RX3+R3 = XT3 TENERE

Discussion in 'Some Assembly Required' started by 79thunder, Feb 11, 2018.

  1. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    Back to the bike and some of the not so exciting but necessary bits.
    Electrical and wiring ! oh boy !

    Honestly, not very difficult, I think most bikes are really very similar.

    I had a bit of an advantage as the crew at CSC includes a fantastic service manual, both on paper and on CD, full warranty information, service recommendations, break-in proceedures as well as an easy to read wiring diagram....
    DSCF0048 (640x480).jpg

    DSCF0049 (640x480).jpg


    For the Yamaha, I had nothing...
    No problem, I used most of the wiring harness from the Yamaha, from just in front of the taillights to the steering head.

    Using the Yamaha switch gear may have been easier, but it was in poor condition. I think the bike must have been stored outside from day one.

    I decided to retain all of my switchgear and throttle, clutch and ignition components.
    This also meant I was able to retain the keyed-alike function of my ignition, fuel fill and luggage.

    I simply rewired the harness at the neck area one switch at a time.

    I'm not going to show the process, but I can show the results...
    #41
    plumer1kt, Pezz_gs and JagLite like this.
  2. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    This is the original guage cluster from the RX3.
    I quite like the symmetrical design.
    Full function with speedo, tach, gear indicator, fuel guage, clock, trip odo., etc..

    DSCF0101 - Copy (640x480).jpg

    I used the Yamaha guages because all of the Yamaha's engine sensors (temperature, oil pressure, tach, speed, fuel level etc) were all of a different resistance or voltage value.
    I likely could have converted it, but it was kind of a 3 strikes and your out rule.
    I did have to install the Yamaha fuel sender in my tank.

    Installing the Yamaha guages was entirely uneventful.
    I was looking forward to fabricating, welding, bending, and painting a mounting bracket.
    Instead, I drilled 2 holes and I was done.

    DSCF0040 - Copy (640x480).jpg

    I may add a charging port in the lower right. I later fabricated and installed a filler panel under the guages to givea more finished look. I do have a little wiring to tidy up yet.

    Functionally, very much the same. Speedo, tach, fuel level, temp, oil pressure, trip odometer, gear indicator, etc..
    There are even a couple of extra features that I will have to play with, including average and instant fuel economy, oil change trip meter, shift light, etc.


    Of course, the important part is that everything works, all lights, horn, indicators, fans, fuel pump, relays, etc..

    It Lives !!!

    Wired up and Fired up !
    DSCF0035 (640x480).jpg



    I have some small wiring chores to go back and revisit, I will likely take advantage of this handy little switch one day for heated gear or auxillary lights. For now, the switch is wired up and the loose ends will get tucked away.

    DSCF0039 (640x480).jpg
    #42
    plumer1kt, Huck369, Pezz_gs and 5 others like this.
  3. MidnightRider15

    MidnightRider15 Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2017
    Oddometer:
    44
    Nice work, and a nice write up! Interested to see how this franken-bike goes down the road....and dirt!
    #43
    79thunder likes this.
  4. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West



    Thanks!
    I'm really looking forward to it as well.

    I am reasonably confident that it will be just what I'm looking for.
    I had done a fair amount of reading and research on the Yamaha R3 motorcycle and the engine beforehand, but nothing beats a test drive!


    The first thing I did when I brought the donor bike home was take it for a rip!
    My main area of concern was the low speed throttle response and low rpm torque.

    So, I took the bike off-road!
    Just down a local trail that has some slow speed technical sections and a decent hill climb.


    The engine is perfect. I'm not sure what I was concerned about.
    I thought it might be a little "high strung" with no low end torque.
    I found it to be quite the opposite. It's a modern fuel injected bike. Low speed driveability is outstanding.
    Smooth and predictable delivery during the tight technical spots.
    Puttzing around, you can bog it down near 500 rpm's before you need to clutch or shift.

    Off-road it was difficult to tell how fast the bike will be.
    The trail was covered in loose, dry leaves and grass making it impossible to
    get the michelin pilot's to hook up! With decent tires, I think it'll rip it up quite nicely.
    Wheelies will be traction dependant. (not that I'm any good at 'em)

    On the pavement, it's a sweatheart.
    Around town you can cruise along quietly, quick shifting before 5000 rpm's without announcing "hey everyone, look at me".
    Or run it up a little higher and zip through traffic and down the merge ramps.
    Hit the open highway or the twisty paved backroads and run the tach up the top for the fun stuff. (Red line is roughly 12k rpm)

    Cruising at 130 km/hr (80 miles/hr) at just a hair under 8000rpm's, the bike was super smooth with zero vibration in the bars or pegs, with plenty of reserve power on tap.
    It will pull hard up to 175 km/hr after that it begins to taper off a little, I reached a max speed of 199 km/hr as indicated on the speedometer, but I'm not certain that it can physically read higher than that?

