Versys-X 400 speculations thread

Discussion in 'Japanese polycylindered adventure bikes' started by PaD, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. Ken in Regina

    Ken in Regina Long timer Supporter

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    Loctite is wonderful stuff. The problem is that you have to lose the bolt - any bolt - at least once before you realize you need it on that bolt. The only other option would be to disassemble the entire bike and reassemble it with Loctite on everything. Not something I'm interested in!

    ...ken...
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  2. Fuzzy74

    Fuzzy74 Been here awhile

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  3. SoManyFish

    SoManyFish Been here awhile

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    The first thing I do when I get a new bike is give it a once over, remove any mission critical fastener, put Loctite Blue 242 on it, and then torque it to the manufacturer's specification. Not only does this keep those fasteners from falling off at some inconvenient time but also ensures they are torqued to spec.
  4. SoManyFish

    SoManyFish Been here awhile

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    Loctite Blue 242 does not make it hard to remove a fastener but Loctite Red Permanent (I can't recall the #) is another matter entirely. But yes, it has to be reapplied but because those bolts will only be remove maybe once every few years (if ever) that doesn't concern me. I've never heard of VC-3 Threadmate before -- I will check it out, thanks.
  5. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Long timer

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    It was loctited
  6. SoManyFish

    SoManyFish Been here awhile

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    Really? Kudos for being prepared. I've never lost a loctited fastener. Is it possible that the fastener broke?
  7. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Long timer

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    No it didn't; had no prob putting replacement. Was loctited before leaving for the trip 8.5k ago.

    I think it was from washboard on CABDR.. not sure. Those lower subframe bolts are known to get loose on G550x.
  8. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Enthusiastic curmudgeon Supporter

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    Obviously, there is a case to be made for Loctite and other such compounds, but I've always considered it to be a solution of last resort. I can't recall ever using it on any of the military and civilian aircraft I worked on, and I still have most of the red bottle of blue Loctite I had when left the Air Force 45 years ago. I never used it on any of my dirt bikes, and the only bolts I ever lost were ones that had been sheared off from an impact. Over the years, I have lost the odd original bolt that came from the factory (the headlight bolts from my F650GS come to mind), but when replaced and properly tightened and/or lock washered, never suffered a recurrence.

    For really critical applications (e.g. aircraft applications and sump drain bolts on a race bike), I have used positive methods such as lockwiring or tabbed washers, cotter pins, etc., but in those applications a positive method is usually regulated and mandatory. I would also say that with (most) modern motorcycles, the need for Loctite should be unnecessary, due to improved designs, better metallurgy, and better vibration control (unlike a Yamaha XS650 for instance). :uhoh

    I use what little Loctite I do, in miscellaneous projects where I have to use coarse threaded SAE hardware and other methods such as lock washers or self-locking nuts are inappropriate. I also use blue Loctite on the temple hinge screws of my eyeglasses, 'cause without it, those suckers are always coming out. :thumb

    Just my $.02 worth, and it may not even be worth that.

    Cheers
    JP :beer
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  9. Hamamelis

    Hamamelis Inmate

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    Can vouch for the Honda 250 motor's smoothness - I've got a few thousand miles on mine and it's honestly brilliant (especially when mixed with the Rally's fixed fairing)
  10. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    Many of us do properly prep our bikes by removing bolts and applying it, blue stick.

    This includes properly greasing the head bearings, rear swing ar & linkages. Guarantee yours are under greased.

    Of course the motor stays put as it's properly factory torqued, but this is your chance to verify the rest.

    You don't take the whole bike apart, what are you talking about? You're full of it.
    You just work area at a time.

    You also find out exactly which tools are need for touring when you do this. You really get to know your bike.

    Sounds like you take a short cut...
  11. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    Run a longer bolt and backside with an additional lock nut?

    I also run Zinc 12.9s too.
    https://www.boltdepot.com/Metric_socket_screws.aspx
  12. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Long timer

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  13. dancingweasel

    dancingweasel Virtual Tourist

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    I thought mine vibrated. Maybe not in the 600 single class, but enough to be unpleasant. I lost a number of bolts which came undone, and fell out. I had to use loctite. This is why I want my unicorn to be a twin :-)
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  14. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    Ken,
    That is a valid concern, how much is too little and how much is too much.

