Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Bli55, Jan 18, 2014.
No need to yell!:huh
5 outer cable holder on the trottle body, thats it
Back to the Topic, nice work!, i`m a bit concerned about the lowered footpegs, in cause of a fall they create a lot of leverage on the expensive alloy frameparts.
Because of the question above I looked up your throttle body pic again, If you decide to put heated grips on you`ll need the second spring again, the wiring of the grip is a too big resistance to close the throtlle
Good idea, but it seems to be strong enough with only 1 spring! For sure, I will check when back on the road thoroughly...
You're right, it's not ideal when you have an X-rack...
But the main reason I didn't want to mount it with the supplied bracket like you show here (http://www.advrider.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23213575&postcount=306), is because it looks oh too similar to the Leo Vince mounting method and looks like it MAY rotate, slip down and burn through the water hose.
When mounting through a solid bush, it is only the play in the rubber-mount that you'd be concerned about, but it's self-centering and shouldn't oscillate anywhere near enough to touch things...
More update writing up!
One day, we decided to crash test my X-tank. Using the correct tools
We achieved sufficient destruction.
On a serious note though, this should now stop my luggage cable chewing through the tank.
I look up the pictures of initial problem if anybody wants to see, but I was extremely lucky it didnt wear a hole right the way through!
Also bent back into shape the brackets which are supposed to slot into the seat and hold it in place. Up to now, they were bent down and without knowing, my seat was just resting on top, getting chewed up and pivoting only on the lock and little bolt in the plastic air box
Ordered some offcuts of metal and set to cutting them up.
For the footpeg relocation, went for 10 mm thick 6082 T6 aluminium plate, so it required some strategic planning to help with the cuts.
Whilst in there, cut off extra hanging down piece of sidestand bracket that used to protect the safety switch.
Then turned to replacing horns and mounting bracket. Old horns burned out for some reason and the bracket felt quite weak. Repeated with thicker 2 mm alloy sheet (5251 anodised grade) and cut only the major lightening holes:
This bent tying together bracket you see is now made from 2 mm stainless steel, whereas the previous alu version did, in fact, snap off.
At least this shows it to be really working and taking some of the load.
I forgot what a pain in the ass it was 1st time round as theres so little space!
Still not happy how the brake reservoir sits there, so should rebend that part sometime later.
Done! Keeping full airflow to the RR.
Recut M8 to M6 to allow easy switch back to previous model.
And extended one of the stumps to accommodate the extra tying together bracket.
Now, the really interesting bits!!!
Let me tell you, to cut 10 mm aluminium with a hand held jigsaw is not so easy. The cuts were very rough and I spent HOURS filing and filing to smooth, correct and bring back into shape.
One of the holes needed threading
After some more sanding, washing, final touches and light scoring to give it a brushed finish, the result:
This update will tie up remaining loose ends and end with the current state of my bike.
(except the exhaust, that needs to wait until later).
Im happy to report its been back on the road coming on to 2 weeks now, passed an MOT inspection and has been getting waaay too dirty!
I have always wanted a chain oiler but never got round to making one on previous bikes
As a first shot, I gave this idea a try:
Spent really long to get the streams in exactly the right places and get them equal.
A bit useless as had to make a new one, this time tried to make more clearance fom the chain.
It was also a futile attempt, as during a mild weekend ride it got chewed clean off..
Anyway, before that I was sorting out the tail section.
Needed to get into a deep hole to replace a missing bolt.
Whilst in there, did the wiring for additional stop light. Learned this trick to splice into existing from a friendly forum:
First, the connector is removed.
Then the outer tabs get unbent and used them to secure the 2nd cable.
Then got it soldered and shrinkwrapped. Kind of tried to match the wiring colour from a big pile of offcuts.
The stock mini loom feeding plate light and indicators was very messy, as you can see. :huh
So I cleaned it up, got rid of all those weird bunches of earth wires, added the stop light wire and organized a new mini loom.
