TAT - difference between Sam and gpsKevin

Discussion in 'Americas' started by emacs, Oct 9, 2013.

  1. wbbnm

    wbbnm Long timer

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    No matter which one you choose, you are going to run into surprises along the way because conditions on dirt roads are always changing and maintenance can take a long time. Dealing with them is part of the adventure. Practice finding ad hoc bailout detours on your GPS during your shakedown ride.
  2. debaisley

    debaisley Long timer

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    Anyone know if California pass is part of the GPSkevin route ?
  3. turtlemoye

    turtlemoye I'd rather not be online. Supporter

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    It's not part of the route but is right off one of the by passes in the area. The nice thing about his route is you can see it and study for free online at his website.
  4. Oldscool1962

    Oldscool1962 Adventurer

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    Newbie question for anyone/everyone here. A group of 3 of us are doing the TAT mid Aug through Sept. We have both Sam's and Kevin's maps. Here's my question...On Kevin's SD card, the trail shows on my Garmin as an embedded line on the map. Does the rider "icon" advance on the gps as if you're following a "track" or do you have to keep manually advancing the map to see where you are? Secondly, are the waypoints for gas, food and other stops "trackable". Meaning can you see how far to next POI? Can't really test it out until we're actually on the trail.

    Thanks in advance!
  5. turtlemoye

    turtlemoye I'd rather not be online. Supporter

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    Your rider icon should advance but be advised since it's a track no directions are provided. I.E., it will not say turn left in .5 miles, you have to pay attention and make sure you stay on it. I don't recall my GPS displaying the POI's but it's possible I could have deleted them or asked the unit not to display them. If you zoom in closely you can sometime read which section you are on (GPS Kevin Sect 22 or similar) and the gas stops are always the beginning and end of each section. I just made notes each day about the route and which sections (i.e. which gas stops) to hit each day.
  6. Oldscool1962

    Oldscool1962 Adventurer

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    Awesome! Thanks for the quick response! I also have the daily section maps, so that'll help. Cheers!
  7. CloudSplitter

    CloudSplitter Putterer

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    MAPS
    gpsKevin's paper maps are NOTgood for navigation. In fact, I didn't even print more than a couple. Use them for planning, only.
    Sam's maps ARE good for navigation. I traveled with a couple in Colorado who were using the maps, only, and the maps avoided some problems his GPS tracks created.

    UPDATING
    I think both gpsKevin and Sam update their tracks about once each winter. Sam claims to keep his up to date, but I found that wasn't the case. Also, after riding from Tennessee through Colorado in 2014, one of the reasons I decided to stop at Utah was that Sam was just then riding in Oregon, to get info on closed routes, etc. At that point, I doubt he made the changes in time for anyone riding in late 2014.

    TRACK PROBLEMS
    The routes get changed as problems are identified, especially in new sections, such as the eastern extension that gpsKevin added (and on which Sam points out the problems). Maybe BOTH should be giving money to the Forest Service and/or the BLM (though gpsKevin would probably not need to, since he gives away the material, and only charges if you want him to provide the SD card or printed maps). Many of the tracks here on ADVrider have similar challenges. My response is that if a property owner puts up a Keep Out sign, or similar, then I don't go there. If they don't, then they should expect public use (though I'm told that the paper companies in Maine got a law passed, saying it's illegal to cross private land, even if it isn't posted).

    Earlier in this thread, I mentioned problems I had with Sam's tracks. Maybe he's corrected some of those, now, but somebody challenged me to get specific, in another thread, and here's a link to that post:
    http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/the-new-tat.543715/page-2#post-29616008
    .
  8. AT Blizzard

    AT Blizzard Been here awhile Supporter

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    Solution: "TAT Conservancy"

    The TransAm Trail is bigger than one person or personality -- and for now it is just lines on a map.

    Whereas a TAT Conservancy would be composed of RIDERS who originate, improve, and maintain the evolving trail;

    as well as advocate on behalf of the Dual-Sport community to private parties as well as local, state, and national leadership in order to originate and preserve the TAT, and recognize access to the Dual Sport community.

    Amazing how a bunch of grubby hikers (who have actually done this) are better organized and outperforming the Dual Sport community...
    TravlinLeoJ likes this.
  9. Wreckchecker

    Wreckchecker Ungeneer to broked stuff. Supporter

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    I like the idea but would not want to do something which hurts Sam.
  10. AT Blizzard

    AT Blizzard Been here awhile Supporter

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    The Appalachian Trail is in 14 states and has 31 affiliated AT maintaining clubs for 2189.1 miles (2016) of trail -- trail visionaries, grubby hikers, and volunteers built that.

    Sam has built the main route and DS riders have come -- but it should evolve into a formal route (with options) that is coast to coast (GPSKevin), recognized by local/state/national government and maintained by the DS rider community.

