Wheel bearing disintegrates - F800

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe' started by tmex, Aug 24, 2009.

  1. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    Thanks man.. I'm looking. I think I'm gonna call @woody's wheel works first thing in the morning. Monday is Canada day here but maybe I can source something from the States.. I can get a U-Haul here and there is a local machinist and local auto parts here like Napa etc

    Always enjoyed your videos in the winter months btw
  2. squr3l

    squr3l alpaca

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    Glad you're ok after that. Hopefully you can source a new wheel quickly and continue the trip. If you need any parts from the US I could help out.
  3. shuswap1

    shuswap1 Long timer

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    How does one buy a better quality bearing? This is ridiculous, these early failures, especially those from street riding. I just replaced the drive/impeller bearings in a Kawasaki Jetski with only 50 hrs on them, dry as a bone. Before installing the new bearings I pulled the 'seals'(what loose fitting junk they are) and added Belray waterproof grease. The new bearings had almost zero grease in them, certainly not enough to displace any water intrusion.
    BTW, I've never had a bearing failure on a motorcycle, no matter how old and always grease them heavily at each tire change, to the point of making a bit of a mess.
  4. bmwroadsterca

    bmwroadsterca RadioFlyer

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    See post #834 and earlier about Woody's investigation and the interference fit.

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  5. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    I also added waterproof grease when I swapped the tire for this trip.

    Based on previous experience with my 2012 F800GS which rear bearings only started to feel crunchy at over 40k kms I assumed these rear bearings on my 2014 would survive this trip to about 25k kms. The 2012 was ridden 80/20 mostly street and started to go after riding mostly off road

    I think like everything it depends how/where you ride. I've been riding long distance off road mud/rain water crossings etc
  6. DSRPilot

    DSRPilot Adventurer

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    Question about this.
    At tire change are you talking about adding grease heavily between the seal and the sealed bearing?
    Is it possible to remove the seal from the sealed bearing and add grease to the actual bearing while still in the hub?

    The limited wheel bearing replacements I've done has been on dirt bikes, and I don't think I've ever gotten a bearing out that I could or would want to reuse.

    Just trying to understand your process...
  7. outty

    outty (☞゚ヮ゚)☞

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    I put water-proof, high temp moly grease around the face of the bearings and some on the inside of the dust seal, then reassemble. I don't use gobs of it, just enough for a coating that will stay put. I then put a thin coat on the spacers too. I avoid spraying high pressure water at the bearings so I don't blow out the grease.

    I'm at 40,000 kms and the bearings spin freely without crunching. Zero lateral play.

    2014 F800GSA
  8. DSRPilot

    DSRPilot Adventurer

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    Call from the bike shop late last week said that all of the hub clearances were within spec.
    The long spacer in the center of the hub was not. Having them order all new spacers.
    I packed the new bearings with green grease (waterproof, boat trailer grease).
    I put a lot more grease in than came in the bearings. Still left a little room for expansion.
    I'll put the wheel back on the bike and grease between the external seal and the sealed bearing as well as the axle.

    All I can do at this point, unless you have any suggestions...
  9. shuswap1

    shuswap1 Long timer

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    Sometimes I do just that, add grease to the balls directly, but generally I just pack as much grease as possible all around the seal and the bearing as well as any spacers. My simple theory is to displace any water/dirt intrusion.
    See:


    The above video shows how easy it is to replace or supplement the grease after removing the so-called seal (you'll know why I am scornful after removing). It is more like a dust boot than a seal. BTW, I don't remove bearings unless replacing them, which isn't very often! I may have to change my tune on this after inspecting the bearings on our F700s this fall.

    Just be aware that because I use the grease quite(very) liberally there is a mess that will appear around the axle and seal cover that will attract dirt and look a little grubby.
  10. DSRPilot

    DSRPilot Adventurer

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    Ok, makes sense now. I've always put as much grease in and around the axle and bearings as I could get.

    I never really considered adding grease to the sealed bearing. Of course, I never realized how little grease there was in the bearing, nor the fact that it wasn't waterproof grease. This will be a best practice for both road and dirt bikes alike going forward...

    I guess if you can get your finger in to turn the bearing to check it, you should be able to access the seal and add grease.
    I think on the brake side you might have to remove the circlip to get the seal off.
    Hopefully I'll have the wife's wheel back at the end of the week and can look at it before putting it back on the bike.
  11. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    I found a used wheel with bearings off a low mileage bike not too far away. I ordered the calliper/mount from the same bike.

