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Discussion in 'GPS 101 - Which GPS For Me' started by PDX Alamo, Feb 19, 2017.
Great detailed project. Thanks for the contribution / ideas.
This weekend I was able to test the DF6560 on a road trip from the Twin Cities to Wisconsin Dells. My wife was driving, so I was able to compare Osmand to her Garmin Nuvi. It worked very well. One interesting thing, is at the beginning of the trip, the ETA was significantly different - 15-20 minutes with the Garmin having the earlier arrival time. As the trip went on, Osmand kept adjusting closer to the Garmin ETA.
The 6560, even with a new battery, and even with the cell radio off, really sucked up the battery life (I intentionally didn't have it plugged in as I wanted to test that) In the three hour or so drive, it was dead at the end of the trip. Also, despite what I said in an earlier post, my Google Fi data card didn't work in the 6560. It shows bars, but apparently Fi requires Android 7 or above.
So of course I found an absolutely mint DF Pro on ebay for $79 and ordered it. I set it up today, and it works perfectly. This thing looks brand new. My Fi data card activated just fine, so I'll be playing with this going forward. I may sell the 6560 or relegate it to ATV use. I'm also selling my Blackview 8000 rugged, which I was going to use for this purpose - the Kyocera is just an all around nicer unit.
Garmin GPS’ “learn” how fast you typically drive on different classes of road. Also, depending on the model, that may have some real time data on traffic conditions. This is all used to calculate a (usually) remarkably accurate ETA. AFAIK, Osmand has no such capability and, even if it did, would need to learn your typical driving speeds to give an accurate time to destination.
Google <application name/version>+ apk+ download.... you'll find lots of hosts with older apps. normally the application developers site is the safest/easiest
if you're driving on roads, just use Google maps. you'll get traffic avoidances that way, and all the poi's are current also
After looking around and reading a fair bit of this thread I also took the leap and picked up a used Verizon DF Pro. I found one on eBay that was a little thin on the description, but did offer a full refund if not satisfied. Once it arrived, it was mint. Super stoked, plus the screen size and brightness, which has caused most of my concerns with the previous phones and GPS unit seems to be solved. (Old eyes)
I've tried several Garmin units, several TomTom units, and an old Galaxy s5, and none of them worked in terms of visibility.
I've played with several different mapping apps, and for now, I have say OSMand is the best for my purposes.
Thanks to all who've contributed and especially to the OP for doing the original research.
this is going off topic somewhat, but figured i would share...
i picked up a cheap ($16, eBay) Bluetooth GPS receiver to test. explanation: the GPS receiver acquires GPS location info, then passes it off (via Bluetooth) to whatever devices you have paired to it. so it goes like this...
cheapie eBay Bluetooth GPS >>>
phone paired to it over BT >>>
your app of choice on your phone.
I've only tested a couple days of driving, but typically it's accuracy is +/- 1 meter ( +/- 3 feet!) and the worst I've seen while recording a track was +/- 2 meter (+/-9 feet). this is roughly 3x better than my Kyocera pro (Verizon model) and 2x better than my Verizon pro (att model).
locus recorded this track, then i selected blue , green, and red points from that track, to look at their assumed accuracy...
blue = best @ +/-3 feet
then green @ +/- 4 feet
then red @+/- 5 feet
the unit i bought was QstarzBT-Q1000XT , you can find them on eBay for $10-120.
this is a VERY OLD model receiver... but there's a reason i chose it:
i wanted to see just how old/cheap a receiver i could get to work properly with modern applications, at the highest accuracy possible. also, if i just want to ride without using an app/phone, i can turn on logging and record tracks without any other devices, then dump the tracks over Bluetooth/USB later.
pros: super cheap, good accuracy, 1hz rate, long battery life (40 hours)
cons: not waterproof, Bluetooth only output. mini USB charging, effected by rollover bug, all tracks recorded ON THE DEVICE have data of 2000 , but all tracks recorded on tablet/phone have correct date
*****update***** i found the firmware update to solve the rollover bug, installed it, working fine now.
I'll test more, and see what kind of repeatability it can do, then post results.
(qstarz has pdf manuals still available online, if you want to take a look)
Good info, thanks for sharing!
This pretty much echos what I've experienced as well. I have a couple of old BT GPS receivers: An off-brand unit I used many years back along with my Windows PDA for navigation and my 'newest' Trimble GeoXB that is at least 10-12 years old! Accuracy on both were pretty close to each other but the Trimble takes the edge in challenging conditions (for what it cost, it better!) and the battery life is much better. I still use the Trimble over my phones/tablets for field work, connected to my Samsung tablet running (usually) Locus GIS or Pro. A few months back, I did a brief comparison with my Kyocera while mapping a four-mile section of a proposed trail in some pretty steep terrain. The Trimble consistently maintained a <2 meter accuracy while the Kyocera was at least double that.
