Rally-Raid Products Honda CB500X

Discussion in 'Vendors' started by ktmmitch, Sep 22, 2014.

  1. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    I think I know the answer to this but wanted to know if I can run beads with the RR tubeless wheels. I'm guessing not but wanted to confirm. I run beads in my other street bikes with no issues.

    Thanks,
  2. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Hi Tangor - do you mean balance beads?

    It's not a product I'm familiar with, but personally I'd not put anything inside the tyre that might ultimately damage or contaminate the vulcanised rubber BART seal - that said, once you're rolling of course the beads are flung out to the inside of the tyre by centrifugal force so no longer touching the central band...

    It might be worth emailing BARTubeless in Italy (if there isn't an FAQ answer on their website already) and asking them to confirm.

    Personally I'd just use a good quality tyre and get it balanced (if required) during fitting.

    Hope that helps...

    Jenny x
  3. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    Hi Jenny,
    Yes I meant balancing beads. Almost as much controversy on that as running car tires :-) . I will avoid the beads and go conventional.

    Thanks for the fast response, front wheel just showed up. The rear wheel to follow unfortunately was lost between Italy and the UK over the holiday :(.



  4. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    View attachment 2087461 I have a '16 non-ABS and when installing the OEM brake disc on the 19" front wheel the instructions indicate to use the thin washer under the head of the OEM shoulder bolt and the thicker washer on the Nyloc side. With the thin washer installed I'm noticing the shoulder bolts rubbing slightly on the inside of the fork leg.

    I'm thinking the thin washers are for the ABS ring and not required for the non-ABS models? There is no reference in the instructions to non-ABS. All shoulder bolts were torqued to 32Nm and double checked.


    Thanks ahead of time.

    Glenn

    Attached Files:

  5. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Hi Glenn - the thin washers are there because the OEM shouldered bolts are slightly longer than the thickness of the disc and spoked-wheel disc spider - and while the cast wheels have a slight recess in them for the shoulder to fit in, the disc spider on the Rally-Raid spoked wheels are not quite as thick as that recess, hence you need to move the shoulder bolt out ever so slightly so you can fully tighten the nyloc and thicker washer on the inside face of the spider.

    Your bolts really shouldn't be touching your fork unless something is wrong with the wheel spacer and or bearing on that side, have you double checked everything is correct - and if you're fitting the wheels to the earlier [2013-18] forks, you are using the supplied aluminium spacers?

    Jenny x
  6. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    Hi Jenny,
    Thanks for the quick response. I am using the supplied axle spaces, they look identical. Will go back through the installation again and see if anything is different. Does the gap between the fork leg and shoulder bolt in the picture seen closer than normal?

    Will keep you posted.

    Thanks,


  7. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    Jenny I took a picture of the OEM shoulder bolt with the thin washer removed and pushed through the disc and disc spider before the thick washer and Nyloc were installed. I see threads protruding through both assemblies.

    The second picture is of the clearance improvement without the washer.
    View attachment 2087492 View attachment 2087493

    Attached Files:

  8. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Hi Glenn - I can't really tell from your photos - the clearance in your second picture looks about right, a few mm. You say the bolt head is actually touching the fork leg as it passes?

    I think you need to drop Rally-Raid an email, as they will know which components were supplied to you - to clarify, you have a 2016 model bike and you've recently ordered the wheels? I understand the latest hubs use the OEM spacers for the 2019-on bikes, but that when the wheels are fitted to 2013-18 bikes, they come with a set of replacement spacers (as the fork dimension is slightly different on the 2019 forks compared to the previous version).

    Therefore, if they supplied you with replacement spacers, then you should have the correct set-up for your particular bike.

    Email them or give them a call - keeping in mind the Rally-Raid factory is GMT, and the close at 4pm on a Friday.

    Sorry I can't get to the bottom of this for you remotely.

    Jenny x
  9. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    Found the issue the lower 8x32 Flange bolt holding the caliper on was protruding slightly through the fork leg mounting location, just enough to make contact with the OEM disc brake shoulder bolts on the wheel.
    Honda parts list doesn't show a washer being required. Both bolts were torqued to 40Nm per the RR installation doc (bottom of page 2), but looking it up elsewhere I'm seeing those should only be torqued to 30Nm. Which could explain the rubbing I encountered. Can anyone confirm those torque values?

    Thanks,
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  10. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Glad you got it sorted - as I say, it sounded like you did everything right.

    OEM supply bolts can vary slightly in spec/quality - although certainly the difference between 30Nm and 40Mn shouldn't make any discernible difference to the length (unless they are made of cheese!)...

    What I tend to do is just use blue thread-lock and do them up tight by hand, with an 8" ratchet handle for example - but if you feel the bolts are slightly protruding, you could always add a washer or swap the bolt for a new one.

    note. Interestingly, Honda do suggest you actually replace the calliper bolts each time you remove the calliper as part of their servicing schedule, but practically speaking that isn't really necessary - especially on a bike where you might be removing and replacing the calliper quite regularly (for cleaning for example) - just don't crank down too hard on them, use thread-lock.

    And sunscreen.

    Jx
  11. Tangor

    Tangor Adventurer Supporter

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    I should have taken a picture of the old bolts it showed them protruding. What gave it away was when I backed off the caliber bolts. Your note on replacing the bolts is spot on, I probably cycled those bolts at least 10 times. On the last cycle while torquing them to 40Nm one of them snapped thankfully I could extract it by hand (whew!). Made a trip to Lowe's and replaced them both with 8x30mm installed with blue thread locker and "snug" :) . I now have another reason to add a 13mm to the tool kit. Seems it's root caused.


