the DR650 thread

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by sleepywombat, May 1, 2006.

  1. nigelcorn

    nigelcorn Wannabe.

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    I know others have given their opinion. I've owned a couple KLR's, a really well set up DRZ, and a well set up DR. Haven't tried the 610 yet.

    My opinion--I think the DRZ is over-rated. I know it's a better off-road bike than the DR, but it feels to me about 15% better off-road, but the DRZ is like 40% worse on road (if that makes sense). I don't think it is good enough off-road to make up for its on-road manners. If you want something better for single-track, you could definitely do better than the DR, but it's a great do-it-all bike. If you are really planning on mostly single-track--get something else. If you want one bike to do it all, the DR650 is great. It can do single track better than you'd imagine, but it can also do several hundred miles on the highway better than you'd imagine as well. It's a great compromise between dirt and street.
  2. ER70S-2

    ER70S-2 Long timer

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    :wave :beer

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    So, yer old too......:gerg :freaky
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  3. TinMan207

    TinMan207 Most often a lurker... Supporter

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    I have one of those nifty Numeric readout volt meters on my dash. Thought it was a good idea with Heated grips and other Plug-in stuff.

    At Idle (1500-1600 RPMs) the volt meter reads 13.6 to 13.8 with nothing turned on or plugged in. Running down the road (say 3-5k RPMs) it is actually Lower Voltage, say around 13.2-13.4.

    Now, I know this is telling me that it's charging, but I was always under the impression that it would charge more at higher RPMs.

    Do I misunderstand and this normal behavior or should I start poking around the electrical system? And Since I'm not much of a mechanic (especially where wires are concerned) where should I start looking?

    Thanks in advance for any feedback
  4. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    So do I, and that seems like an issue. On mine it is the same thing as yours at idle, but goes up to 14.6 v when running on highway. I have an upgraded stator and regulator though, so perhaps that's why? I am under the impression the regulator shunts excess amperage to ground to avoid overcharging (converting it to heat which must be dissipated hence an upgraded regulator when using an upgraded stator).
  5. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    Interesting. I'll have to find someone willing to bike swap for a day and see if I find that to be true with the DRz.

    The te610 was on my list too, but it was hard to find and I would have already had to swap the cam chain (from what I understand) and possibly the rollers (?) once on my current trip. Also, never underestimate the importance of a strong subframe. I only carry 50lbs on this trip, but I've had up to 70 carrying a tire and extra fuel etc down washboard roads and rocky trails- never an issue. I'm not sure a 610 could do that.. I wouldn't worry about 3rd gear though :lol3 (ducks behind wall). It all comes down to what you want really. I can endure much strife on the road, but I can't make weight go away off road. This is why I've considered a drz, ktm690, wr250r, etc. That said, I'm a traveler and I use a bikes dirt performance to get me to places many will never see- the DR is great for that, and it will play dirt bike or road bike OK. I think the KTM 690 is possibly the best dual sport at this point, but I don't like things I can't fix..
  6. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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  7. procycle

    procycle Long timer

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    That is normal behavior. The OEM stators in most street going motorcycles are optimized for maximum output at or just above idle speed. The reason is the output curve drops slowly above the peak output rpm but drops off steeply below the peak rpm. The factories want it to be able to charge the battery in slow city traffic.
  8. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    So what's the difference with the aftermarket one you guys sell? If it puts out more wattage than stock and wattage is a calculation of amperage vs voltage, with more volts at higher rpms is it also moving more amperage? I would assume so since the amount of current is what matters so long as its supplied in the right voltage form. And how does rewiring the stator affect output for the better?
  9. ER70S-2

    ER70S-2 Long timer

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    I got slapped with sticker shock today. Buying toys is a lot more fun than paying for them. :2cry

    DR: $800
    Gunz: $2400. Everybody needs at least one scoped AR-15 and another high capacity pistol; right? :nod :gun1
  10. Adv Grifter

    Adv Grifter on the road o'dreams

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    With good technique and proper tire pressures I find the DR climbs OK with 50/50 tires. But NOT in mud. Momentum is key, as you've noted. The way to maintain it is to pick good lines, be in the right gear and LOOK WAY UP THE HILL. It works. But it's not a KTM 450, but sure beats the KTM on a long ride.

    Even at just 37 HP I find I can keep up with most of the guys in my riding groups riding GS's, KTM 990's, 1200 Tenere's and Tiger Explorers. If the pace goes over 90 mph, (which it does from time to time) then I fall back a bit. But up to 80 mph I'm fine. In the twisties no problems keeping up. Off road? ... I leave them behind if things get loose or rough. Trade offs.

    I've ridden 500 mile days with guys on DRZ400's. They struggle and are positively BEAT at days end ... even with a Renazco seat. Our DRZ guys have sold them (3 or 4 riders). They are better than the DR650 off road, in sand and mud and rocky terrain, but not close on highway.

    More Power? I'd recommend the Husqvarna Terra or Strada to replace your DR650. Faster, smoother. Apparently reliable. Will soon be in short supply.
    Buy it now.
  11. ER70S-2

    ER70S-2 Long timer

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    As will parts and aftermarket support. :D
  12. procycle

    procycle Long timer

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    I'm no electrical engineer so I can't really give you a good answer. The high output stator is obviously designed with different parameters in mind than the stocker. Yes, it produces more current to deliver more watts.

