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Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by acupuncture4u, Jun 7, 2008.
Ok so I figured a way to get this in the HoW.
And so it is.
I must acknowledge Hank as one cool guy. Not only did he call me back after I left a message asking for his advice, two weeks later, he made a followup call to check if everything worked out ok.
Because my clutch was just beginning to slip, at Hank's suggestion, I only changed the slave unit out and did not replace the clutch. He said to ride easy and make sure that the clutches DID NOT slip or they might glaze. I did this for about two weeks and finally the fluid either burned off or distributed itself equally eliminating the high spots because all is now well. No clutch replacement and no more slippage.
<BR>Thanks for the update!
Im trying this by myself on the streets on Los Angeles....
.... wish me luck!!
.... well..... so far so good. I got the old one out and got the new one in and I hope that I got everything nice a tight and in its place before putting it back together.
I gotta head over to BMW to get the bleeder now and get that taken care of!
It's not exactly necessary to get the bleeder. If your on the streets of LA in a pinch you can do it like this.
its a good thing too because I stripped the stupid end out like other people have mentioned....
Ive gotta replace that bit now... but other than that - went perfectly! Did 200 miles today... all I have to show for it is a sore clutch hand....
hey thanks BTW for posting this up - it made yet another "difficult" problem seem very manageable by a person like me with little mechanical knowledge!
Oh and hey - can acupuncture actually cure my Bruxism??
I'm planning to place my clutch hose shortly due to the same issue as above. My local BMW dealer is charging me about S$300, or USD$230 for the hose alone. I thought this is a rather steep price to pay for a hose.. that rust..
So, I've a local company that can make steel braided hoses to length with any end fittings needed for 40% of that price. I have them on my other bikes brake hoses, works great, with great feel on the brakes.
Has anyone taken this approach before?
For discussion pls.
On another note, I recently found that my clutch fluid in the master pump reservior was empty! This was discovered after I experienced a "no pressure" on the level experience.. The last time I rode the bike about 2 days prior, she was great, no sign of any anormaly, then came the no pressure...
I topped up the reserviour and the pressure was back! Phew!
The question is, where did the fluid disappeared to?? There are no sign of any external leakage... Is there something more to come...
I would install the "nearby company" hoses if I had such a clutch. Thanks God mine is cable actuated
As you are in there, also replace the slave cylinder. The fluid must surely gou out from it and it started leaking so replace the slave before you have to replace the clutch!
Yes. I had some stainless clutch hoses made up, and there was problem with the tiny banjo fitting with the 90 degree bend at the slave cylinder end joining the larger bore pipe.
Got around it by getting rid of the 90 degree angle and making the hose longer. But it looks vulnerable when in place.
The genuine bmw 1150 ADV clutch hose is in stainless and £50 in the UK.
I REALLY appreciate this thread and the detailed discussion on changing the clutch slave cylinder. I discovered the dreaded weep a few weeks ago on my '07 GS that has about 14,000 on it. I didn't notice any clutch problems and the fluid in the reservoir was still clean...only sign was oil running down the back of the tranny case. Apparently the design of the slave has changed from the 1150 to the 1200 as it allows leaking fluid to escape out the bottom of the unit instead of building up in the space between the cylinder and tranny cover and running down the clutch push rod. Anyway, I had fluid all over the tranny cover but the push rod was dry and no clutch slippage.
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After reading this thread I expected quite a job. Im one for taking off the fewest parts possible to get the job done. I was most happy to discover after cutting one tie and removing the charcoal canister I was able to easily reach one of the bolts and could just feel the other
.I went for it. Luckily I was able to use a universal joint extension for my socket and easily remove the back bolt. Getting it back in was a bit trickier as it was a blind job and I could only turn the socket wrench a few degrees at a time. With the two bolts gone, the cylinder slipped right out. I was even able to pull the clutch push rod out far enough to remove the felt. I placed the slave cylinder in a pipe wrench to hold it steady to remove the hose. No problems going back on and after several hundred pumps of the clutch lever she was bled and ready to ride. One side note, I allowed all of the fluid to drain out of the system and I had to pump the clutch lever a fairly long time before bubbles stopped coming up in the reservoir. After that, bleeding the slave cylinder was pretty straight forward and only took a few minutes.
Thanks for this information Bluecomet. Just returned from a trip and am having clutch issues (05 1200GS) that need to be investigated.
Parts Layout shows my 2001, R1150 GS, uses part # 21522333411 for the clutch cable.
Is the 1150GSA (adventure) clutch line part #21527682151 ???? And it will fit my 2001 GS?
This thread and the original posts were very helpful for me when I replaced my clutch slave today.
Since the pictures from the original posts were missing I thought I would post a few in case it helps someone out.
First picture shows bike with rear wheel removed, FD supported by jack, rear shock out (only 2 bolts), mud guard/lower half of fuse box removed, muffler removed, tank off. This gave me good access to everything.
