Waterproof jackets with air vents to liner only, not worth it?

Discussion in 'Equipment' started by Dino de Laurentiis, May 30, 2019.

  1. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

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    Considering getting the Dainese Racing 3D-Dry jacket, it’s a tight fitting sports bike style jacket that fits most of my requirements for sport touring. However, the air vents doesn’t open up all the way through, but only to the waterproof liner. When checking jackets at the local shops around here, it seemed most of the waterproof jackets were like that. Are they actually of any use then or should I look elsewhere for another jacket?
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  2. PeteAndersson

    PeteAndersson Swede

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    The vents works really well as long as you're moving and the wind gets inside to cool you down. The "waterproofing" is a joke though. You'll need rain gear on top to stay dry if it's worse than a few minutes of drizzle.
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  3. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

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    Good to know about the vents.

    Regarding waterproofing, is that specifically for Dainese jackets with the D-Dry membrane? What I’ve heard elsewhere is that it might not be as good as Rukka and their goretex in that it doesn’t hold water if going through three day long rain storms but that it’s more than adequate for “normal” rain. But maybe that’s not the case?r
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  4. dddd

    dddd Long timer

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    Same answer as on another thread:
    You know how you can add layer to get warm? well, do the same for waterproof. Buy a rain suit to put over.
    NO waterproof gear can possibly breathe adequately. Not even those claiming to. You will sweat 100x faster than what they can evaporate, so forget about waterproof liners or shells.

    This lowers the price of the gear because you don't have to hunt a unicorn who claims to do it all.
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  5. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

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    I answered you in the other thread as well, but to me, a rain over suit is a non starter, it’s just far too inconvenient.

    While what you say about breathability is true, there is a major inconvenience factor to relying on a extra water proof over suit. For one, they often take up surprisingly large amount of space. I like to travel with minimal luggage, just small side cases, but then my rain suit takes up like a third of the available space. Second, they’re often bulky when you put them on too, not as close fitting as an integrated rainproof jacket. Most importantly, if you’re riding in shifting conditions, with rain and sun, it becomes to warm with the rain suit on when sunny so frequent stops having to it put on or take it off, cause obviously a rain suit breathes even less than a waterproof membrane.

    Tried the rain over suit way several times but I’ve come to the conclusion that the eventual advantages are by far outweighed by the numerous disadvantages
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  6. sieg

    sieg Wearing out tires......2 at a time, day after day. Supporter

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    Hmmmm…..……….I guess you can just plan on getting wet when it rains. :dunno
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  7. Shaolin

    Shaolin Been here awhile

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    Have you considered the RS Taichi Drymaster Prime? I've seen a few videos of vloggers from SE Asia who wear RS Taichi jackets and I imagine that they use them through their monsoon season. Basically a waterproof shell with lots of direct to skin venting, no waterproof inner liner to block airflow.
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  8. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    I tried one of these. THe venting is fantastic (I love the little wrist scoops), but the "waterproofing" is just a polyurethane coating on the inside of the nylon, with the thinnest seam tape I've ever seen.

    To the OP: there's two different "vent to the liner" types. One where it's a sewn in z-liner, and ones where you can remove the waterproof liner. With the latter, you can at least achieve to the body venting on hotter days with little chance of rain. On the former it's basically temperate and cool weather only.
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  9. dddd

    dddd Long timer

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    Just so we don't write twice, the other thread is at https://advrider.com/f/threads/waterproof-adventure-gear-towards-warm-climate.1386258/#post-37697152
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  10. Shaolin

    Shaolin Been here awhile

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    I used a Tourmaster Transition which has a built in waterproof liner. It's only good up to the low 80F then it gets too warm. Good for colder weather though.

    I currently use a Macna Geo 2 that has removable liners. With liners removed, it has decent venting to the high 80s but starts to feel warm over that. There are some new jackets that have removable waterproof linings and even bigger vents, IIRC, Revit and Olympia and maybe Oxford have these types.

    As far as RS Taichi Drymaster material is concerned, they used to sell a Drymaster set of rain gear. I've always wanted to buy the Drymaster Prime jacket but got my Macna for $160 (from about $400). I want lots of venting!
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  11. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

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    Yeah, the jacket I’m looking at is the Z-liner version, I don’t want a detachable liner if I can avoid it. Honestly seems difficult to find waterproof jackets with vent openings through the waterproof membrane. Wonder if it’s possible to modify the liner with waterproof zippers behind the outer openings?
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  12. shrederscott

    shrederscott Long timer

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    Hi

    I am sorry but I disagree with you on outer rain gear.

    IMHO ... inner rain liners are a poor solution ... to much trouble to take on and off ...outer layer gets wet ... outer layer vents stop working ...bulky to store.

    Waterproof / breathable gore type single layer ... to hot for me where I live ...but ...If I lived in Seattle I would use it...cool and wet is where gore works best ! ! !

    Mesh jacket and mesh pants with LIGHT compact rain over layer ... this rocks for me.

