The Toolkit Thread

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by hilslamer, Sep 2, 2007.

  1. ZoomerP

    ZoomerP Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2020
    Oddometer:
    3,865
    Location:
    American Southwest-ish
    I heard that @oPAULo had an OEM rock, but he drilled too many holes in it, so now it's gravel.
    Sonny S., raschaa, Contrarian and 8 others like this.
  2. flei

    flei cycletherapist

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2013
    Oddometer:
    12,434
    Location:
    Western Mass.
    :imaposer
    oPAULo likes this.
  3. oPAULo

    oPAULo jack of all terrain Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2008
    Oddometer:
    5,091
    Location:
    Bedford, Indiana
    :photog
    tobiism likes this.
  4. flei

    flei cycletherapist

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2013
    Oddometer:
    12,434
    Location:
    Western Mass.
    You can do it! Just get another rock that's higher on the Mohs scale and try again. :-)
    tobiism and ZoomerP like this.
  5. ZoomerP

    ZoomerP Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2020
    Oddometer:
    3,865
    Location:
    American Southwest-ish
    Speaking of gravel, it's time to get back to the Great Washing Machine Excavation and Refurbishment of 2021.

    On a related note, running doormats through a washing machine isn't a great idea.
  6. david61

    david61 Queue, a word with 4 silent letters....

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,108
    Location:
    Western Australia
    This^

    Carry out preventative maintenance, make sure chain and sprockets are in good nick before you go, they're not something you wear down to the last millimeter or change out when they start jumping off the sprockets.

    Price of chain and sprockets usually a hell of a lot cheaper than damaged engine cases or retrieving a bike from out of nowhere.....
  7. david61

    david61 Queue, a word with 4 silent letters....

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,108
    Location:
    Western Australia
    2nd whinge, stop carrying tools around for everybody else, "just in case", or "I like to help out".

    It breeds laziness and incompetence and generally f***s up the ride for everybody else. No ones asking you to be a master technician, but learns the basics [ ask your mates if they can help out in the garage over a few beers ] and carry enough of your own tools to fix punctures and do minor repairs. It's only polite.
  8. ZoomerP

    ZoomerP Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2020
    Oddometer:
    3,865
    Location:
    American Southwest-ish
    I can see that if someone carried all manner of tools & spares, and leapt into action to demonstrate their mastery at every opportunity.

    I'm more of a guide in those situations, though. I'll loan a tool and offer advice, if needed. I won't do any of the work unless it's truly a cluster, and even then, I'll help someone as they fix their problem. When it comes to help, that's how I prefer to get it and give it.
    Chalkie62 and tobiism like this.
  9. tobiism

    tobiism Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    Oddometer:
    1,998
    Location:
    Chandler AZ
    THIS right here. We all help each other out. I don't usually fix other people's stuff but I will help them fix it. If I happen to have a tool they need great.
    ZoomerP likes this.
  10. david61

    david61 Queue, a word with 4 silent letters....

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,108
    Location:
    Western Australia
    Of course we help.
    But you're about to ride off into the wilderness for 6 days or something and there's that bloke who's rocked up with the standard cheese quality toolkit, and stuff all spares....which you don't find out until you're 500 km from anywhere.

    I'm pretty good at telling them what I think in these situations.
  11. tobiism

    tobiism Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    Oddometer:
    1,998
    Location:
    Chandler AZ
    Yeah, I've been in that situation but we're all good friends. I'm a shitty rider, they are great riders. They could piss and moan because I'm not as fast as them but they don't, they teach me. And I'm a better mechanic, so I help them.
  12. oPAULo

    oPAULo jack of all terrain Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2008
    Oddometer:
    5,091
    Location:
    Bedford, Indiana
    Here's my toolkit loaded up with chain breaker, 2 clip type masters, and a section of chain. Ready for anything and anyone. Leave no man and especially no woman behind. YEW!!!
    20210430_191729.jpg

