Thoughts on hydrostatic drive for 2WD(or 3?)

Discussion in 'Hacks' started by IHWillys, Mar 11, 2010.

  1. IHWillys

    IHWillys Been here awhile

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    I have zero experience with sidecars and only enough curiosity thus far to read about them and, of course, always notice them when seen on the road which happens surprisingly often around here in northern Colorado. Perhaps someday I'll get a chance to try one out even if as only a passenger. Regardless, I can't help but link another interest of mine together with the hack concept and that is hydraulic drive, or more accurately, hydrostatic drive.

    It would seem that a sidecar setup would lend itself readily to experimenting with this technology. Hydrostatic drive readily provides for reverse and multiple wheel drive(even up to all 3 wheels driven!) and the hack setup provides for easier packaging over a 2-wheeler. I envision a small diesel with atleast 2WD.

    Anyone here doing this?

    Ken
    #1
  2. Salsa

    Salsa Long timer

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    If I were doing it I would think a conventional motorcycle with a hydraulic pump to drive the third wheel when needed. That could include one wheel drive -- sidecar wheel for reverse.

    If only I could find a way to drive the pump.

    Don
    #2
  3. IHWillys

    IHWillys Been here awhile

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    If set up without reverse I figure hydrostatic would not be needed but simply the correct ratio between pump and motor to match wheel speed. This would be 1:1 if the pump was driven at the same rpm as the conventionally driven wheel.

    I don't know enough about either the hydraulics or sidecars to be offering anything on the level of advice but I sure like to read posts from those that do.

    Ken
    #3
  4. HogWild

    HogWild Scott Whitney

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    I looked at it pretty closely. I wanted to buy the Ohlins system that was developed for their off-road bike for the Dakar Rally. But they only made a few of those, and they don't sell them. http://www.ohlins.com/Checkpoint-Ohlins/2WD---The-Complete-Story/

    Then I went looking at pumps and motors, and basically concluded they are bigger and heavier than I wanted for the amount of horsepower and torque I needed (over 200ft-lb of torque).

    I eventually figured out a way on my rig to run a straight shaft under the motor and across the sidecar to a point just ahead of the sidecar swingarm pivot. This shaft would be driven by a chain from a second sprocket on the countershaft. On the side wheel, there would also be a chain and sprockets, just like a standard rear wheel is driven. Along the shaft there would be a one-way (sprag) bearing or viscous coupling, so the side wheel would only drive when the rear wheel was slipping. I'm holding off building this setup until I absolutely need it, which will only be if I enter the Dakar Rally again.

    Anyway, if you can come up with a small and light weight setup that can deliver what's needed, I'm interested.

    There are several threads here that discuss all sorts of 2WD setups for sidecars. Do a search. I don't think I've seen any working systems on a sidecar that were hydrostatic though. If it fits your style, you can buy a URAL sidecar that has 2WD right off the showroom floor.
    #4
  5. brstar

    brstar Long timer

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    I bought a Subaru viscous coupler recently as this years goal if I can achieve it, is a 2wd sidecar mounted on a 650 Vstrom. Like you say a shaft straight of the drive sprocket with chain drive to the sidecar wheel. Simple and light. Thinking I may not even have to mount it as in the car but rather inline if you understand what I am saying. Oh a plastic canoe as the sidecar boat. I may take some time as other things intrude but it may well happen.
    Here it could work even if I have to drop the foot peg a bit as the chair is on the left. But under and across to the other side would be easy as well.
    Cheers BC
    :norton:norton:norton
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  6. Evel Knievel

    Evel Knievel Paredini, Antonio

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  7. Mac

    Mac Long timer

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  8. Evel Knievel

    Evel Knievel Paredini, Antonio

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    Thanks for the link. Looks like it can be done! But it needs lots of designwork to make it a "good" outfit
    #8
  9. vortexau

    vortexau Outside the Pod-bay

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    Yet another way would be electric final-drive: separate motors for each rear wheel and speed controllers that change their variables according to the position; left-straight-right, of the front wheel. Basically, you'd have a diesel-electric outfit- if you are using diesel power.

    [​IMG]
    THIS 3-wheeler is supposed to be Diesel-electric, but may only be single-wheel driven.
    #9
  10. Evel Knievel

    Evel Knievel Paredini, Antonio

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    That's gonna cost a whole lot of money... But i hope someone will try it because there are many threads for 3 wheel drive but there are only a few in the world i think:lol3
    #10
  11. mantree

    mantree Long timer

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    Mine isn't 3wd or even 2wd but if you want to go for a ride I am in your neck of the woods
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  12. DRONE

    DRONE Dog Chauffeur

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    Proof, once again, that drinking and posting don't mix.:lol3
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  13. davebig

    davebig Another Angry Hun !

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    I believe a Toro engineer in MN built himself a hydro drive Yanmar diesel powered motorcycle, commercial mowing has lots of blades driven buy hydraulic motors.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Given we had tons of hydraulic driven stuff in the USN, it's a good idea, but I would think along the lines of 2nd wheel assist. I've had a little Subaru viscous coupling experience on a 95 legacy wagon if one overheats them very often ( read spin wheels for do-nuts) they don't ever really unlock again, or maybe they solved that later.DB
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  14. pops

    pops Long timer

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    I worked part time for over 10 years ,with a lawn mowing contractor .There larger mowers that were driven by a hydrostatic drive system where a pain, as when the motor was shut down they could not be moved easily , if the engine broke down The only way to get them onto a trailer was with a winch.
    i am sure you would have to get drive motors that will free wheel when the motor was not running . A clutch system in the drive motor ?
    As that is the only way i could see a hydrostatic drive system would work for a sidecar wheel.
    #14