. Getting Companies to understand, getting manufactures to understand they need to step up big time like REI does and fund a group to fight these ridiculous land closures. You know what some of the bigger companies tell me, we don't care we have our pet Cancer donation (which is noble in itself) but does not deal direct with their products. KLIM is one of the few bigger companies getting more and more involved. We need more like them...we need Kawasaki to say "We pledge $5 over the next 5 years".

    The KTM rally is nice from what I hear, but KTM gives SHIT to keeping trails open. At least Kawasaki tries with COHVCO because of Jamie. When you go buy your next bike call the executive offices of the brand you are looking at and ask "What do you do for our Trails?" We need Manufactures and other large companies to step up big time. Otherwise we all lost the fight and at some point I doubt we all will give up riding we will just all be outlaws.
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  13. norton(kel)

    norton(kel) He’s my President! Supporter

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    ^+1 Also it seems all we motorcyclists want to do is fight with other trail users ( Side by sides , four wheelers, three wheelers, jeeps, etc.) Till we all pull together were doing nothing.
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  14. _CJ

    _CJ Rugged Individualist

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    It's the "us vs them" mentality that will loose the war. There ARE hikers and mountain bikers who support trail access for ALL user groups, but there isn't anyone working that angle. I hate to call it a left/right thing, but that's what it is, and the left is winning the war, often through misleading propaganda. It's time to put the conservation back in conservative....so that our lands can be enjoyed by everyone, hikers, bikers, moto, jeeps, etc.

    .
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  15. modette

    modette TrailTaker.com

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  16. bradrh

    bradrh Been here awhile

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    Do you have a list of who REI & New Belgium donate too? Another tactic is to lean on these companies to quit donating to anti access groups.
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  17. _CJ

    _CJ Rugged Individualist

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    Yup....the whole 717 area, all of the Al-Magre stuff south of Pikes Peak, pretty much every trail in existence.

    Blood boiling.....need to walk away now.
    #17
  18. modette

    modette TrailTaker.com

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  19. RockyMtnScotsman

    RockyMtnScotsman Been here awhile

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    REI lists theirs here http://www.rei.com/stewardship/community.html

    I haven't seen a comprehensive list on NBB but they donate to Sierra Club, Wilderness Society, Wild Earth Guardians, etc and of course SUWA

    Here's one version of the anti-motorized use companies I found: http://www.scribd.com/doc/113155049/98620649-deaf-49df-ba5a-0f44b2195e58
    #19
  20. DittyBag

    DittyBag A bag of dirty stuff

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    So discouraged when I see this tsunami coming. Extremist environmentalism is the point of the sword for the liberal/democrat agenda, and I cannot see a long term tool that can slow its cancerous progression. More corporate interest is a possible step, but I cannot see any of the big firms sticking their necks out for something that may get them branded as working against "the environment". There is nothing "environmental" about closing roads. Colorado roads/trails aren't exactly a lonely place to be in the summer time as it is. I wonder if there will be such a thing as adventure riding in 20 years.
    #20