Sidecar Training Question

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by PhoenixGirl63, Jun 13, 2019.

  1. Flyin' Monkeys

    Flyin' Monkeys Wicked Witch Airlines Supporter

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    BTW, @PhoenixGirl63 is asking for further help, after she already went back to the selling dealer again today, and had them first check it over for possible damage to the sidecar wheel/axle/spindle, because this was a DEMO model when she bought it, so my thought was that it was possible that some customer took this Ural rig for a test ride, bumped the sidecar wheel into a curb, or something else, and didn't say a word to the dealership.

    Given that this issue of pulling hard to the right has been there since mile # 1 for @PhoenixGirl63 , and that she has already taken the rig back to the selling dealer (Randy's Cycle) twice now, and they freely admit/acknowledge that they are NOT experienced in how to properly set-up these sidecar rigs (they admitted that to her, and Randy, the owner, admitted that to me when I called to talk to him), and that Randy has also called Jonathon Heindl to ask for helpful info on how to set these Ural rigs up...........................I have now suggested to @PhoenixGirl63 that she find a rider within a reasonable distance to her, that also owns a Ural rig, and have real world experience in adjusting their rig, and miles under their butt on how to drive their Ural rig, and ask them to drive HER rig, and ask them if she can drive their rig, so they can make direct comparisons with one another.

    She has found some folks up in Milwaukee, WI, and is planning on doing just that.

    This is unfortunate that a new sidecar owner, that paid cash for the DEMO Ural sidecar rig, is having to deal with an inexperienced dealership, and frustrated with their new rig not driving down the road straight and true.
    #61
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  2. MGV8

    MGV8 Been here awhile Supporter

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    I know it is frustrating but it sounds as if Randy, the shop is willing to work with you. Maybe a third try is in order. They certainly need to try again and learn to set these up if they want to sell Urals. Maybe they need to go ride some of their own product so they know what's right and what's not
    #62
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  3. Flyin' Monkeys

    Flyin' Monkeys Wicked Witch Airlines Supporter

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    Brian ^, that is not a bad suggestion, but......... @PhoenixGirl63 has already given Randy's Cycle a total of 3 times to get this rig right.
    They delivered it to her (she picked it up at the dealership) with the rig not right, because none of their techs knew how to set it up right, and no one there took the rig for a test ride before handing it off to the buying customer. Then after she rode it, that is when she realized there was something wrong, so she took it back for an adjustment. They did adjust it (as per what Randy told me on the phone, and they went out to the maximum it could be adjusted), but it still wasn't right.
    That is when I suggested that Randy call Jonathon Heindl, at Heindl Engineering, which Randy did make that call. So, she brought it back to them again, and after inspecting it for potential damage possibly caused by a test drive by another customer (DEMO bike), and finding none, they made adjustments again, and sent her on her way yesterday.

    I am all for giving a selling the chance and opportunity to make things right, up to a point. And a total of 3 tries to get this rig right, is giving Randy's Cycle more than a fair chance to make things right. :nod

    Time to find a fellow Ural driver, that has experience with these rigs, and will test drive her rig, so they can say yes or no on whether it is right, and/or what needs to be fixed. :ricky

    Ultimately the goal here is to get @PhoenixGirl63 on the road, on a safe/straight/true driving Ural rig, so that she is happy. :-)
    #63
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  4. Bobmws

    Bobmws Curmudgeon At Large

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    So, are Ural front & rear wheels in perfect alignment? Tires & wheels the same size?
    Seems simple enough, but wonder if the fact that this was a 'demo' bike has something else bent or out of alignment.
    #64
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  5. Flyin' Monkeys

    Flyin' Monkeys Wicked Witch Airlines Supporter

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    Josh, @FLYING EYEBALL , what brings you to the assumption that "you guys are making this more complicated than it needs to be" ???

    All I, or anyone else that is trying to remedy this problem for @PhoenixGirl63 are doing is to help her......plain and simple.

