Versys-X 400 speculations thread

Discussion in 'Land of the Rising Sun: ADV Bikes from Japan' started by PaD, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    I have never found it easy to remove 25 lbs on a modern bike. You usually add things to them and they get heavier.

    So if I easily remove 25lbs from my X, I'm down to 350 or so. Remove stock Exhaust a few pounds, reflectors and tool kit 2lbs? Hmmm

    Nope doesn't need a thing.
  2. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    There are very easy ways to remove weight. The first thing people do is to remove the factory mufflers and/or pipes for
    much l lighter aftermarket. It doesn't mean all the bikes are like that but many times remove 5 to 8lbs just right there.
    Wheels is another thing but if one already has spokes then I would not worry even if there are lighter and stronger aftermarket ones.
    In this forum alone there are dozens of diet projects from more simple to more involved.
    I think the versys 300 is a decent weight from stock.
    We will see how the ninja 400 works and then perhaps a versys upgrade will follow.
    Maybe A future Versys 390 name will remove some of the stigma.
  3. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    There shouldn't be much stigma with the longer intakes, longer headers, and the bike tuned for mid range power. But ya some people are real hung up on the no power till 7k that is far from the truth. At 4-5k the motor is putting out plenty. But it doesn't stop pulling till 11,500? Anyway you could shift at 6k all day long and not be lacking.

    I like cruising around 6k because there is almost zero vibrations. I mean zero, on mine.
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  4. Oyabun

    Oyabun 親分

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    Ummm. I might have missed it, but I haven't seen a dyno chart on how the 400 delivers it's power. Can you point me to any source of information there?


    I wish it would be easy. I have a fairly big excel with all cb500x re-engineering data - including weight loss (with cost/weight) analysis. It has pretty much everything from removal of pair system, through changing to lighter weight LIPo battery, lighter chain and sprockets, lightweight ally head stay and cut of the rearmost portion of the subframe and using a tail tidy. Counted for adapting an NC750 alloy swingarm, changing the stock rear shock to a lighter aftermarket one, install cat delete headers and aftermarket can, braided brake lines, Ti banjo and caliper bolts and a lot more smaller items. All together I could account for 11,3 kg what is approx 25 lbs for an estimated cost of almost 3000 EUR. And that's before adding any farkles. I don't believe this would be reasonable.

    edit: Oh I almost missed it. Lighter than stock spoked front wheel and lighter front fork also accounted for. I'm installing a custom tuned YZ fork with reduced travel and still expecting to end up lighter than stock.

    I have good news for ya. Shall you want to own a 480lbs commuter with a robotised gearbox, the NC750x is officially available in the states from 2018 :-)
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  5. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    We have enough experience to understand what to expect from a 400-500 twin based on what we know so far.
    The earlier post includes the power values and gearing ratios published.
    The info is based on the advertised ninja 400 values, nothing official. We are just speculating as the thread says.

    Personally I don't want a 480lb hog and definitively nothing w/o a clutch for me.

    If a 400 doesn't come then the project I have in mind would be most likely finding alternatives including used and most likely a new old year model.
    I would not want any fairings on the bike, only the minimal and a screen. That is a few more pounds one can take out.
    Not comprehensive planning analysis nor decision has been made. just speculating

    I do not discard a bastard build. I know where to get a nice engine here in the USA.
    This is a good example. Probably a better seat I can have made at a saddle maker here locally.
    http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/crf500l-build-3-the-brit-remix.1212738/

    I have a machine shop and I am a hobby machinist so many things are easy for me. I can make parts stronger and lighter than the original
    if I want too. The problem is time but no hurry. Lets see where this all goes.
  6. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    The battery as mentioned is an easy way , going lithium, but still $100 bucks for a few pounds. I have done that before. Could use the 100 bucks now.
  7. Oyabun

    Oyabun 親分

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    Often looked over, but Hinda also has a 400cc version of its 500 named (in reality 471cc engine), for the Asian market. It has the same or better power figures (same power at lower revs, and more or less the same torque) than the Kawi400. Dunno about it's weight tho..

