Tiger 800 Tuning Thread

Discussion in 'Triumph Tigers' started by theycallmeebryan, Mar 31, 2015.

  1. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Oddometer:
    94
    Location:
    La Jolla, CA
    Hello fellow Tony's. I ran a search and did not find any dedicated tuning thread for the Tiger 800's, so i figured why not start one?

    A little background about myself. I'm a 28 year old scientist turned programmer that is a gear head at heart.
    I have a good amount of tuning experience with cars utilizing computers such as the AEM EMS (many cars),
    Haltech E8 (I owned a highly modified, supercharged piggy bank.... a Dodge Stratus pushing 500+fwhp),
    FAST B2B and FAST XFI (i currently have a 84' Buick Regal T-Type), as well as a slew of piggy back units (what a headache they are).

    [​IMG]

    Now let's get this ball rolling with the Tiger 800. My bike is a 2012 Tiger 800XC ABS.
    I have both the stock muffler and a Leo Vince SBK muffler, so i will be able to provide assistance with those setups.
    I may also be able to provide assistance with other setups, as well.

    I'll be updating this post with useful tuning information that will hopefully help out fellow Tony's.

    Disclaimer:
    Don't be a Larry.
    Use sound judgement when tuning your motorcycle.
    Use any custom maps at YOUR OWN RISK.

    I am not responsible for any damage to your machine!


    TUNE ECU SOFTWARE
    Download Version 2.5.5 for Windows

    ============================================
    FACTORY MAPS
    ============================================
    20654 - 800 Roady non-ABS with Stock Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)
    20655 - 800 Roady non-ABS with Arrow Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)

    20768 - 800 Roady ABS with Stock Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)
    20766 - 800 Roady ABS with Arrow Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)

    20770 - 800XC non-ABS with Stock Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)
    20771 - 800XC non-ABS with Arrow Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)

    20769 - 800XC ABS with Stock Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)
    20767 - 800XC ABS with Arrow Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)


    ============================================
    CUSTOM MAPS
    USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.
    Make sure you are using the correct map for your model !!!

    ============================================

    800 Roady non-ABS
    TCMB - Tiger 800 - 20767/20769 Hybrid Map - with non-Stock exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)(22-May-2016)
    - This custom map is a combination of the stock 20769 part throttle and cruising maps with the arrow 20767 mid-full throttle maps (both from 800XC ABS). I have applied some smoothing to the ignition maps and adjusted the idle timing for a more stable idle. With these maps configurations, expect good fuel economy mixed with great performance while riding aggressively.
    -This map is also configured for 14.7 AFR up to 50% TPS and 7500rpms. With a Leo Vince exhaust fitted, I see an average 54.1mpg at an indicated 65mph on level highway.

    800 Roady with ABS
    TCMB - Tiger 800 ABS - 20767/20769 Hybrid Map - with non-Stock exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)(22-May-2016)
    - This custom map is a combination of the stock 20769 part throttle and cruising maps with the arrow 20767 mid-full throttle maps (both from 800XC ABS). I have applied some smoothing to the ignition maps and adjusted the idle timing for a more stable idle. With these maps configurations, expect good fuel economy mixed with great performance while riding aggressively.
    -This map is also configured for 14.7 AFR up to 50% TPS and 7500rpms. With a Leo Vince exhaust fitted, I see an average 54.1mpg at an indicated 65mph on level highway.


    800 XC non-ABS
    TCMB - Tiger 800 XC - 20767/20769 Hybrid Map - with non-Stock exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)(22-May-2016)
    - This custom map is a combination of the stock 20769 part throttle and cruising maps with the arrow 20767 mid-full throttle maps (both from 800XC ABS). I have applied some smoothing to the ignition maps and adjusted the idle timing for a more stable idle. With these maps configurations, expect good fuel economy mixed with great performance while riding aggressively.
    -This map is also configured for 14.7 AFR up to 50% TPS and 7500rpms. With a Leo Vince exhaust fitted, I see an average 54.1mpg at an indicated 65mph on level highway.

