Versys-X 400 speculations thread

I already own a CB500X, which is similarly heavier and has more horsepower. It has been a decent moderate ADV bike for me, as was the CB500F I had before it, and I'll keep it for now. But I'm forever hoping for a lighter bike because it doesn't need as much horsepower for similar performance.

I had a Ninja 250 a few years ago and just took off the fairings, made a simple stone guard out of stuff from Home Depot, put tubes in the tires so I could air them down, and rode with my buddies at an offroad vehicle park. I took that Ninjette moto-camping and rode it to Mexico. Given that experience, I'm convinced that a mildly ADV-ized Z400 could be great fun. Nobody would expect to ride it across Siberia without any problems, but for the easy adventures that a lot of us do, I think it might fit the bill nicely!

Craig, I think we may be a bit alike. I came from a 07 V Strom 650 to a 08 Versys 650 to a 2013 Honda 500x. I didn't like the Versys 650 very well, but liked the 500 pretty well, but was all ways looking for the ultimate bike, For me my perfect bike would be able to do pretty well on almost all gravel roads, be able to cruise at 70 to 80 mph all day on the blacktop, make quick passes up to 85 mph by shifting, be comfortable all day, decent wind protection, light weight. good on the twisty back roads, and have a smooth engine with about 12,000 rpms to play with. (I could never go back to the 7800 red line on the 500x) Also at 5' 10" I need to be able to touch the ground with at least the front half of my foot, and a decent sized gas tank would be good. With a few mods, I have been able to get everything I wanted out of the Versys x300. I would like to try a vx400, if they ever make one. I did sit on the Ninja and Z400 but they were to small for me. With you being used to the Ninja 250, you might do well on the Z400. But if your feet can reach the ground on the 500x, you might check out the Vx300, good luck.

Hey David, I think maybe you and I yearn for exactly the same "unicorn" bike! I do like the Versys 300 and considered it, but the weight ruled it out for me -- it's 20 pounds heavier than the Z400, and only 40 pounds lighter than my CB500 (which has a much larger engine). It's basically the CB300X twin that Honda never made. :)

I definitely don't mind smaller engines, but the bike itself must be substantially lighter to be worth it for me. The Ninjette was a case in point. It weighed around 350 pounds with fuel, which is near my upper happy place, but with only 250cc it should have been 50 pounds less. That's why an Z400 ADV would be so interesting to me if they didn't pork it up. A 400cc bike weighing no more than about 360 pounds with a 4-gallon tank and a comfortable seat would get me to sell my CB500X. Especially if they ditched most of the plastic.

I mentioned before on this thread that I did something close to what you did on your old 250...made a more well rounded bike out of my Z650. Since I already have a well modded '06 KLX250S with a 300 jug, I just wanted the 650 to be capable of dirt and gravel roads...but still have that easy 75-80 mph highway capability. I agree with you that the Z400 would do nicely for what you describe with one caveat...does it fit you? I had to do several modifications to my Z650 to get satisfactory ergonomics which I finally achieved. The Z400 is even smaller, and there's no way I would fit on it even though I only have a 32" inseam. craig, have you sat on a Z400 yet? They have an awesome engine/tranny, but I swear it was built for a midget...no offense if it fits you.

Like your situation with pulling the fairings off the 250 to make it suit your needs, I'm a form over function type of guy too. These naked bikes have minimal fenders and seem to try to fit in more with the crotch rocket group than a true "standard" motorcycle...especially when you consider the Z400 and Z650 are basically the Ninja versions with no fairings and a handlebar. This is where the Yamaha XSR700 and similar models are closer to the true standard motorcycle. That's what I've attempted to do with my Z650...lowered pegs, raised saddle, saddle pad, removed passenger saddle, handguards, extended fenders, etc. I still haven't installed my Shinko 705's, and I have a full exhaust coming for it. I think similar mods could be done to a Z400, but it's still smaller in the fit department than my Z650 was originally.

The 20 lbs over the z400 gets you a rear rack, spoke wheels and weather protection. Well worth it and things an adventure rider want. Plus much better ground clearance.

The vx300 is closer to 50 lbs less than the cbx500. Now add spokes and a rear rack to the cbx. Then its more like 70 lbs less than the cbx500.

@cyclopathic,

That was the "Country" model. If you like the beak you have to look for the "Challenge" model.



...ken...

Plus it was a far better bike off road and just as good on road as the XCountry. Just a fair bit taller.

That rear fender is EPIC!

Yes. Where are the real "standard" Japanese bikes? The naked bikes which I have sat on, and owned, all have a slightly crouched down handlebar position. They are crotch rockety, not relaxed for an all day ride, and styled by someone consuming far too many energy drinks. Seriously, is there anyone over 25yrs old on the style and design teams? Yes, there are a couple of real classic standard bikes out there, and the British-India bikes, if you want to go that way.

Now hold on there...are you being nice or sarcastic?