    Certainly much faster than I need to travel.
    What I was looking for was the abilitly to maintain highway speeds (let's say 120 km/hr) in any riding conditions. (wind, hills, etc.)
    With some reserve power on tap for passing or maintaining a comfortable buffer zone. I'll have that and more.


    Having very similar weights, wheelbases, rear tire diameters and gearing between the R3 and RX3, I have a pretty solid idea of what the results will be.



    There seems to be many very happy Versys 300x (and GS310)owners on this forum and they should be, I think It's a great bike(s). So, I'm sure I'm on the right track.

    I know that I will have more power throughout the range than the 298cc Kawi (or 310) engine, It should be lighter than a similarily equipped Versys 300x and I'll have a little better rear subframe, crash bars, serviceability, maintainence schedule, etc.


    I'm also hoping to end up with a little more cash in my pocket than I would have if I had purchased any other adventure bike on the market.



    .
    #44
    plumer1kt, Huck369, Pezz_gs and 3 others like this.
  5. Rick4003

    Rick4003 Adventurer

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2012
    Oddometer:
    86
    Location:
    Denmark
    Very nice build and well thought out! It is also very nice to hear your thoughts on the Zong motor, I have been considering to use it for a trial bike build for the fun of it. If it has the low tractability as you say then it should be a pretty good match. Although a bit heavy for a true trials bike, but I am not so concerned about that. It is not the point to build a top class bike to compete with Toni Bou, only for my own entertainment.

    Looking forward to see the video with your bike!
    -Ulrik
    #45
    JagLite and 79thunder like this.
  6. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    Thank you.

    The Zongshen motor is very smooth and controllable, the fuel injection delivery is excellent.
    I did find that first gear was a little tall, requiring some clutch slip to get moving.
    If I planned on heading to the trails, I would usually install a 13 tooth front sprocket (stock is 14), I found that much better off-road.

    Of course, with a trials bike you would likely want even steeper gears.

    Sounds like a fun project, I'd love a trials bike to play with!
    #46
    Rick4003 and JagLite like this.
  7. greasyfatman

    greasyfatman Long timer

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2014
    Oddometer:
    2,523
    Just looked up some dyno runs of the r3. That torque curve is suprisingly flat. Really great build. How is first gear with the new motor?
    #47
    79thunder likes this.
  8. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    Thank you.
    The torque curve has a nice steady climb to it. I wouldn't quite call it flat.

    The Yamaha R3 engine pulls really nicely throughout the range, I was surprised at how well it pulled even at lower rpm's.
    There are no flat spots, it is a really a fun, enjoyable engine at any rpm. Definately pulls harder than the Kawasaki 300X.

    I was concerned that it was going to be a little high strung, but that is not the case at all.
    You can easily cruise around town between 2500-5000 rpm if you like, it has enough torque in that range to keep up with, or overtake normal traffic.
    Off road, the same can be said. Again, I was able to lug it down well below 1000 rpm.
    The fuel delivery is spot-on. No flat spots, no hesitations and not twitchy or jerky either.

    Anytime you like, twist the throttle and peg the fun meter.
    Of course the engine does rev very freely and running it up to 12 000rpm puts a grin on my face every time.


    I think it has a very nice balance between smooth, controllable and predictable power delivery and fun, spirited, lively performance.


    The Honda 471cc engine found in the 500x has a very broad and very flat torque curve (it's not really even a curve), Which should be ideal.
    My experience with it was well... boring. It lacks character.
    I think it's a great engine, very refined, very reliable, but very Honda-like.

    Those are great attributes for a gas powered generator or the family sedan, but not what I want from my motorcycle.
    I don't need a full-on race bike, but a little attitude is fine by me.
    Bike time is fun time for me, so I want a fun bike!