    Here's my toolkit without that stuff....
    20210523_110418.jpg

    If you just ride with a bunch of dudes who you don't care about, ok, leave them for dead. My group is different.
    I have the knowledge and skill and want the tools to fix everything I can on the trail and continue the adventure with all my friends.
    Yes, 95% of the time I will never open this box. But that 5%....now it's the magic box....Now it's time to shine....
    LFC09, BornAgain, budsboy and 3 others like this.
  13. miks

    miks Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2014
    Oddometer:
    195
    Location:
    San Francisco, CA
    Hey FTB! I feel the same. I didn't mention it but, yes, I also do regular chain maintenance and I think that's a big part of ensuring you don't have a failure there. The guy that threw his chain that one time - he's not so big on maintenance so I suspect it was worn, unlubed, and/or not adjusted.
    It's cool if some riders think it's worth carrying chain tools. To each their own. But when I see something unused in my toolkit after two years (esp. one that weighs 1/2lb or more), sorry, it's time to go. Yes, sure, there's a chance you could need this tool sometime somewhere. But if you tried to carry everything with that mindset you'd quickly have all sorts of other rarely used tools and spare parts too. I'm like you - light is right, because I often ride alone and there's a good chance I'll be lifting the bike up at some point(s). It's all fun and games until you're tired, solo, in mud, and have to start lifting all those non-essential tools you've been packing.

    As a product designer, I also can't help but feel there's a better solution to be had here. Like, we're already carrying around a bunch of steel tools - wrenches, tire irons, etc. Could those be appropriated for the function somehow? One idea I've had is shown below. I carry combo stubby wrenches (I think I got put onto those from you, FTB). What if you could modify one of those? Pick a size that's close to the width of the chain (~20mm? If you don't already pack this you could just buy a 20mm open wrench end like this one) and then drill or mill some clearance holes in the wrench jaws for a hardened dowel pin. The wrench becomes the "chain tool brace". You could then use your handy Knipex pliers wrench (opened fully should be enough room) and press the pin through the wrench holes and push a link pin out. Alternately, you could tap the wrench holes and use a screw (last pic). You'd compromise the strength of the wrench jaws somewhat, but I think it'd be in the noise. You'd have to proto it to see if it could work. But my sense is the current chain tools are way over engineered and were never designed or optimized for lightweight "emergency" use. Something like the below might save you in the once-in-a-decade chain fail situation and would essentially add zero extra weight to your kit because you're using tools you already carry.

    Stubby wrench chain tool_01.png Stubby wrench chain tool_02.png Stubby wrench chain tool_03.png
  14. ZoomerP

    ZoomerP Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2020
    Oddometer:
    3,865
    Location:
    American Southwest-ish
    I'm not sure how well that'd work for pressing a pin out. At a minimum, filing off the head of the pin seems like it'd have to be done. Were you able to rivet the head of the new pin with the pliers wrench, too?

    After a pin is removed, I'd happily add however many clip-type links into the chain to get underway. That lessens the demands on the chain tool, too. It has one job: press the old pin out.

    I see precision being a problem with an alternative method. A good chain tool develops tremendous force by using fine threads on beefy shafts, and maintains precision during the press & riveting processes by fixing the chain in place so everything stays in position. As well as a pliers wrench can work, this doesn't seem like something they could pull off reliably. Adding a threaded pin to an open wrench also seems unlikely to work due to the likelihood of the threads failing or the pin head snapping.

    I know a guy with a new Grizzly lathe that should be able to test some ideas, though.
    chrispartida and tobiism like this.
  15. tobiism

    tobiism Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    Oddometer:
    1,998
    Location:
    Chandler AZ
    Might need a mill for that too :1drink
    ZoomerP likes this.
  16. JensEskildsen

    JensEskildsen Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Oddometer:
    2,426
    Location:
    Denmark
    ZoomerP, tobiism and 6gun like this.
  17. keepshoveling

    keepshoveling DNF

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2014
    Oddometer:
    5,127
    Location:
    NYC
    What if you're a shitty rider and a worse mechanic? Asking for, uh... a friend. Yeah... a friend.
    KTMInduro, killianm, 6gun and 2 others like this.
  18. flei

    flei cycletherapist

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2013
    Oddometer:
    12,434
    Location:
    Western Mass.
    :raabia
    keepshoveling likes this.
  19. tobiism

    tobiism Long timer Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2011
    Oddometer:
    1,998
    Location:
    Chandler AZ
    I guess that depends on your riding buddies. If you regularly have people that ride with you I guess you know the answer! Haha
    keepshoveling likes this.
  20. PineyMountainRacing

    PineyMountainRacing Oops....

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2008
    Oddometer:
    7,508
    Location:
    Sarasota, FL / Sylva, NC
    just be quick with your wallet and always have cold beer :deal
    Siorc, raschaa, flei and 2 others like this.