Snow/winter riding information

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by Dysco, Sep 21, 2004.

  1. zizek

    zizek n00b

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    First year doing winter riding on my KLR. I found out there's a manufacturer of studs similiar to the aerostich and gripstuds here in Canada called igripstuds. http://www.igripstud.com/en/. As far as I know you can only get them from your local dealer. I ended up purchasing 150 @ $90. Far more affordable than the alternatives, especially for Canadians. Even though there website is lacking they've been great with answering any of my questions over the phone. I've only experienced light snow, and have only ridden on them for a few days now, so I'll give a more detail report into the season. But so far I can say that riding on pavement with studs is far better than I originally thought it would be
  2. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    I talked to Ambrose at K3 and he was into making some sets of studded tires for dual sports on the road. We agreed to work with the T63s and to try alternating rows of 2 and 3 studs. I decided to go with more studs mostly to even out the wear patterns i saw last year, with unstudded knobs wearing way faster than those with studs. Hopefully the gun-mounted and glued (aluminum) studs will hold better on the rear.

    He said he is making the DOT aluminum-studded T63s part of his product line this year with the 90/90-21 and 130/80-17 going for $150 and $130 respectively...
  3. lmavin

    lmavin Been here awhile

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    Zizek,
    What size studs did you get, and what tires did you put them in?
    Your local dealer was able to order them for you?

    Thanks.
  4. zizek

    zizek n00b

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    I got the 11mm. Not the r version though, I didn't know about them at the time but I think they might give better grip, but don't look great for the pavement. I put them on my trackmasters.
    Yeah, Kimpex is the distributor.
  5. MalamuteRider

    MalamuteRider n00b

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    Hi,
    I am trying to ride all winter on my klr 650 up in montana. I have a few questions I was hoping all of you more experienced snow/ice riders could answer. I ordered on black Friday a tkc80 130/80x19 rear and a kenda trakmaster II 80/100x21 for the front. Any issues with that? I was thinking either 13mm or 15mm car studs. I had to call almost every tire and moto shop in town to find someone who would stud them. I will be riding 50/50 flat ice and regular road and hopefully some snowy trails if the studs allow it. What sizes would you all recommend? How would 15mm's do in pavement?

    As for a battery, its been 8-12° consistently and my stock klr battery has died twice already. Should I grab a lithium ion battery? What would do best in the cold without breaking the bank? Im 20 and trying to be a lineman apprentice and don't have much cash.

    Thanks for all the great advice so far. I have been reading through this thread, but am only on page 15. So I apologize if I'm asking more of the same questions. Ride safe.
  6. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    If you are planning to do trails, i would have gone a little more aggressive than the TKC80. I thought the T63s would be ideal because of the depth of the knobs for taking studs and dealing with snow, although i am just looking at commuting and probably don't need to deal with that much soft stuff. Can't recall at the moment what the stud lengths do.

    For batteries, Lithium-obfuscium isn't what you want if you are concerned about cold. They can handle it but you should size up beyond retailer recommendations to prepare for cold and that means major $s. A new flooded lead-acid would do well if you watch the fluid levels and ride regularly, but winter riding means tipping over and cold garages so a solid AGM would probably be your best value since you don't have to worry about acid spills. I'd check with other KLR owners on specifics because it might depend on your charging system. I recently learned the F650GS actually works best with a gel battery because of the stock charging system, though my Deka AGM has been working strong through subzero temps for 2 years now.
  7. randyo

    randyo Long timer

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    first off, lithium ion batteries don't work that well in cold weather. I have has best luck with AGM batteries, colder weather(below zero f), I plug it into a battery tender the nite before I go for a ride

    I don't see longer studs having any advantage, I used 10mm auto studs in stud pockets I drilled 10mm deep, I manged nearly 20,000 miles on a front studded Karoo T (4 winter seasons) and still had almost 50% tread, and even thought they had plenty of tread, knobs were no longer sharp edged and they were no longer worthy of being called a winter tire
  8. jules083

    jules083 Long timer Supporter

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    Trackmaster front is great. I prefer Kenda tires in the winter, from my limited experience their rubber seems to stay softer better in the cold. Never tried a TKC 80, they might be fine.

