Stator Rewind on XR650R I need help ??

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by kellyk7, Jul 20, 2006.

  1. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    Ok just got back from the electric motor shop ( great place for winding wire BTW) with a bucket of about 3 pounds of 16 ga wire ( cost 10.00 and a 12 pack of coke) anyway I digress, after talking to them about how to get the potting epoxy off the old stator windings I will not be able to do what they do. They use heat in an oven designed for the job at 700 deg F. or they simply burn it off on a cajun fryer. now with the plastic on the stator posts this is not an option.

    How have others gotten the old windings off. any ideas?
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  2. Miguel

    Miguel off road junkie

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    Hey Kelly:

    I'm about to do my stator as well. My take on it is that the old windings don't come off. You're just adding to them by winding the other poles. There is a good DIY write-up linked from the "Pig-Pen" web site as well as a couple new info posts on Thumpertalk. Good luck.
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  3. Donkey Hotey

    Donkey Hotey De Jo Momma

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    How about a propane torch?

    And what are you going to use to replace that potting compound when you're done? What are you going to use to cover the sharp edges on the core when you've burned it all off? Not trying to be a jerk--just wondering if you've thought the whole process through. There's more in a stator than copper wire, a core and potting compound.
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  4. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    good questions, from what I have read and from talking to the electric motor guy you can solder to the existing leads, and just wind the new poles. but the concern is that I am winding with heavier wire stock I think is 18ga I am going with 16ga which should give more capacity. and the solder joint between the old and the new give a point of potential mechanical failure.

    as for anything heat related I just think with the plastic covers on the poles that is out of the question, the motor guy warned that the proccess they use will remove everything, including the varnish on the old windings, the same would be said for a caustic proccess like acetone to disolve the potting, he did say it is not the same as we use in the electronics industry where it has a specific solvent that will disolve it and leave the rest of the parts, it is much stronger.

    He felt one option might be a dremil tool and carefully split the stack of wraps and remove it in chuncks hopeing not to damage the center post.

    As for sharp edges I would assume a fresh coat of epoxy allowed to harden before you start wrapping the posts could smooth off the corners.
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  5. arrcrussell

    arrcrussell Gimme Dirt

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    I rewound the stator on my XR last year. The stock stator had two windings, one for the ignition and the other the lights. I left the ignition windings alone and removed the lighting windings. to reomove the epoxy i just gently broke it off, small pieces at a time, with pliers and an awl (sp?). Once the epoxy was broken and cracked, it came off rather easily. I couldn't get all th eepoxy off so I unwound the wire and the remaining epoxy came off as well. Once all the windings were off, I cleaned it with sand paper and emory cloth. The poles are pretty sturdy, when removing the windings, the epoxy will clearly give way before the poles are damaged. If I recall, the ignition windings have soome type of paper insulation and if you intend to leave those stock, heating may not be an option.
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  6. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    thanks
    maybe I am making too much of the removal proccess, you make it sound simple,

    How did your rewind work out,

    personally I would love to see about rewinding it with 14 ga. by my calculations I should be over 225 watts on the ten poles. but most of the regulator/rectifiers I have found are 150watts I am going to be pushing that with the 16 ga wire

    Nice thing is that if I do burn it up, it is just the lights the bike will still run and I go hunting a bigger regulator like maybe one from BMW thier charge system is in the range of 500 watts
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  7. snaggleXR650

    snaggleXR650 Been here awhile

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    Hey,
    Removing the stock lighting coil is CAKE. Just start pulling and unwrapping and it will come off with the wire. Clean the poles for any excess epoxy.

    Those much smarter than I already figured out that the secret formula is in the # of winds. Over ten poles, you want 32-34 turns per pole, totalling 320-340 turns. Approximate output with 18 awg is ~125W, approx output with 16 awg is ~200W+.

    I did the 16awg wind on mine ~340 turns total over 10 poles. I was scared so I upgraded the stock wiring that goes up to my BD reg/rec to 16 awg also. It was a TIGHT fit in the rubber grommet that fits in between the cases but I made it happen.

    I have dually 55W headlights that both run all the time (110W), they are wired in series with the two yellow wires on my BD reg/rec. In other words, my headlights run on regulated AC voltage, so they run when the bike runs only. Everything else in my BD DSK works just as usual on DC voltage from the battery.