    800 XC with ABS
    TCMB - Lean Cruising Map - 800XC ABS with Stock Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)(01-Apr-2015)
    - This custom map has been reconfigured to provide safely lean cruising conditions (15.2 AFR) at throttle positions up to 50%. Idle speed has been increased (1500rpm to 1700rpm) during cold temperature situations to improve warm-up time.

    TCMB - 20767/20769 Hybrid Map - 800XC ABS with Arrow/Leo Vince Exhaust - (USA 87 Octane Minimum)(EUR 91 RON Minimum)(28-Apr-2015)
    - This custom map is a combination of the stock 20769 part throttle and cruising maps with the arrow 20767 mid-full throttle maps. I have applied some smoothing to the ignition maps and adjusted the idle timing for a more stable idle. With these maps configurations, expect good fuel economy mixed with great performance while riding aggressively.
    -This map is also configured for 14.7 AFR up to 50% TPS and 7500rpms. With a Leo Vince exhaust fitted, I see an average 54.1mpg at an indicated 65mph on level highway.

    TUNEECU MAP EDITING
    FUEL MAPS
    F Maps - Fuel maps based on TPS vs RPM
    -There are 3 of these for the Tiger 800.
    -F1 covers gears 1-2
    -F2 covers gear 3 ONLY
    -F3 covers gear 4-6
    -Minimum Value: 0
    -Maximum Value: 8000

    Table View - Displays all values in a table
    [​IMG]
    Graphic View - Display values for a specific TPS Value vs RPM
    [​IMG]

    L Maps - Fuel maps based on Air Pressure vs RPM
    -There are 3 of these for the Tiger 800.
    -L1 covers gears 1-2
    -L2 covers gear 3 ONLY
    -L3 covers gears 4-6

    Table View - Displays all values in a table
    [​IMG]
    Graphic View - Display values for a specific hPa vs RPM
    [​IMG]

    F Trim Adds/Subtracts a % to all F Maps.
    -Input positive or negative % values to apply to all F maps.
    -Use Edit>Commit Trims to apply % change to all F maps.
    -You can also apply trim to L maps by selecting the option in the edit tab.

    [​IMG]

    F-L Switch Indicates the TPS value vs RPM where the computer transitions from using the L map to the F map.

    [​IMG]

    Air/Fuel - Indicates the target Air / Fuel ratio based on TPS vs RPM while the computer is in closed loop mode.
    -Range is 11.80(Rich) to 17.8(Lean)
    -Lean cruising ratio can be between 14.7 and 16.0
    -Stoichiometric ratio is 14.7 (that is, most efficient burn)
    -Maximum power is made around 12.8-13.0.

    [​IMG]

    IGNITION MAPS
    I Maps - Ignition maps based on TPS vs RPM
    -Maximum Value is 54.0 degrees BTDC.
    -Minimum Value is -4.0 degrees BTDC.
    -There are 3 of these for the Tiger 800.
    -I1 covers gears 1-2
    -I2 covers gear 3 ONLY
    -I3 covers gears 4-6


    Table View - Displays all values in a table
    [​IMG]
    Graphic View - Display values for a specific TPS vs RPM
    [​IMG]
    #1
  2. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Oddometer:
    94
    Location:
    La Jolla, CA
    Updated the first post with some TuneECU terminology and descriptions
    #2
  3. mikerogers74

    mikerogers74 Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2014
    Oddometer:
    32
    Anyone loaded the 20767 map on their XC? I have a Leo Vince slip on and wondering if there are advantages to running the arrow map vs the standard pipe map.
    #3
  4. dugal

    dugal Adventurer

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2006
    Oddometer:
    26
    Location:
    Texas
    Holy cow, what an impressive set of data. Is there a way to tell what the mpg difference would be comparing a stock exhaust and an Arrow? I wouldn't even know how to begin loading one these maps. I can, however, calculate my gas mileage. :D
    #4
  5. roll_it_on