    As far as the gearing goes, the Yamaha has a lower, (more normal?) useful first gear than the original RX3 does.
    (The Yamaha is : 1st 2.5 , 2nd 1.824 , 3rd 1.348 , 4th 1.087 , 5th .092 , 6th .080 )
    I don't think I will be changing the sprockets ratios at all.
    #48
  9. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2010
    Oddometer:
    415
    Location:
    Ultima Thule
    Wait, are you saying that the stock R3 went all the way to an indicated speed in of 199 km/h? Either the speedometer is way off or that bike packs some serious power. My SV650S only manages to get up to about 210 km/h and has on paper almost twice the amount of power as the R3.

    Really like the build, both because it looks very well put together and because it’s a interesting insight into the state of current motorcycle manufacturing. Seems like you’ll have a lot of useful/fun miles ahead of you.
    #49
  10. Lesharoturbo

    Lesharoturbo Nerdly Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2009
    Oddometer:
    2,935
    Location:
    Austin TX
    That speed is after the motor swap.
    #50
  11. Eatmore Mudd

    Eatmore Mudd Mischief on wheels.

    Joined:
    May 28, 2012
    Oddometer:
    3,266
    Location:
    Wet side of WA.
    79thunder I foresee bidding wars coming over R3 engines and RX3's.

    Nice Grail build.
    #51
    JagLite and 79thunder like this.
  12. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    Yes, the stock Yamaha R3 went an indicated 199km/hr. I held it at 199 for a couple of minutes, trying to hit the magic 200km/hr.
    (not something I normally do, it was a one time, get-it-out-of-my-system thing)
    I did feel as though I picked up a couple of km/hr after the indicated 199.
    It was only after returning home did I realize that the display may not be capable of reading higher. Don't get me wrong, the bike was maxed out.
    I believe I was sitting at around 12 000 Rpm's on a completely deserted flat highway. There is supposed to be a rev limiter at 13 500, I didn't get there.

    (this might give you a better idea of what I mean, I don't think it can read over 199)

    yamaha R3 speedo (640x359).jpg




    I did not have a GPS mounted, it was my one and only test drive, the bike was taken apart the next day.
    I also did not have the presence of mind to switch the speedometer to miles/hour at the time.

    From what I understand, the speedo is reasonably accurate (+5%) from what I can gather on the R3 forums from guys running the bikes at the track compared to the recorded trap speeds on the back straight aways and other members with GPS devices.


    I certainly don't want to make any claims without firsthand knowledge, so I think it would be safe to say that 190 km/hr top speed with a GPS under optimal riding conditions. How's that?


    I am certain that it won't reach those speeds in the RX3. There will be a small weight penalty and it won't be nearly as aerodynamic.
    I am also certain that I won't care.

    I normally cruise at or near the speed limit, enjoying the scenery. For myself it is more about the time spent than the distance travelled.

    I'm over having the fastest, biggest, brightest, newest, most expensive, most gadget laden, blah, blah, blah...

    And honestly, It's a very satisfying place to be.
    There is always going to be someone with a bigger, faster bike. Untill next year when his bike is also superceded.


    As far as the current state of the market stands, I think there are finally some great bikes out now, and more coming. The GS310, the Verysys 300X
    and the upcoming T7. All of which I think were long overdue.
    I think that as consumers, we have been told what to buy and what we need for far too long...

    (don't get me started on Heavy duty diesel trucks hauling kids to hockey practice!)

    I believe many of the new Versys 300 owners have been receiving marketing surveys specifically asking them why they purchased the bikes.
    It is as if the research had indicated that there was no demand for such a product.

    Interesting.
    The good news is that at least there seems to be some choices available for all tastes, budgets and perceived needs now.

    I also know that I'm going to end up perfectly happy with my bike.
    If not, it's my own damn fault!
    Not because I caved in to peer pressure or marketing tactics that convinced me to buy a bike that wasn't what I wanted/needed.




    No, that was on the test drive of the Yamaha R3 donor bike before dissassembly.
    I haven't been able to take the "new" bike for a ride yet. It is not quite done yet, and I'm still fairly snow bound, It won't be long though!
    #52
  13. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West
    Thank you.
    I'm not sure there will be any bidding wars though.

    I am very surprized that the R3 engine hasn't found its' way into a Wr250 chassis yet. I was very tempted.
    I had a Wr250 that was in excellent condition, the problem I struggled with is that it is very good at what it is intended to do.
    I had also tried, unsuccesfully, to make a couple of dual sports better on-road.
    This time, I thought I would try something different.