    But if you think about it, a bike is a simple machine and, of all the bolts that are both, critical for the safety and operation, and have the potential to become "loose", you don't have that many anyway.
    One of the best things about forums like this and other motorcycle specific forums is that folks have already inventoried what might be a risk area and even point
    folks to the method and/or alternative bolt or part to take care of that issue or enhancement.

    Even without that information going through some of the obvious bolts and nuts can be done in under and hour, perhaps two. It depends a lot more if you have large fairings in the way or a clear
    shot to the different areas of the bike like a naked or dirt bike.
    When I clean or service the bike I also take advantage of retrofitting or replacing anything I feel like doing like for example replacing carburetor screws with small S.S Allen bolts.
    The local ACE hardware store is like a candy store where one can find virtually anything one needs in both Imperial and Metric measures.

    The things that normally become loose are the most stupid things like side or exhaust covers, light mounts, etc... that all that might require is a lock washer and/or a bit of
    blue locktite. Everything that is critical to the bike's safety should be positive locked with lock nuts, washers, cotter pins, castle nuts or whatever that is normally mandatory
    and one should follow the service manual to go over those and a few others, but again, it is not a big job and more like a service item in a check list.
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  15. Ken in Regina

    Ken in Regina Long timer Supporter

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    Well, one of us is full of something. :-) I've owned at least two dozen bikes over the last 50 years. I've never done the sort of prep you described. And I've never regretted not doing it. I figure that's what the factory warranty is for.

    Like Bullwinkle, I've never had anything of significance break down. In fact the VX300 is the first bike I've owned that had something almost fall off. Over the first two years two of the bolts holding signal lights on worked loose. I caught them both before they fell out and loctited them. Unlike Bullwinkle I didn't have any problems with anything coming loose on my F650GS. But his is an '08 and mine was an '11.

    I have no intention of changing my approach and starting to disassemble parts of a new bike before riding it. Yes, I will continue to do a visual inspection before a ride, any ride. But I see no point in duplicating the factory/dealer assembly on any portion of the bike.

    ...ken...
  16. Ken in Regina

    Ken in Regina Long timer Supporter

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    I'm good with being careful when reassembling something I had to take apart for some good reason anyway. I might even use blue loctite occasionally if I have reason to believe it really needs it, eg. if someone has already mentioned an issue with this particular part of this particular bike.

    My first choices will be those that Bullwinkle mentioned - proper torque, crown nuts and cotter keys, etc - before I'll resort to loctite. Depends on what is being secured. If it's critical I will expend some thought and effort into securing it properly. If it's something non-critical - light mounts and such - I'll probably just slap a bit of blue loctite on it and call it good. Again like Bullwinkle, my small red bottle of blue Loctite is so old that all the lettering has worn off the outside from rattling around in the tool box.

    ...ken...
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  17. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Enthusiastic curmudgeon Supporter

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    One 45 gal drum of Loctite please...
    Bolts.jpg

    JP :D
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  18. Lesharoturbo

    Lesharoturbo Nerdly Adventurer

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    Wow! That's nuts (and bolts)
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  19. SoManyFish

    SoManyFish Been here awhile

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    Yeah, exactly. Once you get the fairings, etc. removed there actually are not that many critical fasteners on a bike. I do remove the engine-to-chassis bolts, one at a time. I've found that they are often improperly torqued and if they are too loose that often contributes to buzzing in the chassis. As you noted, partially disassembling and reassembling the bike familiarizes you with the tools you would need to fix your bike, and now you will where to look if something breaks on you in the middle of nowhere have an idea of how to fix it because you've had it apart once before.
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  20. SoManyFish

    SoManyFish Been here awhile

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    Do you mean the "permanent" red loctite? Yeah, I wouldn't use that because those fasteners are *never* coming out again ... unless that's what you want.