    The wheel is easy enough to install in the parking lot. I'm wondering if I can swap in the calliper without losing brake fluid myself
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  12. DSRPilot

    DSRPilot Adventurer

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    Excellent! Good News.
    If you clamp the hydraulic line while making the change you might only have to bleed the system after the swap...
    $15.99 at Harbor Freight. You could probably even go to a local office supply store and get one of those big heavy duty paper clamps. How about, two stout sticks with a tight rubber band around each end?

    upload_2018-7-3_15-55-27.png upload_2018-7-3_16-0-22.png
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  13. Motoriley

    Motoriley Still riding like crap after all these years.

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    Great news. If you get a vacuum bleeder it only takes a few minutes to bleed the brakes.

    https://www.amazon.ca/Mityvac-MV800...8&qid=1530648400&sr=1-24&keywords=vacuum+pump
    [​IMG]

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  14. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    I actually managed to bleed the rear before myself by doing some acrobatics but I can get a hand with that. I'm mostly worried about losing too much fluid during the swap and having to source more. There are 2 auto parts stores and a small motorsport shop in town

    The rear rotor Scheffelmeier Metall spacer is somewhat deformed. I ordered a new one from BMW but unsure if it will get to my hands this week.. I'm really hoping the axle sleeve is inside the used wheel and circlips etc (which should be if it has the bearings right?)
  15. Motoriley

    Motoriley Still riding like crap after all these years.

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    Fluid is super cheap and the available everywhere. Spacer should be in the hub if the bearings are there. Sounds like your getting everything together.

    QUOTE="jackalsour, post: 35392427, member: 188596"]I actually managed to bleed the rear before myself by doing some acrobatics but I can get a hand with that. I'm mostly worried about losing too much fluid during the swap and having to source more. There are 2 auto parts stores and a small motorsport shop in town

    The rear rotor Scheffelmeier Metall spacer is somewhat deformed. I ordered a new one from BMW but unsure if it will get to my hands this week.. I'm really hoping the axle sleeve is inside the used wheel and circlips etc (which should be if it has the bearings right?)[/QUOTE]




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  16. kenny robert

    kenny robert Long timer

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    just remember the only reason for grease on a radial ball bearing is very important to displace air spaces that otherwise water could see in
    the mechanical reason is for the ball to cage interface which is a sliding rub
    luckilly our wheel bearings are never exposed to anything at all near high rotational speeds or heavy loads or sharp impact loads they have an easy life

    high rotaitional speeeds and radial ball bearings do not mix well with too much lube theyt will liteally fry themselves in specific situations
    i only mention that because it is interesting
    but yeah too much radial crush on the install of a std radial ball bearing reduces the clearance to become a problem
    this is why cranshaft bearings are special c-3 etc
    they are extra precision made with extra clearance so that a spoecific significant interference crush fit brings them to a clearance tolerance in the sweet zone for that bearing
    the center spacer is very critical if it is shorter than the what the bearings sit
    it will fubar the bearing because the ball paths are forced to ride too heavilly on a more side contact which skids not rols and creates heat
    that is why a mc wheel is not ideal on a sidehack outfit
    front espoecially the bearings are on;y designed for radial loads
    once an mc becomes a hack it no longer leans into turns .it uses different dynamics
    all that said you can in most sizes get a more durable bearing designed for axial and radial loads
    angular contact bearings need to be used in pairs oppos]ing each other
    this type of bearing is what belongs on tow behind trailers sidehack rigs all 3 wheels etc
    the standard or deep groove radial ball bearing is never anywhere near its limits of load capacity as used in motorcyclers
    if failure is a problem loook beyond the actual bearing do not question its application
  17. outty

    outty (☞゚ヮ゚)☞

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    So basically, to sum this up, if our bearings are failing it is not likely the bearings themselves that are the issue, we should be looking to other causes first? (I.e. The hub tolerances, poor install, etc...)
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  18. Motoriley

    Motoriley Still riding like crap after all these years.

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    Yup.

    QUOTE="outty, post: 35393144, member: 408553"]So basically, to sum this up, if our bearings are failing it is not likely the bearings themselves that are the issue, we should be looking to other causes first? (I.e. The hub tolerances, poor install, etc...)[/QUOTE]




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  19. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    Wheel and calliper mount already shipped today

    That little spacer is only $20 from BMW but it takes 1 day from the warehouse to BMW dealer before they can ship it to me

    Local machinist/rider is going to look at the spacer but I don't know how easy/expensive it would be for him to fabricate one
  20. jackalsour

    jackalsour Xennial

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    BMW Langley called back that they can't get the wheel spacer tomorrow like they thought. Looks like it was already claimed

    It's the spacer on the rotor side you replace with Scheffelmeier Metall spacer $12 USD/$20 CAD part # 36 31 7 653 136 spacer bushing exterior.

    Somebody might have one kicking around they replaced with Scheffelmeier's. I had a few at home but they're in storage now..

    Other option is to try to repair the deformed one I have.