    I assume you ordered a 17" rear, not a 19" as you typed. If you ordered a 19 you'll be sending it back for a 17, in which case I'd personally recommend a Kenda 270 rear or a Trackmaster. TKC might be fine, I don't know. I do know that a D606 and a T63 both get hard as a brick and suck in the winter. I assume any of the longer lasting tires would be about the same.

    Get the shortest studs you can find. We are already pushing it in regards to having to drill too deep. Longer studs don't stick out more, they just get buried in the tire deeper. I had a tire shop do mine the first year, it was terrible. I ripped them all out a week or two later with pliers, then the next year I studded my own. Those tires are set to go back on shortly for another season.


    Just get a regular OEM replacement battery. They work as good as any in the cold. I run 5W40 synthetic oil year round, it should be a little thinner in cold weather and should help with starting. I don't know for sure, but I figure it can't hurt.
  9. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    There are two elements to the size of a stud, the prominence and the penetration. It sounds like you are talking about DOT passenger studs. It looks to me like these all have a prominence of 1mm. The measurement you mention is how far the body penetrates the tire. It won't affect the traction, just how well the studs stay in the tire. Whoever does the studding will need to know the tread depth and should select the largest stud (base) that will fit.

    I don't think the 1mm prominence is going to do much at all for you off of pavement. Maybe someone makes different DOT studs but that is all i am finding. There are also rally/motocross studs but they have a prominence of 4+mm and wouldn't be good for pavement. Sellers like Gripstuds and Aerostich sell studs you screw in yourself which fall in between around 2 or 3mm prominence and could do dual sport a bit better. They are more expensive and a bit tricky to install though...
  10. Mtraikov

    Mtraikov Adventurer

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    Just finished reading this amazing thread and I would like to revive it for some advice!

    I will be riding my carb'd Ducati Monster m750 through the winter here in Rochester, NY.

    Stock tire sizes: Front: 120/70/17, Rear:160/60/17

    My options for winter tires:
    kenda trackmaster II
    TKC80
    Heidenau K60's
    shinko 700s
    shinko 244
    kenda k270 4.6-17
    mitas e-07
    karoo T
    mt21

    Studs options viable for commuting through town:
    Aerostich studs
    Grip Studs
    max grip
    automotive studs

    Silkolene Pro FST to reduce Carb Icing.
    ACF-50 for anti corrosion from the salts.

    My questions I currently still have after extensively researching everything:

    Where can I buy automotive studs? and what kind/type for commuting through town for work(12 mile round trip).
    What combo tires would be best in my situation? Can I fit a 150 on there (4.5in Rim)
    how much length should the studs be protruding from the tire for my situation?
  11. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    After a washout winter last year, i've remounted my studded T63s from Ambrose at K3 Offroad and already have two storms with them under my belt. It still feels like mostly survival mode, trying to make my commute and not trash the Dakar. It is a bit hard not to smirk when an SUV in front of you spins out onto the shoulder and you just ride by with a shrug (because it is in the city and there is tons of help around if they want it).

    I have a longer trip planned this weekend, so wondering if experienced stud riders would offer opinions on reliability. Is there a top speed on dry pavement you should observe with studs in? Back when i had the self-screw studs a few higher speed commutes were enough to throw all of the rear ones out- do i have to watch for this with real DOT studs glued in? Is it just a matter of safety for increased stopping distance?
  12. Dysco

    Dysco Diaper slinger

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    I don't think there's a max speed, but yes, your stopping distance is increased. For a longer trip, I'd make sure to use earplugs and be very aware that prolonged riding in cold temperatures will increase the risk of hypothermia.
  13. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    The OP hanging with us, nice. Still taking the Ruckus out or anything?