Even though I don't plan on doing The Blackwater 100...maybe routinely the worst mud run enduro in history...with this bike, I found even just running through a mud puddle on a dirt road splashed crap everywhere. Like I said above, most of these naked bikes seem to be just a shadow of their sportbike model they were taken from. That modded fender is a generic supermoto fender from Cycra. It fit perfectly under there and does a good job...along with a bike specific front fender extender.

I tell ya what...they don't provide any protection for the rear shock either. It's sitting right in the splash path of the rear tire. I made a neoprene flap that looks pretty darned factory that attached to the inner portion of the factory rear fender and totally protects the Ohlins shock from tire splash. On the looks of the rear fender, most people who don't know this particular model of bike think it's factory until I point it out. If I wanted a Ninja, I would have bought a Ninja.

I'm glad to hear that I'm not alone in thinking the fenders on most modern bikes absolutely suck. I can't count the number of hacks I've had to employ over my last number of bikes just to get to the point where normal riding doesn't sandblast or otherwise destroy parts of the bike and similarly coat me and my luggage with the worst of the road/trail. Like @TNC , I've used fenders from other bikes, parts of generic dirt bike front fenders on the rear, etc., all to finish what the manufacturer forgot. I applaud what he (and others) have done, but really wish the manufacturers would bring real fenders back into style!

JP

No, I really like it! Creative, ingenious, and... funky!

Craig, I was able able to shave about 20 pounds off of the vx300 by switching to an after market muffler, getting an lithium battery and going tubeless on the rear wheel, but then I added a center stand and tail box with gear, so I sort of broke even. (someone needs to make an aluminum center stand) I did get close to 3 1/2 more hp. with my yoshi slip on after I got it tuned. The 500x is still a little faster in the bottom end, but I'm pretty sure that when my modified vx300 comes up in its rpms, that it is as fast or faster than the 500x. My high rpm engine lets me stay in my lower gears longer, giving me a big advantage over the lower rpm bikes. Adding or taking off 20lb. on the Vx makes no difference in the performance on this bike. It's the high rpm engine that makes the difference. Also the Vx goes thru the curves more like a Ninja than like a 500x. Ride safe.

Your mention of exhaust system weight is quite true for many models. Obviously emissions issues, etc. require catalysts and such that make many OEM exhausts downright heavy. It's one reason I'm changing the OEM exhaust on my Z650. I'll drop 11 pounds right there with its replacement.

I still intend to copy this farkling. Do you think any other slightly quieter muffler would give the same power? I almost don’t trust the dyno guy near me; does the tuner have the dip switches to mod the curve?

Hell no.. with 37" seat height I was offered to try it in Kyrgyzstan couldn't take it off kickstand bike was loaded. 08+ XCo at least has 32.5" seat

One of the reasons I went with the Ixil muffler is it comes with 3 Baffle options, No baffle, Europe legal (quiet) baffle and less restrictive baffle. Only tried the middle less restrictive baffle which is fairly quiet. It does allow me to hear what the engine is doing which was a problem with the stock exhaust, The quiet stock exhaust in combination with running in meant I was getting caught in too high gear. Doesn't help that my other bike (a Bonneville) is a real tractor pulling from idle.

Been playing around with the screen as well to quiet wind noise down. Got a Givi rip off screen which helps a lot and playing around with the angle. I got the rip off as it was cheaper than the delivery cost of the Givi. Would pay more for the genuine item but more than 3x the cost seems a bit ott.

The problem with many of your suggestions is that you are comparing a single to a twin. That in itself is a deal killer with many people. I love my X-Challenge. It is versatile, it is unique, reliable, and perfect in a lot of ways. Although it cruises at 75 "fine", I wouldn't call it enjoyable.

I have been tempted more than a few times to buy a X-Country to go with my X-Challenge. The X-Country really is a modern version of a "scrambler." The only thing that has stopped me is the similarity between the two bikes. Although I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if I ever buy a X-Country that it would get ridden more than my X-Challenge, given my height (5'8") and typical riding.

But as stated above, a single is still a single. It has its advantages, but smoothness isn't one of them. A VX400, or something similar from another mfr, is about the only thing that I could see being an ideal single bike for me.

The Yoshimura slip on muffler comes with a baffle. It is kind a loud with it removed. I chose to leave it in and it's not bad at all. I am running a Power Commander with it. I talked to the Power commander people and they let you download their tunes for specific mufflers. They had about a dozen to choose from for the Ninjas 300's, but none except for stock for the Versys as it was new ( 2017) and no one had brought one to them to tune yet. I didn't want to wait, so I brought one thru our local repair shop and had him install, tune, and dyno it, and it works really good. you will want to call and talk to the Power Commander people to find out what they are doing now as it can be very expensive to have a custom tune. They are sold thru Dyno Jet 1 800 992 4993 or go on line. good luck. Note most of the power increase comes from the tuning.