    Transcontinental is a very old concept for our young country -- it is about time that a DS motorcycle path is officially recognized -- in order to advocate and preserve access, as well to modify, improve, and maintain the TAT.

    Without such a structure -- route access and trail maintenance functions are not optimized.

    Leadership and organization needs to step forward and assert -- to mitigate DS riders scrambling across the terrain as they wander the continent in search of the other ocean...

    -- wait, that doesn't sound bad -- well, until you are soaking wet and looking for shelter, food, and gas...
    TravlinLeoJ likes this.
  11. BornAgain

    BornAgain Been here awhile

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    I like your thinking AT Blizzard. We lose public land access everyday and if some groups get their way it will all be gone. Right now the AMA is the largest organized group fighting to keep stuff open to us. It would certainly help keep Dual Sport alive if we were better organized and represented.
  12. PittsDriver

    PittsDriver Fuse lit.... Supporter

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    The only time we had any of those problems was when a gpsKevin track led to a dead end and put us in a fuel situation. We had to back-track and bail from the TAT to find the closest gas and ended up missing most of the tiny bit of TAT through NM.

    This conservancy idea and comparing the TAT to the AT is apples and oranges. The TAT is on publicly maintained (and I use that word very loosely) and owned roads. You're not going to go out and maintain those roads. So, you're really just talking about maintaining the route which Sam, and to a lesser degree, Kevin do when they get feedback from people riding the trail every year (or riding sections of it themselves).
    Pavel+ likes this.
  13. Scotty P

    Scotty P Funny Like a Clown

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    bump
  14. 75bronco

    75bronco Been here awhile

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    People buy video games, music cds and books second hand all the time. Buy it and sleep well.
  15. sieg

    sieg Wearing out tires......2 at a time, day after day. Supporter

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    Buy what?
  16. VStromNC

    VStromNC DNS/DNF

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    I'd like to ask both turtlemoye and oldscool. I loaded KevinGPS tracks- img? into my Zumo 590 and I only see one color tracks. I don't see the blue and red tracks. It is all just one color- white. What am I doing wrong?

    Thanks.
    Jon
  17. turtlemoye

    turtlemoye I'd rather not be online. Supporter

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    I'm not quite sure what the issue might be. Are you using Basecamp? If so you may be able to see the different colors there or possibly even be able to change the color yourself. To be on the safe side I would shot Kevin an email as he's pretty helpful with this stuff and has likely fielded they question before. I didn't have any issues loaded them into my Zumo.
  18. AT Blizzard

    AT Blizzard Been here awhile Supporter

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    A "Conservancy" is an organization that performs multiple functions to include solving complex challenges especially as it relates to protecting natural resources while also serving users of that land. The AT is on many different types of public and private land to include roads, trails, NFS, National Parks, wilderness areas, farm lands, towns, bridges, etc. It enters the jurisdiction of many levels of government from national down to states/local; and it also works with private organizations and landowners. It becomes a coordinating force that engages with leadership both in the public and private sector to ensure coherence of effort while resolving issues that arise. The Hikers figured it out almost 100 years ago -- and an organizational structure of a Conservancy implemented by intelligent Riders would account for such distinctive differences between the AT and the TAT in forming and implementing an organizational structure for the TAT.

    http://appalachiantrail.org/home/about-us/history
    TravlinLeoJ and LVCJT like this.
  19. Wreckchecker

    Wreckchecker Ungeneer to broked stuff. Supporter

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    I like it!
  20. VStromNC

    VStromNC DNS/DNF

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    I will be continuing my TAT next year in late May starting near Ozark National Forest in AR. I along with other three riders in our group started from Andrews, NC but majority of us only had about a week or slightly longer and so after riding on the TAT for about 1266 miles or 6 days, we slabbed toward home. My total mileage was 2283 miles including getting to Andrews and slabbing home from Charlotte.

    So, here's my question: This is not about right or wrong for either Sam or Kevin TAT tracks. I am merely trying to make sure that when I continue from Ozark National Forest next year, I am not omitting the best parts of the TAT in CO, Utah & Oregon including climbing all the passes. I am also aware that Sam's new tracks may skip some of the tougher sections but not exactly sure where it differs from the previous Sam's tracks. I want to experience the full TAT and not just skip the tough sections. I have both Sam's new tracks and KevinGPS tracks loaded in Basecamp and trying work on finalizing this winter.

    From looking at both tracks in Basecamp, the tracks are similar until you get to Castle Dale (Manti-la Sal National Forest) where Sam's tracks head north and differs greatly from Kevin's tracks. Refer to the screenshot below. Quite a bit different. For those that's already completed these sections, can you tell me which tracks are better and will not miss any of the passes? Sam's are in Gray vs. Kevin's blue and red sections. Mods, I don't believe I've shown enough detail for anyone to utilize Sam's tracks. I got Kevin's tracks free about a year and half ago before he started selling it.

    Sam vs Kevin.JPG

    Thanks.

    Jon