    I would say the results are EXCELLENT, my dually 55's are like 98% bright at idle, and my battery is fine and the reg/rec never gets hot.

    My next upgrade will be to buy a Ricky Stator 250W AC regulator. Then I will buy a ~20A "bridge rectifier" for DC from an electronics shop (mouser, digi key etc...) These two components are cheap, and can handle high currents and should replace the 150W BD reg/rec. Then I will use a relay and I should be able to wire my headlights so that they can be OFF, one bulb on, and both bulbs on.

    The picture quality sucks, but the intensity of my headlights speaks for itself ;)

    http://members.cox.net/snaggletto/XR650R-SM%20lights
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  8. Zapp22

    Zapp22 ZAPP - Tejas

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    yep, what Miguel said!
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  9. phixmup

    phixmup ride'n 2 live Super Supporter

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    someone say ricky stator!
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  10. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    Hmm I like the idea of pulling the lights off the AC side, I wonder how that would work with a high low setup, right now I am running a Acerbis headlight to get me past inspection, then I plan on a set up with a 55w rectangle driving light and dual 55 watt floods. by putting the lights on the AC side thier current will not flow thru the Reg/rec ( I have the trail tech version) but I wonder what switching the 100 watt load on and off will do to the stator

    as I understand the electronics behind the setup, the stator will source a given amount of voltage and try to provide a given amount of current no matter what the load ( there are limits of course) lets say 200 watts at 30 volts AC. The regulator knocks the AC down to 14-16 volts and disapates the excess current and the rectifier provides the DC from the AC. What this means is that when your drawing 100 watts into the electronics hooked to the regulator/rectifier, The stator is making 200 watts, the regulator is soaking up 100 watts and the electronics is causeing the rectifier to produce 100 watts thus all is in balance. But if I pull 200 watts into the electronics The stator is producing 200 watts, the regulator is soaking up nothing and the Rectifier is handleing 200 watts ( over load for my 150 watt unit).

    Now the twist - if I hook 100 watt lights to the AC side of the regulator the stator will still produce the 200 watts, and the regulator will still knock the voltage down, but the left over for the reg/rec is 100 watts, this is now below the rated max, however once I turn the lights off the reg must be able to soak up the entire 200 watts again.

    Hmm gets confusing but has posibilities
    #10
  11. JKL

    JKL Rider

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    I rewound my stator over a year ago and it works with an Electrex dual-sport light.(55 watt light bulb) The battery just stopped taking a charge so I have to replace it. The stator powers headlight and taillight, but will not power the blinkers at the same time without the battery.:dunno

    To wind the stator I removed the wire and epoxy on 2 poles, but left the 4 ignition poles. Just pull on the wire with pliers and it will pull off the epoxy.
    I followed the instructions which link from the Pig Pen site.:thumb
    #11
  12. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    thanks so far guys

    I will be doing it this weekend

    OH btw I will have piles of extra wire if anybody needs some

    the motor shop guys just gave me the bottom end of a bucket, about 4 pounds

    I was just looking around, why not plant a Harley voltage regulator in this system

    the stock unit is 16 amp, ( 190 watts) the upgrades come in 19 amp, 22 amp 32 amp and 40 amp, that is up to aproximatly 350 watts

    plus ebay is awash with them

    here is the link to cranes fireball part, http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/download/crane/install_voltage_regulator.pdf
    #12
  13. arrcrussell

    arrcrussell Gimme Dirt

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    k7

    I rewound all the poles (no ignition) with 16 wire with about 33 wraps each. runnin RickyStators reg/rec with two 100 w headlamps, everything on the DC side. lamps are dim at idle but 500 rpm off idle it lights up the moon! runnin brake and turn signals (rear only) too. no battery.
    #13
  14. kellyk7

    kellyk7 Who knows

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    I tell you guys what,, when I get this on the bike, ( based on delays in parts ordering) which will be about 10 more days I will crank it up and load it down and hook up some testers and we should be able to get some real numbers from this

    this is getting interesting, in a sick and sadistinc techy kinda way

    I know this is a thought I should shake but I keep wondering what the upper limits are on this, I know there is a limit based on the strength of the magnets, but If I wind this with 14ga I wonder if 250 watts plus is doable,

    Also how big an advantage is it to have seperate electrical systems for the ignition, I am thinking that if the lights were to blow up, and burn up that system I could still run the bike,, while this is valid, How big an advantage is it
    #14