Brake light prepped, connector sorted, conduit, sealant, per usual process.
Piece of crap design, to have a bolt head be melted into plastic body! It was a real pain to remove as it has already tightened in place before it let go
The only option after breaking them out was epoxy. So while that was curing
Mocked up a piece of this.
Brake pedal required lots of abuse to bring it back into shape, so stripped it right back and painted both at once.
Whilst there, decided to do something about the rubbish folding mechanism. This is as far as it would go before.
With some material ground away, range is ok
Whilst waiting for the primer to dry, turned my attention to this radiator protection edge.
It got totally destroyed, I guess the tubing wasnt up to the job.
This is all that came out:
Conduit to the rescue!!
With relocated pegs, the controls needed to go down too. Gear pedal, no problem. As for the brake, I needed to order another adjuster made. Because the previous was alloy, it was wearing out and pedal would come higher.
So for the new I got stainless steel and played a little Pacman with it.
With all this in hand, it was time to install the goodies!!!!!
Gear lever can still be removed, thanks to the cut out.
Pegs have been lowered about 35 mm and canted forward about 10-12 degrees.
And, despite looking quite massive
Whilst reinstalling plastics, the airbox cover just wouldnt go. Probably because of the extra cables just getting in the way, so made extra space for them.
Meanwhile, rear light epoxy has cured and was ready to install.
..but discovered yet another glitch! Can anyone guess what went wrong this time?
Connecting 6 rings for the ground, 4 rings for positive and indicators' terminals whilst avoiding any shorts and dealing with too short wiring was a real pain.
Eventually, I stuffed in together and slapped on yet more conduit, man, I love that stuff!
This was the final job of a friday night before I could take it out for a spin, which ended up being well into the saturday
First, 800gs fender was cut yet again.
Piece of aluminium tube was cut for spacers
that got melted into the too big holes of some second hand KTM fork shields.
Temporarily, this is how it looks now.
As a final note, heres my garage again. I took out everything, scrubbed the floor with fairy and a pressure washer, wiped all shelves and stuff, then put things back one by one after making sure each is clean and in its place.
Well worth the effort, ain't it?
All set for the second stage of this build! Just waiting and collecting parts, and, more importantly, some mental energy
Thanks for reading!
I find that my coolant level still drops afer a ride. Would've imagined it should be over now...
Took off the radiator cap to check there's pressure and seemed OK. Whilst in there, decided to completely flush the system as I couldn't do it before, when the engine wasn't running. So back then I just poured new coolant in and let them mix.
Now though, I cleaned all trace of what was in there and refilled with new coolant again (Motul Inugel optimal ultra or something...).
So after all this rigmarole I find this:
<iframe width="853" height="480" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/K3EklS05b_E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Actually, I spotted a few drops there earlier but wrote it off as having a little coolant trapped between the hose and the pipe on the outside of the hose clamp just getting pushed out.
Now though, I'm sure I couldn't get a good seal with the new clamp from the first time it went on, so sort of happy but annoyed at the same time.
Why is it not sealing properly? :eek1
It's the right size hose on the right size pipe with the right size clamp that's on there nice and tight..Any ideas? Shitty clamp? Overtightened? Perished hose??
Some pics from last weekend's ride. The one when I hoped not to get too dirty.
So I cleaned it. Thoroughly.
This weekend, I stuck to dry gravel and clean tracks. Right up until they ran out.
I really need to stop getting my bike so dirty. Had to wash it again...
...or just stop washing altogether.
Yesterday I took off the front end.
Interestingly, the top bearing was seized onto the steering stem and it needed agressive banging to free up and release the lower triple.
I think my bearings are toast, too...