    With the regulator out of the picture the stator will by itself will put out higher voltage with higher RPM but the current falls off at the same time.

    The stock stator can be reconfigured to make higher output by connecting it in a delta rather then the standard wye. This boosts the output but moves the peak up a few hundred RPM.
    Read about it here --> http://www.procycle.us/info/articles/dr650/wye-to-delta-stator.html
    I did this as an experiment to learn about charging systems. It worked OK but the aftermarket stator is better that a hacked stock one.
  13. Thumper Dan

    Thumper Dan Been here awhile

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    I took out my DR650 in the deep dark (wet) forest the other day and considering it has close to a bald knobby; it performed better than expected. The trails have been used mainly by 4wd's and are deeply rutted, steep with intermittent mud patches.

    During the course of the day, I stopped a quarter of the way up a 50 to 60ft hill, after gently dropping the bike. I looked what was ahead of me which was a very steep section & believing needed a run up to get up the remainder of the hill. However, I reflected and thought of a different strategy and attempted to ride up without speed. The DR650 just putted up this beasty hill like the tractor it is.

    Admittedly it wasn't muddy and having a bald rear tyre, would have been impossible. But nonetheless the dynamic ability the DR presents, is the great all rounder.

    I do have my suspension upgraded (hence the reason I was out there, to test it all out) and I reckon I could nearly keep up with some of the other smaller bikes, although my forearms were killing me a couple of hours into the riding, trying to hold this heavish bike up. But I got to cruise home on the open road without revving the holy crap out of it (14 tooth front sprocket)

    If this is what it can do in pretty rough conditions, I'm a happy chappy. :D:freaky
  14. xKLR_John

    xKLR_John Been here awhile

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    That's true, but if your technique isn't that hot, you're on a bad line, and you start losing momentum, the knobbier rear tire can hook up and bail you out. :D

  15. thump!

    thump! Adventurer

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    Motorcycle Charging Systems 101:
    Power (watts) is the product of voltage (volts) and current (amps). The generator (stator and rotor) puts out alternating current that increases in voltage and frequency with engine speed. The voltage regulator/rectifier converts AC to direct current and limits voltage to around 14 VDC (13.5-14.5) Some or all of the output of the VR/R is consumed by the "load" i.e. the electrical components on the bike and keeping the battery charged. The "system" has a maximum power output limited primarily by the capacity of stator. Unlike an automotive alternator which has a feedback system to control output, the bike's generator operates at maximum capacity for a given speed all the time. When the output exceeds the load the excess power is wasted as heat by the VR/R. OTOH, when the load exceeds the output (idle, slow riding, too many lights etc) the battery provides current to supplement the generator output. Obviously the system can operate in "deficit" state only as long as the battery can provide supplemental current. FWIW My Suzukis (currently 5) all intermittently dip into deficit state when waiting at a traffic signal with brake light and turn signals on. A higher output charging system can accomodate a larger load before draining the battery.
  16. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    I understand all that which is why an upgraded regulator is necessary etc. I guess i was asking how, if an aftermarket stator puts out more watts, why they don't design them as stock in terms of voltage? Voltage is basically how much electricity wants to travel while amperage is how much electricity travels. If the voltage is higher I guess I don't understand the point? Current (amperage) is what matters as, so long as accessories are supplied the correct voltage, the AMOUNT of electrical output in terms of current determines what you can run accessory wise before using battery as you say.

    So I follow you basically, but I don't understand the reasoning behind having the aftermarket run higher voltages..
  17. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    I've been on hills where the DR could barely hold 50 in top gear (stock gearing). Kick it down and sure it will climb up into the power band enough to climb clear into the 70s. But, add 50 pounds of gear and a headwind and the DR isn't exactly powerful. Not saying its bad by any means.

    In terms of line, well, not all of us are great off roaders. I have succeeded picking a line through shit uphill and I have horribly failed :lol3 But I dare say sometimes there IS NO line.. its just rocks and more loose rocks. Moab taught me that for damn sure. I agree that anything but rocks and mud the Dr is fine with even steep uphill. But when its really bad, the Dr needs a knobbie. Spinning tire loses momentum quick with that pile of lard, but its torque can bail you out if you get some grip in the backyard
  18. GSF1200S

    GSF1200S Been here awhile

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    Yeah, I agree here. My technique isn't hot, and many DR riders came to dual sport with a DR and thus like me may not have the skills. Just saying unless you are some ex racer or received tire spoons for your 5th birthday, a knobbie is a really great bail out for the dr650s weight problem off road
  19. TinMan207

    TinMan207 Most often a lurker... Supporter

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    Thank you Jeff. I'm glad that I don't have to dig into the bowels of my DR, but I guess I need to put one of your high output stators on my x-mas list. At idle, it can handle my heated grips (on high), but at speed I'm discharging slightly. eh, its only money and a good way to learn something new :1drink
  20. thump!

    thump! Adventurer

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    Discharge would be below about 12.6 volts (i.e. battery voltage) AT THE BATTERY not somewhere out on the peripherals of the wiring where most people attach volt meters. Anything above that is charging. I don't doubt that the voltage is slightly less, but I'd be really surprised if your system charges at idle but doesn't keep up at speed.