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Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by OfirMX, Dec 6, 2017.
Wow...that isn't how my motorcycle in Arizona works
You ask me what my take away was...
My takeaway is shared and you criticize... Then it's implied that I'm not teachable?
Peace my friend.
No, I didn't suggest you were unteachable...perhaps so biased in your position that you won't consider anything that doesn't confirm your bias. Two different things.
Peace back at you.
Ahhh. and there’s that double edged sword.
How about we agree to disagree and go riding?
No worries....been at it mostly since 1978.
Currently waiting on carb kits....i hate waiting on parts, so no riding joy this week.
I'm puzzled why folks in other time zones are so bent out of shape about the training curriculum/training organization in PA.
I do not think that is the case. I think people want answers and not scams, and get tired of talk that just goes in circles.
This seems to be a thing that is going around and is the impression people get when trying to get answers, it seems that those who are part of this program want to talk down to everyone else, kind of like "Well if I have to explain it" or "you would not understand"
It would appear that the information being used to market this is information that cannot be verified or proven...
We always hear that there is Data, but of course it is never shared, why is that?
Also why is a state program teaching stuff in motorcycle training that is not only not true, but also actually violates the laws of physics, and those items can be proven with ease? And why does no one correct these things that are being taught as factual?
I find it difficult to believe people like FJRSPORT who claims to be so well educated and was quick to post all his credentials does not see the irony of spreading such bad information as part of a state program. Is there no oversight into anything that is done?
You realize you are citing a cartoonist as some sort of physics expert?
So tell me is the information presented right or wrong? I work with Physics experts.
I admit, I DID enjoy watching the light bulb illuminate over the rider's helmet. It is wonderful when the rider "get's it."
I have never taught TC, but I did spend some time in classrooms and ranges for MSF, over the years. I was very surprised that MSF didn't even bid on the State of Calif contract. I knew that was a mistake. Now, MSF has lost a few State programs. I knew MSF losing Calif was going to be a snowball effect, and I was right. Now that Lee is running the show here, I've seen how the coaches coach. Stuff that would NEVER fly in the MSF world, happen at the end of Sunday's range exercises. It can best be described as "Vietnam intersection." Just absolute pandemonium is what I witnessed. If I QA'd that, I'd have to have a chat with the coaches present. It was went from "Total Control" to very little control.
Can you elaborate...on the end of range observations?
I best not, as the outfit is still in operation there. I could put my QA hat on and visit tomorrow though...
You keep bringing this up as if total control is the only one teaching this, I distinctly remember MSF teaching me the same thing in my basic rider course.
Teaching you what? I am confused here, MSF taught you to talk down to others?
Actually MSF was originally HQ’d in Chadds Ford, Pa. prior to its move to the DC and Linthicum, Md. area..and yes it was originally(pre BRC/RSS) ‘Instructor Centered’ learning style...
Yes, and you can be "Instructor Centered" and not talk down to people. The Job of the Instructor is to help the students reach their potential not make them feel bad.
..remember the phrase during that period..”..take up bowling..” if someone couldn’t hack the course at that time...
A way/style to ‘weed out’ the inability...instead of the eventual Darwin Award (loss of life) winner..
Premise: not everyone can ride a motorcycle...
Sorry I should have been more specific, MSF teaches (or used to teach) that leaning the bike and the change in the shape of the tires causes a bike to turn. Was referring to the article that you have linked to a couple of times.
No, that has never been taught that I remember. They do teach you have to lean, but not that the lean causes the turn, or the shape of the tire for that matter as that is also not true or "Dark siders" could not turn, in fact it is the opposite, the turn requires a lean to keep the bike from tipping over to the outside. Simple Physics. You may have had a Coach tell you something that was not in the curriculum.
Now due to the shape of the tire, you will have to increase the RPM's in order to maintain the same speed in a turn based on the shape of the tire as you need to spin the tire at a slightly higher RPM in order to maintain the same speed as on a standard motorcycle tire the side has a smaller Dia. than the center. so the distance traveled and speed will vary and we as riders use the throttle to compensate for that difference. This is also one of the reasons that the bike will move to the inside of the turn when leaned over at the same RPM as the bike is actually slowing down.