Whilst still assembled, I could feel definite "notching" in the middle position, see video:
<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="640" height="480" data="https://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=145061" classid="clsid27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000"> <param name="flashvars" value="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=e0b332003c&photo_id=14457943042"></param> <param name="movie" value="https://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=145061"></param> <param name="bgcolor" value="#000000"></param> <param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="https://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=145061" bgcolor="#000000" allowfullscreen="true" flashvars="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=e0b332003c&photo_id=14457943042" height="480" width="640"></embed></object>
Trying to replicate it with loosely fitting the parts didn't work, and neither were there visible indents on the outer races. I will replace them nonetheless, as I don't have experience dealing with broken steering bearings and so knowing if they are OK!
Here it goes, I got a pair of unused, packaged Factory Shivers, a final pair floating around at the UK official distributor who now only do bicycle suspension. Must be pretty rare and at the price they were, a huge piece of luck, considering these forks are discontinued (?)?
Comparison to the stockers reveal a pleasing similarity. Not all is perfect however, the lower clamping diameter is 58.4 mm, not 57.
There's no need to service the forks and there's no way I'm doing a full tear-down just to machine the outer legs. Several places I spoke to either weren't able to undertake a machining job on entire forks or charged an extortionate amount.
Other than that, saves me a lot of work. No need to disassembly + the axle clamps are compatible!!
You will notice the stock fork is missing its ABS sensor holder. This is how it looks and I tend to re-use it as opposed to making a new bracket.
Axle diameters - check! Axle offset - not sure, looks like the Factorys' is larger?
They shall be able to give a bit more travel if needed (although the shop specced them at 265 mm).
Quick mock-up looks very promising! Oh, if only I had a custom machined lower triple with 58.4 mm.....
Slight difference in shape of axle clamps has no negative effect on axle nut thread engagement. shoud be good as it is, but I have an idea which can also improve this a little.
An added bonus is there is no need to Dremel the new clamp to fit my motion pro tool.
My reasoning to use stock ABS holder is simple: because it is essentially a wheel spacer, I don't need to worry about getting a new longer one (read: non-ABS model), it places the sensor as perfectly as before and really happy to find out it won't really need an additional bracket like I originally planned in order to tie it together with the axle clamp (as per stock arrangement).
I found that simple hand-tightening of the axle nut already jams the holder in position, so under normal torque it will be completely solid!
Additionally, I can rotate it out of the way to loosen pinch bolts, for example, or place it further away from road dangers than stock.
PS. Forgot to add, the forks were originally made for Yamaha YZ and have a "Cross" setting. The guys in the shop said this most certainly means the springs are 4.5 as opposed to 4.2 in the "enduro" shivers. Not sure about the valving though...
That is good news that you can reuse the ABS sensor bracket.
What are your plans for the Brake caliper? will you get an adapter?
I have the same marzo Shivers and I'm debating what to do about the larger diameter fork tube at the lower triple clamp.
Maybe make a fixture that rotates the fork against a beltsander!?
OK, can you guess where this is going??
That's right, I gave in to the temptation put out by Ebrabaek, in particular, and dived...dipped my toe in the fascinating (and painful) world of composites!
On our bikes, this must be the simplest piece:
Except at this opportunity I decided to make a slightly extended version, so sculpted the extra areas with a combination of blu-tac and some wax.
The lay up itself went ok, even thought I messed a lot...
Eventually, got to this stage:
Mate great read so far! I wish I has the confidence and knowledge to do even half of what you've done!
Did you by the carbon fibre components as raw materials I'm tempted by a starter kit but imagine it will be hugely marked up for my convenience 😄
Alt_Red, big thanks! I was also crapping myself when a larg-ish pot of epoxy was about to go bang... The key is to get started and dive right in.
Next, for completeness' sake, a few gaps before writing on the composite parts... I was putting this off since that quick and easy Flickr app stopped working and all the linking I must now do by hand.
Chain oiler - copper tube installed higher still. The droplets don't separate and its quite messy at the rear because most oil gets on the centre of sprocket teeth. Might play with more viscous oils or remake the delivery tube somehow!