    roll_it_on Been here awhile

    Joined:
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    Oddometer:
    272
    Location:
    Boise Idaho
    I would love to see a Tune Ecu map that was dyno produced that was set up for an aftermarket slip on and with the cat removed.
    #5
  6. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Oddometer:
    94
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    I have run both maps on my bike many times using the Leo Vince SBK exhaust. In the upper RPM range, the arrow map definitely feels stronger, but i feel like the low end is better on the stock map. (Read on)

    There are some interesting differences between the two maps. In general, the 20767 map supplies about 5% more fuel, on average, than the stock map.

    Interestingly enough the ignition maps vary quite a lot, and perhaps not how you would imagine. Here's a screenshot comparing the 20769 (solid blue line) vs the 20767 (dotted blue line) at 10% TPS. In some cases, the stock map has 20 degrees more advanced timing than the arrow map!

    [​IMG]

    I'm wondering why Triumph dropped 15-20 degrees of timing off the part throttle ignition maps in the Arrow tune. Was is possibly an attempt to smooth out the part throttle power? What i would like to do is merge the best of both ignition maps between the 20767 and 20769 into a sort of "hybrid" map and see how it performs.

    I do realize that more timing does not always mean more power. To understand that concept you need to understand how the combustion chamber works, how air fuel ratios effects fuel burn, how ignition timing effects fuel burn, how the type of fuel effects fuel burn, and the degree "After Top Dead Center" (ATDC) where complete combustion/the highest pressure needs to occur for maximum efficiency. From my experience and everything i have read, it seems that most engines make the most power when the max pressure occurs around 10-16* ATDC.
    #6
  7. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Oddometer:
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    I plan on doing some comprehensive A-B-A fuel mileage testing to compare the 20767, 20769, and custom maps... when the weather gets warmer :patch. I have extensive hypermiling experience under my belt as I've established records in mpg on a Ninja 250.

    AutoblogGreen did a piece on me: http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/10/kawasaki-ninja-250-rider-claims-100-mpg-after-simple-mods/

    And here's the thread over at EcoModder about my progress: http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/101-5-mpg-my-2003-ninja-250-a-8686.html
    #7
  8. Vegas800XC

    Vegas800XC POS

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Oddometer:
    366
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    Las Vegas NV
    Subscribed! Very interested in mod'd maps, I like the arrow tune overall but wish it had a lean spot right around 5000-5500 where I run on the interstate to get better high speed mileage..

    :clap
    #8
  9. dugal

    dugal Adventurer

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    Oct 19, 2006
    Oddometer:
    26
    Location:
    Texas
    So I'm assuming you have an Arrow? What mileage are you getting? Do you know your mileage with stock exhaust? I'm thinking about an Arrow but don't want to take a significant hit.
    #9
  10. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
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    94
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    La Jolla, CA
    Just a little update...

    I've been working on a 20767 / 20769 Hybrid tune that utilizes the best of both ignition and fuel maps. I don't want to post it up until i test it out with my bike, though. I plan on posting a direct hybrid tune as well as a modified hybrid tune that will provide both lean cruising conditions and ample fueling for those larger throttle openings. Once I test this out with my bike, I'll go ahead and work on making a hybrid tune for the other variants (800 roadie non-ABS, 800 roadie ABS, and 800XC non-ABS).
    #10
  11. Vegas800XC

    Vegas800XC POS

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Oddometer:
    366
    Location:
    Las Vegas NV
    My bike came with Arrow, from what I see when I ride w other 800's with stock map the arrow tune costs me around 2-3 mpg.. I get about 1 mpg less than the 1200 guys haha..