    That is not complicated to understand, is it ?

    And yes, Josh, you ARE mistaken ! :fpalm

    However, seeing that a "little levity" in a post appears to make things "complicated" for you, I will now go back through all my posts in this thread, and remove any mention of the words about Ice Cream. Lord knows we would not want to interject levity into any posts on these ADVRider forums. :dunno
    #65
  6. PhoenixGirl63

    PhoenixGirl63 Wayward Daughter Supporter

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    Setting up a side car rig is probably simple for people who know what they're doing. It hasn't been my experience that the dealer. After years on two wheels, I'm new at this sidecar thing, and lots of folks, especially Flying Monkeys, have been extremely generous with their time and recommendations. Motorcycle people are the BEST and I'm extremely appreciative of everyone's support.

    So, @FLYING EYEBALL: don't know if you're just having a bad day or what (sorry if you are!) but, the negativity is not warranted or needed. Feel free to not spend one more ounce of energy on this discussion. It's perfectly okay for you to move along. That goes for anyone else who feels the need to be negative or critical: perfectly okay for you to not spend any of your time on this little thread.

    I simply want the best experience I can have which includes training and lots of practice so I don't learn bad habits that put me or my adorable co-pilot at more risk. Since, this little guy will be with me, I just want to make sure I do everything I can to become a knowledgable pilot. So, I will be traveling to a training class (probably more than once) because that's just how I roll.

    Attached Files:

    #66
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  7. Prmurat

    Prmurat Long timer

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    You go girl!!!
    This remark should be use on the top of the HACKS forum!!!

    "So, *************: don't know if you're just having a bad day or what (sorry if you are!) but, the negativity is not warranted or needed. Feel free to not spend one more ounce of energy on this discussion. It's perfectly okay for you to move along. That goes for anyone else who feels the need to be negative or critical: perfectly okay for you to not spend any of your time on this little thread."
    #67
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  8. rg sw wa.

    rg sw wa. Long timer Supporter

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    Who disagrees and why ?
    #68
  9. Strong Bad

    Strong Bad Former World's Foremost Authority Supporter

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    Can't we all.jpg
    #69
  10. Fstwheels

    Fstwheels Been here awhile

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    PhoenixGirl63,
    Here's an off the wall thought: Have you considered coming to the national USCA rally in CDA, ID, (7/25 - 28/19)? This would be a good opportunity to check out and potentially ride a hack or two not to mention being able to talk to some somewhat intelligent hack pilots with a few miles/years of experience (experiments). Could be an educational and maybe even colorful experience. Anyway, the issues you're dealing with are fixable and if you stay with it you'll get them sorted out. Wishing you the best with your best friend transport! Ride easy,
    gp
    #70
  11. PhoenixGirl63

    PhoenixGirl63 Wayward Daughter Supporter

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    I would love to come out for the rally, but it will likely be next year. I just got back from a week-long trip to DC with my 14 year old granddaughter, and one of my younger grandkids is turning 11 years old next month and if I miss her Harry Potter themed birthday, she may throw me in Azkaban for a while. :-) Not to mention, my boss may wave some of my work deadlines in my face if I try to escape again, so there's that... :-)
    #71
  12. Fstwheels

    Fstwheels Been here awhile

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    It's only a weekend.....
    #72
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  13. roguewarrior