Changed oil+filter after 1200 km only - will do one more quick change then go back to normal but reduced intervals.
Got a thinner washer to provide a little more clearance.
Really though it was because of the oil return pipe that I started shopping for thin copper washers. After a surprisingly long search, I found these:
Reason being that with those thick washers it was just enough to make the bolt head protrude enough down to make it dig into the bashplate when bike was on the lift stand and compressing the rubber mounts. Since I was unscrewing the return line anyway, also decided to give the exposed rusty surface a quick coat of paint.
Much neater! (see pics of this second hand pipe when it first arrived)
Result! Even with bike on the bashplate, there's now a little clearance. Under heavy hits the rubber mounts MAY distort more...Perhaps I'll file off the sharp corner edge a little.
Here's another one of those time-consuming tiny niggles that take forever to sort out. This one carried over from last year! Basically, in the process of eliminating fastners with strange sizes the OEM bleed screws stood out like a sore thumb (?). I didn't fancy grinding the hex flats on them, so ordered some Hel stainless steel bleeders and....ground them instead!
I was very happy considering this was done by hand on a grinder wheel. But, putting them into the calipers didn't quite work...Yep, wrong cone angle!!! AARRRRR!!!
So I bought different ones, making sure it was now 90 degrees.
They also had 11mm hex, so I ground them down to 10mm also.
Now, the stock bleeders are covered by a boot without tether (on the right). I didn't like that, and actually already lost one in Iceland.
The new screws with their much meatier head, pleasantly, matched the tethered caps found on our oil reservoir drain nipple!
After a call to the dealer...I went on ebay and found a guy who deals Brembo parts for Porches, Mercedes etc. and got the exact same boots.
At last, everything fits, everything seals, there's no gaps, all is tight and well. Best of all is bleeding brakes with a 10mm spanner.
Talking about the oil reservoir, here's something I added recently. It turned out that to check oil lever when you have luggage on the bike is a major PITA, so I tended to avoid it. Now it will be possible to check it without removing the seat.
What needs doing is pull the other end of the tube, unplug it (i found some rubber boot that just fits), then crack open the drain nipple and let the level equalise - marks on the tank are calibrated to the dipstick of course.
When done, a quick blow down the tube sends the oil back inside (otherwise it leaks past the thread eventually), whilst catching it and tightening the nipple. Done!
Finally, aluminium does not like vibration.
It was obvious on the very first idle when the whole thing was wobbling like crazy, but I passed the MOT inspection and wanted to see how long it lasts.
Surprisingly not long at all!
Anyway, I put the indicator back to the original place (the vibration didn't do them much good, some failed, some simply came off the circuit board and were rattling inside....
It is then I realised there was no need for an extra bracket as I could simply put the numberplate lights onto... numberplate.
More to come.
Carrying on with the lay-up process.
After overnight cure, popped right off.
Until this first-hand experience, I never really understood the purpose of making parts via a negative mould.
I do now. It makes the appearance that we are all so used to when imagining carbon fibre (this isn't, by the way).
Nice and smooth, with the underlying shine of the fibers.
Whereas on the other side - exposed fibers, agressive texture. I sort of like it as well...
Anyway, after a trim and drill I gave it a quick sand and did a "rub" of epoxy, followed by drying in the sun.
You can just about notice the white-ish marks left on the higher fibres during sanding. These marks won't completely disappear after a rub...
Messed up a little on the trimming, but OK for now for a 1st try.
Next, heat shield.
First, I taped off all exposed places.
Next, went to make epoxy clay. I wasn't really sure of what to do here, so mixed up 300 grams of resin and did it in stages. Surprisingly, almost a kilo of plaster powder went in!! It was ridiculously messy, until the "dough" became a little cured and full of plaster...
As per Ebrabaek's tips, rolled it out uniformly.
Unfortunately, when I went to trasfer it onto the pipe, it became a little too hard and I just missed the moment to shape and confrom it the way I wanted.