    I get right around 40 mpg indicated on computer which in reality is about 42
    #11
  12. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

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    I had a chance to ride this weekend with the 20767/20769 Hybrid map I've been working on and I'm happy to say that it performs well! At low throttle openings it feels snappy. Open her up a bit and the bike pulls well! I modified the AFR's to 14.7 under 6000rpm and up to 50% TPS, as well as took some fueling out of the low rpm/tps areas, and the bike responds very well and seems very efficient. I went on a 200 mile trip with my Leo Vince fitted and my Triumph top box mounted and was getting 60mpg at an indicated 65mph on level highway, 55mpg between 70 and 75mph indicated, and just about 48-50mpg at 80mph indicated. That's an improvement if you ask me! I am sure that I can squeeze a little more out of it with some more tweaking.

    One thing i don't like about the 20769 tune (which makes up the below 50% TPS configurations in this hybrid tune) is the 0% TPS timing map in the 2000-6000rpm range (basically when you are off throttle, engine braking). The timing is set too low BTDC so there's a bit of popping/crackling out the exhaust. The TCMB- Lean Cruising map does not do this and that's because i advanced the timing about 5-8 degrees under these conditions. I'm going to make the same adjustments to this hybrid map.

    I'll probably post this tune at the end of this week, after i can test it and tweak it a little more.
    #12
  13. Adman373

    Adman373 Adventurer

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    Canberra
    Sounds promising ☺I'll certainly be giving it a go when it's ready

    Thanks for messing around and sharing your knowledge. It's very much appreciated by guys like me who don't know how!
    #13
  14. fullmonte

    fullmonte Reformed Kneedragger

    Joined:
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    Oddometer:
    7,429
    Location:
    Chattanooga, Tennessee
    Excellent info. The reason I haven't remapped from the stock tune was the reported big drop in mpg from other riders. On the big loop dual sport ride (80 miles of continuous dirt roads with street miles to get to & from), the low fuel light comes on at 135 miles, which calculates out to 36 mpg. On street rides, my highest was 44mpg. Average is usually 40-42mpg for my type of street/dirt riding. Looking forward to your results and thanks for sharing.:clap
    #14
  15. Sock Monkey

    Sock Monkey 99% bullshitter...the other 1% is just lies

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    Can you comment on the heat produced as compared to stock (i.e. does the fan come on more, run longer, etc)? Typically engines running at an AFR this high run quite hot.....

    -SM
    #15
  16. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

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    I haven't notice any notable increase in temperature. The cooling system on most modern ICE's should adequately accommodate the increased combustion temperature and exhaust gas temperatures at 14.7:1 AFR.

    Chart for viewing pleasure on EGT vs AFR:
    [​IMG]

    I'd like to test up in the 15.0-16.0:1 AFR range as that is where the most fuel efficiency occurs (at the expensive of increased NOx). See below:
    [​IMG]
    #16
  17. Sock Monkey

    Sock Monkey 99% bullshitter...the other 1% is just lies

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    In theory, it should, but running hotter longer has a detrimental effect on, well, everything. I wonder what the long term effects might be on things like oil life, engine wear, etc. :dunno At the very least I would think you would want to shorten the time between oil changes running AFRs this high.....

    -SM
    #17
  18. jeremyjo

    jeremyjo Adventurer

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2011
    Oddometer:
    10
    How's the testing going, TCMB?

    I'm in the process of copying over the higher timing settings from the non-arrow tune to the arrow tune and was wondering if you did any smoothing -filling in the holes and smoothing the peaks- in either the timing or the fuel maps? That was the thing to do back when TuneBoy was the way to do it.

    -Jeremy
    #18
  19. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

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    Updated the first post with my Hybrid 20767/20769 Tune + some tweaks. Let me know what you guys think.

    Back on the topic of engine heat, i have noticed a minor increase in the heat coming off of the engine, but then-again that may be a product of me being more conscious after having discussed it in this thread.
    #19
  20. theycallmeebryan

    theycallmeebryan Adventurer

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    Anyone have a chance to try out my hybrid tune yet?
    #20