    I should also mention that CSC and Zongshen will also be releasing the RX4, a 450cc single and the RX3s, a 380cc twin.
    Those 2 will nicely fill in some of the gaps in the marketplace. (about 18-24 months for the RX4 and one additional year for the twin)

    I think either of those would be very interesting. But I think they should have been here yesterday.
    Easy to say, tough to do.
    From what I understand Zongshen is being very thorough with testing the engines/bikes before production.
    Which is how it should be of course.
    I just hope they don't miss the opportunity to gain a foothold in what may become a competitive small/midsize adventure bike market.


    I knew I wasn't willing to wait for Zongshen (or Yamaha's T7 and there isn't even a T3 rumor yet!), I'd rather be riding!



    .
    #53
    JagLite likes this.
  14. Lesharoturbo

    Lesharoturbo Nerdly Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2009
    Oddometer:
    2,935
    Location:
    Austin TX
    Thanks for the correction. It seems that I also misread the post.
    #54
  15. Eatmore Mudd

    Eatmore Mudd Mischief on wheels.

    Joined:
    May 28, 2012
    Oddometer:
    3,266
    Location:
    Wet side of WA.
    Cruisers have flat lined, sport bikes have tanked. Adventure bikes are the growth segment in a shrinking sales market.

    Interest in light and medium ADV bikes is on the rise or we wouldn't have G310GS, VersysX-300 Talley 250 and Himalayan. With a 450 and 380 Zongshen is playing it smart.
    #55
    79thunder and JagLite like this.
  16. M.T. Hawk

    M.T. Hawk Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2018
    Oddometer:
    40
    Location:
    Fla
    Great build you do really nice work. I believe I got the second 500f in FLORIDA I couldn't wait on the 500x put lots of gravel road miles on it. What do you think of strip r3 gravel
    Runner with a taller rear shock ,spring in front and your beautiful exhaust.
    Please more pictures of your exhaust and cross over h pipe. thanks
    #56
    79thunder likes this.
  17. 79thunder

    79thunder Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Oddometer:
    273
    Location:
    Out West

    I would be curious to know what percentage of Versys 300 and G310s buyers are new to the market (first adventure bike) - versus how many are down sizing from bigger, heavier adventure bikes?
    From what I can tell it's a mix of both for sure.
    And there are those who are keeping the bigger bike for awhile ( or for now), the smaller one is for fun/ running around.


    Thank you very much.


    I'm not sure how that would work out. The R3 is pretty ugly without the plastics !!
    I didn't even take a picture of mine without it!

    The easy way would be to start with a MT-03, but of course we don't get those here.
    You might be able to buy some of the parts and use them of course.
    If nothing else, it gives you and idea of what it could look like.

    2018-Yamaha-MT-03-Black-Blue.jpg


    Strip it down some more, add some knobbies and a custom seat, etc. and you could get close to this:

    mt-07 scrambler1 (640x416).jpg


    This is based off of a Mt-07 of course but you get the idea.
    Those exposed pipes and that radiator make me pretty freakin' nervous.
    I'm sure this is more of a "styling concept" than someones attempt at an actual usable bike. (I hope!)
    I'm not certain how you would deal with raising the bars with clip-ons and repositioning the pegs/controls but anything is possible.

    The easiest way to get yourself a 300c twin gravel runner is to just buy a Versys...

    But you don't have to take my advice, I never do !!!!


    P.S. I'll get some more exhaust pics soon. I think I'm going to get at least part of the system coated. Not primarily for looks but also for the heat management.
    #57
    JagLite and M.T. Hawk like this.
  18. Whale Rider

    Whale Rider Been here awhile

    Joined:
    May 16, 2010
    Oddometer:
    480
    Location:
    DownUnderNZ
    Have you tried using High Density Polyethylene over hear its about half the price of UHMWPE which is generally used for conveyor systems that have product or belts sliding over it 24/7 it has better resistance to wear.
    HDPE has the same impact qualities as UHMWPE and if there is any water involved just as slippery.
    Just saying
    WR
    #58
    79thunder likes this.
  19. DKCJ

    DKCJ a life behind bars

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2012
    Oddometer:
    217
    Location:
    Great white north
    Awesome build. Well done.
    Thank you for posting all the relevant info.
    I too am a fan of smaller bikes after having spent enough time on bigger ADV bikes.
    The R3 seems perfect in this application.
    Congrats.
    Enjoy!!
    #59
    79thunder likes this.
  20. gwarden

    gwarden Adventurer

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2018
    Oddometer:
    41
    Location:
    Southern CA
    Great build! I thought the same thing when I saw the CSC, which I will readily admit I think looks amazing (especially for the price). Eagerly awaiting a sound check.
    #60
    79thunder and k555 like this.