Prosthetic limb, no?
So after overnight cure, I resorted to sanding...LOOOONG time after, starting to take shape, literally.
Then the placement of holes.
Reason being that I wanted to make "plateaus" for nice mating to the bolt head and the attachment tabs.
Then a nice thick coat of epoxy and overnight cure.
Next day, it was ready to lay-up. I went for 4 layers of Carbon/Twaron. Lesson learned so used a generous excess for overhang.
Also tried to pre-saturate flat sheets rather than trying to do it on the mould - this worked much much nicer!!
And this you already saw...
Overnight cure...then few hours in the sun and popped them apart. What a satisfying feeling!
Now it weighed in at 67 grams. The fabric itself was 45 grams, which makes this a perfect 2:1 ratio - although definitely looked dry when doing it. Maybe should use a bit more resin regardless.
Next, trimming, sanding, sanding, sanding...Here's where I messed up the finish. First, the dremel slipped and gouged the surface in a few places. Made a stupid looking cut out that turned out to be totally unnecessary.
More annoyingly, I for some reason decided to put a thick top layer of resin on, thinking it will smooth out the surface.
Then, when sanding it down after overnight cure, made those white marks all over the piece. Should've known by now that Twaron really doesn't respond well to sanding.
After a final rub and a cure, we have this:
Then it was time to cure it under heat, being made with high-temperature epoxy.
After a few hours at 50 deg C, ramped up the temp to about 160 over 6-7 hours, then let cool slowly and left overnight.
Meanwhile, sorted out the heat resistant gaskets.
For the front ended up isolating the entire pipe clamp to try and reduce the heat getting throught the bolt. I'll see later if this works.
Good coverage of the fuel tank.
Looks a bit...don't know, not quite right..maybe too massive, or something with the shape.
But, still nicer than scrap!
Before and after:
Rear brake master shield - 11 g, or a 60% weight saving.
Exhaust shield ~ 35 g, or a 75 % weight saving. :eek1
That looks really good, and your observations will serve you great. There are so many technique that can be done to achieve the same results, so don't be afraid to experiment.
I bought a brand new set of Shivers from the USA a couple of years ago and had the new forks internals retrofitted to the oem forks, just needed some machining to the lower fork legs/axle mount to allow the adjustment down there.
By far the easiest and cheapest way of getting it all to work.
Sold the new parts and the unneeded old parts and recouped a fair amount of the cost. It was a huge improvement over the oem forks. (Write up in large Xch thread or front suspension thread a few years ago.)
Lower triple clamp has been bored out to 58.4 mm.... :eek1
I know, I know, not the best solution...but will do for now..time's pressing!
Starter a little progress on the forks.
Snapped a pair of micro bleeders off ebay.
I want to make a brake caliper adapter, so been going back and forth with the forks, keeping the wheel still, marking holes, checking clearances etc...
With the position of caliper hanger relative to brake disc nailed, I could rotate the wheel and experiment with various placements, taking into account bolt heads and the possibility of using bolts and nuts over threaded aluminium holes where possible.
My measurements showed that the stock axle clamp's inner surfaces of caliper hanger mounting holes (:huh ) is 5.5-6.0 mm closer to the surface of brake disc that those on my new Shivers.
You can sort of see it here...Also illustrating tight clearance of rotor riding inside the "groove", both axial and radial... I really need to get this bit bang on!
Mocked up the fender too...
If this goes as planned, should work beautifully!
PS. Yes, OK, KTM provides an easy way out - 60 GBP and a few washers, but where's the fun in that!??
Hope you don't ride too hard.
Those triple clamps were never the biggest/strongest in the first place. My suspension guy looked at them long and hard and decided he would not take to them to make the fork leg fit. He didn't want to be responsible for anything.
Wouldn't it have been a lot easier to just fit the oem lower axle/brake assembly to the new forks?
Then everything just fits up same as before!