Next is a view of the slave from the back just so you can see what to expect.
I removed the slave using a straight socket with a ball end hex socket. Worked like a charm.
So as per some great suggestions in other threads I loosened my handlebars to tilt them forward to gain some extra clutch line slack. The slave can come out between the swing-arm and cross support. I actually removed the bajo's first. It wasn't difficult.
I didn't have a new gasket for my clutch slave so I made one using 1/32" Karropak (Fel-Pro Gasket material). Worked perfect. Only $10 for 18"x36".
Then as per a suggestion from StepToe (thanks) I cut the gasket to allow any fluid to weep out instead of collecting and running down the push-rod (just in case). I read this is something the R1200 design does.
I also packed the clutch slave with bearing grease. GSAddict also pointed out in another thread that the stock slave has almost none and he is 100% correct. Just had a little dab in the middle originally.
As per suggestions from GSAddict I cut back the rubber covering from the supply banjo elbow and sure enough it was rusted big time. by cutting it back you prevent water from getting trapped.
I'm going to get another cable, but GSAddict had another great suggestion. if yours is only slightly rusted, clean and paint with Cold Galvanize. Awesome!
I put a tie wrap at the top of the clutch line around the rubber cover to prevent water from entering the top in the future. I also cut a small hole at the lowest point (just in the rubber covering) to allow any existing moisture to slowly drip out.
GSAddict suggested a tie-wrap at the bottom to prevent the rubber from sliding back over the banjo again. Unfortunately I had already put things back together but the tie-wrap at the top and the weep hole should have me covered. You can actually slide the rubber boot up the clutch line so you don't have to cut anything. It will just sit up higher on the clutch line.
Hope the pictures might be of assistance and help anyone else who has to replace their clutch slave. It really wasn't bad.
And some nice pics.
Thanks for updating with those photos!
Thanks for the new pics. The input shaft rear seal was upgraded by BMW (grey to brown I think). Others have reported early failure on a new slave where they had not renewed the seal. There are two methods to withdraw that seal from the cavity: i) pry with picks or, ii) drill 3/16" hole in old seal, screw in 3" sheet metal screw then yank out with a slide hammer. I found the latter to work very well. Steptoe stated that he drives the new seal <s>all the way in until seated</s>.
edit 11/11/14: GS Addict has shown that the new rear input shaft seal needs to be installed to the factory specified depth, NOT all the way in.
R-R of the control hose does not require loosing the air box or anything else (as claimed later in this thread ). It can easily be fitted. Free the bleed hose from the frame. Drain the system. Use heat ( I used a pocket butane w/pencil frame being careful not to ruin bleed hose ) to loosen the thread lock on the factory contraption at the end of the bleed hose. Discard and replace with a normal bleed screw. Free hose from the master. Withdraw old slave lifting paralever to gain more room. Now it's easy to remove banjos at the slave and withdraw old control hose from bike.
Reattach old control hose to master and flush master thoroughly with DOT3. Why? DoT4 is expensive. Use cheap DOT 3 for bleeding and flushing. Any GL5 that has gotten past the input shaft rear seal needs to be flushed out of the master. Thread new control hose in place. Install it to master and slave using new seal washers. Add more DOT 3 to master. Drop a coin in reservoir to prevent geysering while bleeding. Tilt and tap slave to remove air. After the new hose and slave are installed, more DOT 3 to check for leaks as system pressurizes. If leaking: the right angle banjo on the slave might have to be kicked out some so it will seal on the slave boss. Refasten bleed hose to frame. Final flush with DOT 4 filling master only to minimum level in reservoir. Drain gear box and re-fill with 80w90 non-syn GL5 to clear any DOT4 contamination. Ride bike and repeat gear box flush.
notes: advise against trying to withdraw clutch push rod from the rear- its too easy to damage the end and may be very difficult to accomplish as Poolside explains later in thread. Don't worry about replacing felt (imo) on the pushrod. If this method is used then shortened hex wrenches to loosen hoses while slave is still attached to gear box will not be needed. Replacement of the slave and input shaft rear seal are easy. Don't wait for them to leak, be proactive on any early 1150 that has not yet had this maintenance. It's a lot easier than replacing the clutch and gear box bearings.
For many it may be easier to simply order the Spiegler hose (2" over in black). You can then disconnect the old one at the handlebar and withdraw the slave with hoses attached. Note the routing or pull through a string. I was then able to more easily heat and remove the check valve from the end of the bleeder which I replaced with a standard type.
In the photo above one will note how easy it is for the 90 deg banjo fitting to interfere with the case on reassembly. I installed the banjo several degrees outboard to insure clearance. At first I had not done so and I had a leak at the banjo seal.
Filling and flushing was made easier before attaching slave to the gear box as I could tilt and tap it. I use a 5 gal jug to which I can insert a shop vac hose and the bleed line. Suction like that makes bleeding a breeze.