    I use the Marmot Precip jacket and full side zip pant. This gear is designed for backpacking ... it's very light and compact when not in use ...it's not expensive. .. Jacket has pit zips for venting and a stowaway hood for off bike.....pit zips let you keep jacket on longer in warmer conditions . Gear is not tight fitting .. but ... far from a bulky fit

    The downside is this gear is unlikely to survive a off on the street ... it will survive most off's in the dirt no problem .... minor trail damage easily repaired with duck tape.

    For me the 2 layer system with the rain layer being external works best. .. but I live in Colorado ... rain gear is needed .. but not often

    Good luck

    Scott
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  13. Dino de Laurentiis

    Dino de Laurentiis Working on it

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    No need to be sorry, but your approach won’t work for me. I also absolutely need something that can handle a crash on tarmac, otherwise I don’t see the point. Thanks for the input though!
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  14. shrederscott

    shrederscott Long timer

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    Why does it need survive a crash on the slab ? ?

    It is not expensive to replace .... all your abrasion and impact protection is provided by your inner layers.

    Most protective riding gear textile or leather will not survive a off on the slab without damage either ! !

    Scott
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  15. lmavin

    lmavin Been here awhile

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    I was in the same boat as you. Wanted a sport type jacket, waterproof without having to add a liner.
    I bought a Scott Sport DP jacket. Vents only to the liner.
    I love the jacket but after 24 or 25 degrees Celsius it is too warm.
    For summer temps. I'm going to have to go back to a mesh jacket with a light waterproof shell that can be quickly put on overtop. It's still way more convenient than a liner that you have to zip in.
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  16. AustinRT

    AustinRT Been here awhile

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    Any well made Gore-Tex or equivalent substitute will generally meet your needs. Each jacket will have other likable or dis-likable attributes. No jacket is truly going to be comfortable in temps above 80s when stopped or in higher humidity. If you travel any distance from home then where you live is really not that relevant. OP says he doesnt want a separate outer layer that requires advance consideration, stopping on the side of the road, and/or storing away when not in use. Respect this, it's his criteria and there are many jackets he can choose from. Rukka, Klim, and many others will fit the bill. $$ will be required if you want quality, longevity, and performance. Gore-Tex jackets with liner adhered to inner surface shell works perfectly well unless damaged or worn out. And yes, sooner or later that expensive sucker will leak and you will likely be pissed. Just the way it is.

    If jacket frequently comes in contact with tarmc then waterproof may not be the biggest issue for consideration.
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  17. PeteAndersson

    PeteAndersson Swede

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    Gore-Tex is a much better product compared to any other membrane clothing I have tried, and I do have tried many. Other brands are not competitive at all. D-dry is just as poor as all the others. I don't know what you mean by "normal rain" but any rain will get you wet quickly when wearing D-dry.
    If the conditions are so warm that you actually are sweating when doing nothing then Gore-Tex doesn't keep you comfortable. If you wear cotton underneath it doesn't really work etc. That's the price you pay for staying waterproof.
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  18. Shaolin

    Shaolin Been here awhile

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    I too subscribe to the mesh jacket under rain gear solution for summertime temps. I was using military Goretex parka which has huge armpit vents. Military goretex parkas and pants are cut loose so they are very easy to put on,.The material is robust enough to no flap in the wind. The downside is that I have to put a hiviz vest over it to be seen. Now using a Helly Hansen setup with pit vents, hi viz color and reflectors and is just as easy to put on. My military goretex gear lost its waterproofness because of age (even after I recoated with Revivex).

    BTW, I use a robust Kushitani/BMW mesh leather combo jacket with NP armor throughout. If it's really hot, I might use a Tourmaster mesh although it doesn't give me much confidence (loose fit and cheap mesh).
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  19. davidji

    davidji bike curious

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    If the liner isn't removable and the vents only go to the liner, doesn't sound good to me. If the liner is removable, great.

    D-dry users have mixed reports. Some like it a lot. Others including me got wet. For me, I got wet through my only D-Dry garment within minutes in a light rain. Returned it. I wonder if they've changed what they call D-Dry over the years, and also if mine was defective?

    Anyway the fact that I could return it to the Dainese D-Store where I bought it was nice. Replaced it with Dainese Goretex that was waterproof.
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  20. cblais19

    cblais19 Long timer

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    You can absolutely find plenty of waterproof jackets with direct to skin venting - it's just $$$, and generally not cut for sport riding. The Klim Apex is a sport touring cut, as is the Klim Kodiak set; Stadler out of Germany has plenty of GorePro stuff meant for sport touring, and Held has a couple of jackets with direct venting that are a specifically sport cut as well. Note that almost all of those options are coming from Europe because the US market is so tiny in comparison.

    if you live in a more temperate climate, the new Spidi Alpintrophy suit looks like a nice moderately vented sport touring option - their Toray provided H2Out laminated kit isn't terrible at all.
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