    I wouldn't have thought the stud roar was enough to damage hearing, but wear plugs if riding over an hour anyway. Since moving to the country and going with studs (and noting the dearth of peaches), i've added a heated jacket liner to my heated insoles. Sticking to busy intercity corridors i'm ok with heated gear. I switched to an LED headlight to make a little room for the power draw. I'm looking at gloves also as the muffs and heated grips leave fingertips and thumbs out in the cold, at least with my current gloves. I was hoping i could make the Schuberth work somehow, but the Pinlock has been overwhelmed in the cold, more humid weather and i don't see a way to make any sort of breathbox work in there. Looking at something with an electric visor now, but the base helmets that i'm seeing all look sketchy.
    Sniperx likes this.
  14. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    Not sure how what variables were involved, but here's the result of taking shop-studded (DOT) T63s on a 200-some mile trip. Temps between 30* and 45* F, speeds up to 75MPH (i tried to keep it closer to 65 most of the time), 1200 total miles or so:
    [​IMG]
    About half the studs are thrown or completely broken/worn off. The ones left are kinda deformed. Right before the trip at 1000miles of wear, two sets of the centered knobs had the stud broken/ground off right next to each other, the rest were in fine shape. Given the temperatures, i think it would have been best for this trip to swap the rear to my regular Anakee III and keep the studded front for the little frozen stuff i did encounter on the way home. The front still looks in good shape, even though my rear brakes are emergency only for now so heavy braking up front. Not sure if any of the problems with the rear studs are from downshifting...
  15. randyo

    randyo Long timer

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    what does "shop studded" mean ? what kind of studs

    when I ran studded motorcycle tires (I drilled stud pockets and inserted regular automotive studs with a pneumatic stud gun) the front tire (Karoo T) lasted me 4 winter seasons, nearly 20,000 mile , the rear (also a Karoo T) only lasted one season/5000miles, on my Vstrom 1000, after the first winter, I went to the darkside and ran a General Altimax Arctic (unstudded) in back
    I never threw a single stud on the front tire in 4 seasons hooked up great for reasonable speed riding in adverse conditions ( blizzards & ice storms ) the Darkside/Studded MC front combo was successful beyond my wildest imagination, the studded MC tire in the rear, not so much, it got me around, but sketchy at times, I think the biggest problem was while rolling off the throttle with the Vee's phenomenal engine braking ability
  16. redneckK20

    redneckK20 Been here awhile

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    I've noticed my Kenda Big Blocks on my 1190R grip well with almost no warm-up on cold mornings. Can't say that about any other tire I've run.
  17. jules083

    jules083 Long timer Supporter

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    I had Big Blocks on a KLR once and rode in the winter some, I thought they did well also. I wasn't happy with how they wore though, the rear went much quicker than I expected.
  18. redneckK20

    redneckK20 Been here awhile

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    I get the same mileage as the TKC80's and they work so much better off-road, I don't mind it. Helps working at a dealer and getting tires cheap.
  19. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    I bought these tires from a shop that has been studding off-road tires for years and was interested to try some for the road when i inquired. They are "DOT" studs installed with a pneumatic gun, 13mm i believe. Is there variation in DOT studs beyond the stated length? Two years ago i did the screw in studs myself and all of the rear ones threw after just a few hundred miles. In this case from my picture it looks like the T63 just wore incredibly fast. It could be that i broke off those two sets early by engine braking too hard, then without the stud support on the long trip they started to wear down the knobs adjacent and it cascaded to premature wear on all of the knobs to the point where the jackets were destroyed?

    It seems like i could use something for the rear that has enough rubber to take studs but wears longer than the T63. It sounds like the Big Blocks and TKC80s also wear pretty quick? Any tires like this known for more durability?
  20. Don Coyote

    Don Coyote Long timer

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    The vehicle in question, before the trip:
    [​IMG]