    I can manage with machines myself, and been trained on them - but I have no provisions of such a shop at home. Have access to quite a few traditional machines (so no sophisticated CNC) to work on my projects.
    Sadly the CB5 family had been designed with budget in mind, so it would be quite difficult (or too costly) to machine parts to be lighter. E.g. the YZ forks I'm adapting currently are ligher sepite being 48mm diameter, USD, and double travel. But they have a proper high diameter axle what is gun drilled from the facory, and steering axle is made from aluminium alloy to save weight. Same goes for the lower tripe what is ally instead of the cast steel on the CB.
    Yes, there are possible wins like very small items e.g. eloxed alloy wheel spacers. Also potentially cross-drilled axles (in case one has a proper gun drill) but then material should be changed and post manufacture heat treatment would be necessary. One part what is heavy and potentially could be simplified/changed is the rear subframe - but again depending on use one might need the buffed up rear part for a porky "westerner", pillion and luggage.
    A plastic or ally tank could also shave over a good kilogram of the bike.

    Sacrificial lightening (e.g. completely dropping parts or functionality) is always an option. For reference the minimum starting weight of the CBR500R in the European Junior cup was 155kg. That is without any lights, simplified wiring harness, lighter front fairing stay, full race plastics, decat pipes and race muffler, lighter subframe - and added goodies like pcv, quick shift, slipper clutch, extended race radiator etc. That is about 23 kilograms of lost weight from the stock 178kg dry weight on a bike what is practically identical to the X in core functionality.

    The CRF500L is a truly great machine. The only problem that it cannot be road registered or insured here where I live - or rather in Continental Europe.

    Sorry for the off topic - now back to our original programming.
    Anyone has an official figure on the weight of the kawi 400 (or 300) engine? Including TB, gearing, clutch etc.
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  8. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    The KLE500 never made it to the USA and it seems it was simple to get 30-50lbs off based on what others reported.
    If they were here, a low miles one would make a decent baseline for a fun project.
  9. DavidM1

    DavidM1 Unicorn hunting

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    @GhettoCanuck - this should be here. I like it.

    Although I think I still want a 21" front wheel.

    Edit to show GhettoCanuck's pic.

    [​IMG]
  10. Oyabun

    Oyabun 親分

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    Dunno about weight saving possibility, but the KLE is a mediocre bike at best with 80's engineering. A carbureted twin with _many_ known issues not known for it's high quality, longevity or fuel efficiency.
  11. ag_streak

    ag_streak Tiene Ruta Cuarenta? Super Supporter

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    CB500X has only 8 more hp, but 67% more torque (at 7k rpm instead of 10k).

    Just sayin'... :freaky

    Edit: 10 more hp...
  12. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    Honda builds them for torque. That's why hp is low. I like the cb, just different ,and the X isn't lacking torque for it's weight.

    The nc700 is built for torque, but it doesn't make it as fun. In it's class.
  13. DavidM1

    DavidM1 Unicorn hunting

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    But do a Versys-X 400 / CB500X comparison:

    CB500X - 195kg, 47hp, 32ftlb.
    VX400 - 175kg, 45hp, 28ftlb. Maybe take another kilo off since the 400 motor is lighter.
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  14. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    Here's the old 500 ninja specs.

    Basic specs: A 498cc, dohc, four-stroke parallel-Twin with four valves per cylinder. In our test of the EX500 in September of 1987, the engine made 59 hp at 9800 rpm and 34 ft.-lb. of torque at 8500. That allowed the 400-pound (dry) EX to turn a 12.99-second, 101.98-mph quarter-mile time. Cycle World

    Pretty sure that's rear tire numbers.
  15. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    The nc700 has a 670cc engine, 48cv and 500lbs. I think grandpas volvo accelerates faster !! lol

    The things is bikes should not be compared like that, they are different uses. I think the CB is also liked becasue it is very somooth.
    300, 400, 500 who cares? They will all do great. I think the OP is about the possibility of a x400 after the ninja 400 hits the streets
    and how that x400 is going to look. All speculation at this point but, there is a reasonable expectation.
  16. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    The 500 ninja was on my radar for a while. I almost picked one up and was going to keep the drz400. I went with the X instead.


    If it looks like the rendered pics it will be a home run. Thanks !
  17. DavidM1

    DavidM1 Unicorn hunting

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    If a Versys-X 400 looks anything like GhettoCanuck's pic, I would have one. I like the higher front mudguard, gives it more authority.
  18. rideforzen

    rideforzen Been here awhile

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    As long as it functions well. Then looks. To me anyways.
  19. 11motos

    11motos Feral Rider

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    I like the mudguard the way it is in the 300. high mudguards on the highway at substantial speed with lateral wind might start to flop around and make all sort of noise and vibration.
    Of course unless one makes them very stiff and that is when they will brake easier and also be heavier than they should.
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  20. DavidM1

    DavidM1 Unicorn hunting

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    Maybe the low one would look better if it was bright green - more presence.
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