    roguewarrior n00b

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    I have close to a hundred thousand miles in sidecar seat time. My rig is over 30 years old...and I bought it new. She now has over 200,000 miles on her.
    When I added the sidecar, I picked her up from the dealer on Saturday, packer her on Sunday and left on Monday for a 10 thousand mile trip around the U.S. and Canada. I'm in California, but I wish we were closer...it'd be so much easier to help you in your transition. I've put dozens of people in the seat while I rode in the sidecar.
    I hope you can get the handling issue solved easily. That needs to be done first.
    Some have stated that it might be the set up, but I'm wondering if it's something with the right wheel,
    perhaps a brake hanging up...or, if it's 2 wheel drive.... It shouldn't be hard to solve. First, it should roll easily when pushed back and forth. Your right tire
    could be under inflated. Start with the simple stuff first, then move on to alignment.
    Previously, someone said that leaning won't help you...and they're right...to a point. Leaning won't change the dynamic of the bike. but it can shift the weight a little while turning...especially when making right turns. But that's not leaning the bike, that's you leaning, but only slightly. I sometimes put my right foot on the sidecar frame instead of the footboard...it gives me a little leverage.
    And there's another thing...since you have experience with 2 wheelers, then you know about counter steering. With a sidecar rig, counter steering doesn't come into play...until ! If you are floating your car a little on a right turn, steering is normal...turn right, go right. But...if that car continues to rise, there is a point where the 3 wheeler becomes a 2 wheeler, at the balancing point...and the rig will make an immediate left turn. Now, the car has to go pretty high in order for that to happen...and it's happened to me... lesson learned. So, if you're planning to off road this...if you're making a right turn, and the car wheel hits a rock or something, this could happen. Not something to worry about, just something to be aware of...
    I'm in The San Francisco Bay Area right now...find a way to get ahold of me if you're over this way. Even if you're here without your bike...I can put you on mine. It's no Ural...but it does alright.
    #73
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  14. DRONE

    DRONE Dog Chauffeur

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    ^^^Wow, this thread has super powers!^^^ I think this is the 4th long-time lurker who has been lured out of their silence and been compelled to reply here. Cool! Love to see new people posting up. Especially when they have valuable insights and opinions.

    Welcome to AdvRider Hacks, @roguewarrior, and please don't wait another 5 years to post up again!
    #74
  15. SwampFox883R

    SwampFox883R Been here awhile

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    I'm sorry we're too far away to assist, as you'd be welcome to bring the rig to our place and we'd give it out best attempt at proper alignment. We're not experts, but alignment is something we've had to learn as hack pilots. And, yes, we've been thru the S/TEP more than once.
    #75
  16. PhoenixGirl63

    PhoenixGirl63 Wayward Daughter Supporter

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    I got word that Ural will pay for set-up alignment at another dealer. So, I'll go that route and see what I can get done. Thanks so much, everyone! I appreciate everyone's feedback! I'll post an update once it's all done.

    Still looking at training options, so I think I'll wind up either flying out to Virginia or Washington and make a weekend of it.
    #76
  17. roguewarrior

    roguewarrior n00b

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    Really looking forward to hear what the reason for the mis-handling was all about. Please be sure to inquire...we all are wondering with bated breath...
    #77
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  18. dwoodward

    dwoodward Long timer Supporter

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    Not strictly related, Team Oregon's new three wheel class (which is currently reverse trikes, on Can Am provided Rykers), is taught on a 2/3 mile kart track, and the Can Am people believe we're the only class like it in the country.

    Biggest difference is if you're flying something on a reverse trike, your day has gone wrong...
    #78
  19. aa3jy

    aa3jy Been here awhile

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    Blackman’s Cycle probably the largest class scheduled offerings of Pa.’s 3Wheel training course has openings..but be forewarned out of state (non residents) pay ‘full boat’ for the course..

    https://app.msi5.com/scripts/i5.exe?page=CS.CL.Select&Mode=PB&book=PAMSP&SC=BLACKMAN&CC=3WRC

    The 3WRC is FREE to Pennsylvania residents with a valid Pennsylvania Class ‘C’ driver’s license with a Class ‘M’ endorsement or a valid Class ‘M’ permit.
    Out-of-state residents pay $200 to take the 3WRC and must call 800.845.9533 to register.
    #79
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  20. Crilly

    Crilly Long timer Super Supporter

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    I am in Hartland, Wi. Believe me when I say I can teach all the things not to do when it comes to sidecars.
    #80