    Thanks for the support.
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  12. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    And thank you for highlighting that error - I just checked the Honda workshop manual and as you say, the front calliper bolts should be 30Nm - (I've asked RR to adjust their instructions).

    As I say - personally I just use blue [medium/non-permanent] thread-lock and use a medium size socket wrench (a 3/8th drive tends to be about 8" long) to tighten them and call it good.

    However, as you've found - there comes a time that they should be replaced; and in that regard, while the OEM ones are not that expensive (and usually in stock in a larger dealer as the size is common across a lot of models, and also required regular for service schedule work) - if you do choose to get some aftermarket bolts, don't use stainless steel but regular [typically zinc coated] 8.8 grade steel.

    Jenny x
  13. backroadbender

    backroadbender Been here awhile

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    I am considering switching my rear 4.25 RR rim to a 4.00 to be able to run a 140/ 80. 17 tire. Is there a spastic brand tubeless type rim that would lace up using the same spokes
  14. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Hi Backroad' - unfortunately not... the rims that Rally-Raid use for their wheels come as blanks to the wheel-builder, and are drilled specifically for the spoke pattern of their hubs, so there is unlikely to be anything off the shelf.

    That said, if you/your intended wheel-builder can source a suitable replacement rim un-drilled, then a wheel-building shop might well be able to copy the hole pattern of your existing RR rim (once you've disassembled it) to match the angles required for the spokes?

    In addition, I think you'll find it quite difficult to find a 4.00 rim off the shelf - most 17" rear rims tend to be 4.25 or 4.50 - 4.00 being more of an OEM supply size rather than widely available - it's the reason Rally-Raid started out using the 4.25 rims originally, as 4.00 were just not available unless you were prepared to buy them in manufacturer quantities at a time.

    fwiw. if you intention is to run a more narrow 140 width rear tyre anyway, I would fit a 3.50 width rim which is what Rally-Raid now use on all their CB500X and G310GS rear wheels. It offers a much better profile for a 140 width all-terrain style tyre (and for info is the OEM width of the BMW F700GS for example, which also has a 140 rear tyre fitted as standard).

    Don't forget to get a rim with a tubeless bead seat if you intention is to convert it to tubeless too.

    Hope that helps!

    Jenny x
  15. sscardefield

    sscardefield Adventurer

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    For those of you running the R&G kickstand shoe with your Rally Raid extended kickstand, did you have to shim it at all? I just put mine on and it is not snug at all, it rattles a lot. It is the PKS0016SI and I got it from Rally Raid with my suspension kit.
  16. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    Yes, they can be a little loose - although the R&G shoe should come with a little foam self-adhesive pad you are meant to stick inside the base before you put it on to stop that happening...

    Personally speaking though (I have one on my bike), after a while that foam pad wears, so I'd suggest you cut a small square of rubber (old inner tube will do) and put that under the base of the stand before you fit the shoe (instead of the foam).

    Also, be aware that the screws that hold the top plate on are rather short, and are only tapped part the way into the base. If you're unlucky you can catch the shoe on a rock with enough force that the top plate bends and/or the screws come undone and ping out. Thread lock them certainly, and ultimately after I really hammered mine on a rock, I drilled all the way through the base plate and tapped the thread, and used longer screws.

    Sounds like a bit of a faff but it's worth it to make it rock solid.

    Jenny x
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  17. backroadbender

    backroadbender Been here awhile

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    Thanks for your reply yes it does help the 400 rim is hard to find . Not all rim sizing charts are equal , the 350 rim makes much more sense. Thanks again for you help .
  18. sscardefield

    sscardefield Adventurer

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    I figured that was the case, just wanted to verify. Thanks!
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  19. sscardefield

    sscardefield Adventurer

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    So has there been any talk of making the graphics kit (in particular the red, white and blue) for the 2019/2020 model? I absolutely love the way that color scheme looks with the gold wheels.
  20. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Unicorn breeder

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    There has been some talk - and certainly off the back of this year's Dakar Rally win, it would be nice to have a 'celebratory' HRC decal kit appropriate for the current model.

    However, the issue - indeed ever since 2015 when Honda started clear-coating over then tank portion of their graphics - is that any graphic would essentially have to cover the existing (or at least compliment it design and colour wise) - and there is always the issue that it wouldn't sit completely flat over an existing decal - even though the OEM Honda ones are very thin and smooth.

    for info. The nice thing about the 2013 and 14 bikes (with the original 'urban camo' X decal), is there were no decals at all on the tank itself, just the fairing sides - and these were not lacquered over. However, from 2015 and onwards the OEM graphics' design was changed and extended to the sides of the tank (mainly in the knee area) and protected with clear-coat, while the 2019-on bikes now even have the tread pattern graphic over the top of the tank (in a similar way that the Rally-Raid Heritage and CRF Rally graphics run down front the fairing sides towards the seat). So in that regard, a much larger decal will now have to be designed to cover those, and as you might already appreciate, is correspondingly going to be harder to apply neatly.

    note. The professional option of course is to remove the OEM decals entirely, but that is very difficult to do neatly unless you also plan to repaint the tank too - as I did with my own red tank and black and white Rally decals, which was originally a 2015 model tank with yellow decals) - and not really something that is realistic for the majority of owners to undertake I suspect?

    So at this stage it's not an immediate priority, however, I think everyone at Rally-Raid can see the appeal, and indeed would like to not only celebrate the Honda Dakar Rally win this year, but be able to offer an alternative style to the OEM factory decals.

    Jenny x
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