How were your BT units mounted? One of the advantages of the Trimble (or any BT unit) is I can mount it on an antennae pole and keep it in a backpack just slightly above my head while hiking, while I keep the tablet anywhere. With the phone, even holding it in my hands doesn't give a consistent clear view of the sky, and that does get tiring after awhile! I assume on the bike, you mount them both in a similar way, which is probably a better comparison. The other advantage of a BT unit is that the GPS receiver and antennae is isolated from the phone electronics, which contribute to interference..
Looking forward to your additional testing!
I'm very interested in your BT GPS receivers talk.
In my recent experiments I used an android e-reader for roadbook navigation. I developped a fast dirty app to display and scroll pdf roadbook and also display tripmeters/compass. The e-reader has no gps so i shared the gps position from a phone via bluetooth (with an app on the phone, and my app on the e-reader connects directly and read the nmea strings). Two problems with that:
- I tried different "gps position sharing" apps and they seem to randomly disconnect.
- No app seem to be able to share gps using BLE (low energy) protocol. To be fair, "gps sensors" are not in the list of default profiles from BLE. Bottom line is that the power consumption of that bluetooth connection becomes the main draw from my app on the e-reader (more than 5% battery per hour, which is crazy for just receiving one update per second). I also use a custom made bluetooth remote to control the app, it connects as a BLE keyboard and power drain from this on the e-reader is very low (1% maybe 2% max per hour). Well the remote itself runs for 3-4 days on a tiny 150 mA.h battery.
So I was planning to do my own gps sharing app (for the phone) using BLE protocols, but i'm also interested to see how much power those BT receivers drain from your phones/tablet?
1q) besides accuracy, did you see any changes in the battery consumption of the phone?
i.e. If you run locus on the phone with the phone gps and the screen on, the battery lasts x hours / y% battery consumption per hour.
with the external BT GPS connected, the same phone lasts x1 hours / y1% battery consumption per hour
1 cool. are you using the locus Bluetooth manager to connect to the Bluetooth GPS receivers, or a third party app to feed ALL your location/mapping apps with the external GPS location info ? I've been bouncing back and forth between using locus Bluetooth manager and "Bluetooth GPS" app to get all my mapping applications with location data. haven't decided which i like better yet.
2 that's what I'm finding also. I'm curious why the Verizon model has worse hdop than the att model.... but now that I'm using Bluetooth GPS, is not an issue, just curiosity.
3 im not giving them any breaks.... they get tossed into the glovebox or a shorts pocket. this is just for testing, when i want to go trail MAPPING i'll duct tape the bt-gps on my helmet, the phone is always on my bars.
4 i completely missed that part. thanks !
5 ditto that ! this was last night, qstarz = green, Kyocera= red. both were tossed in a shorts pocket.
if anyone (just holler!) complains about this being too far off topic I'll split it to another thread.
i haven't tested this yet. in the past (years ago, Android 2.3) Bluetooth was less efficient than gps- only. I'll test that next week and see what happens.
I've been using the Locus BT manager. Works great and so far all I need! I'm only running the one App (Locus).
I have not noticed any increase in battery consumption but really haven't tested that either. My empirical observations is that it may actually be less with the internal GPS turned off and just using BT. Today I spent 4 hours in the field with my Samsung tablet connected to the Trimble BT GPS. I still have 65% battery left which is at least as good as as running it without BT. I do make sure WiFi is turned off but since there is no phone on the tablet, I don't have to deal with that. I also had the screen running the entire time set at full power (in sunlight) so I'm really surprised it did so well.
OK - About 75% of the time that I access the "EQUIPMENT" sub-forum of ADV Rider, with my Kyocera DFP, I get this very annoying pop-up. I hit the little "2" at the top of the page to close it, and it also just closes out of the internet as well. I've never said OK to the AD, knowing it's just spam. I only get this pop-up when using the phone, never when using a PC. What can I do to prevent this BS, and why is it only happening when visiting the "EQUIPMENT" sub-forum?
I've been getting that too. ugh!
I've been getting a variation of that on my tablet. It's annoying.
if you don't care about Google NFC Payments, you can root the phone and install an ad blocker that will obliterate all of that. i like nfc payments, so i just ignore the ads
I am on page 20 and have a ebay bid on a Dura Force Pro " Sprint locked ". The question is : Will setting to Airplane mode shut off the GPS ?
Can the DFP be rooted? I thought that was a no go?