XR200R Pit Bike Project

Discussion in 'Some Assembly Required' started by JagLite, Jan 2, 2017.

  1. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    I measured the ground clearance as it sits.
    10" to the bottom of the skid plate.
    It has 10" travel up front and I think 10" in the rear.
    I don't remember exactly but when I had Rick (Cogent Dynamics) build the shock for it I think I asked for 10" travel to match the front.
    I have 2.75" rider sag on the rear with me sitting on the bike.

    It is funny that I never thought about ground clearance when planning the conversion. Duh! :doh
    I don't plan to ride it fast or hard, no big jumps for me. :muutt
    I break too easily now and it takes far too long to heal. :kurt

    It's just a little trailbike to putt around on.
    Put on the hitch carrier and take it camping.

    Although I did swing by the local mx track this weekend to ride some but the gate was locked. :becca
    Maybe next weekend. :2cry
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  2. cedric

    cedric Been here awhile

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    Shouldn't be a problem, looks like a fun scoot. :clap
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  3. FR700

    FR700 Heckler ™©®℗

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    Your imagination.

    Grab an old spark plug and cut the top off it. After you've removed the guts from the plug just tap a thread into it that matches one of the adapters.
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  4. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    Genius! :beer
  5. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    First ride on the XR200RM :wings :ricky

    Pictures:

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    And finally, this is the scenery I enjoyed:

    [​IMG]

    The bike is still hard to start and takes a dozen kicks before firing. :dirtdog
    Very cold blooded and has to have the choke on for several minutes before going to half choke for another several minutes. :scratch
    The serious off idle bog is still there and surprisingly (to me) lowering the needle by putting the clip two grooves higher made zero difference. :fpalm

    The engine runs great above quarter throttle and idles well when warmed up so need to get a couple more jets to experiment with.

    I rode a few of the trails and once I got used to keeping the engine above quarter throttle it is a blast, light, very maneuverable and nimble, and comfortable for my 6'-4" and 190 lbs.
    This was also my first ride with the Pod Active K8 knee braces that I bought last fall after damaging the mcl and meniscus of one leg playing around.
    Excellent braces. :thumb
    I never noticed them after putting them on which means they didn't bother me in any way, didn't hurt or restrict movement, nor did they interfere with riding the bike.
    The are expensive (for me anyway) at $800 but that is less than the doctor, x-rays, and 6 weeks of recovery it took out of my last riding season.

    Back to trail riding!

    Unfortunately.... :yikes

    The bike died on the trail. :hung

    I was riding a very tight trail through the forest with lots of tight turns, lots of large roots crossing the trail, and some rocks in the ups and downs and twists and turns of the trail that is perfect for the new pit bike.
    About one mile away from the car and trailer, cruising along in 2nd gear and suddenly it was lights out. No fire in the hole. Flameout. Dead on the trail. :pep

    I waited 10 minutes and tried starting it but it never made the slightest indication there was any spark. :grim


    Of course I brought lots of tools with me.
    They were in the car in the parking lot. :dirtdog
    Argh! :muutt

    I hadn't seen another bike or quad on the trails so I started pushing.
    I was glad this is a light bike because those fun ups and downs and twists and turns weren't any fun when pushing. :becca
    I pushed until I was breathing hard then took a break for a few minutes, then I kicked the engine several times just in case it was a heat related problem but nada.
    It took more than half an hour to get back to an area I could drive the car and trailer to so I left the bike there and walked on.
    That's when I realized the Pod braces were quite comfortable to walk in and that I hadn't even thought about them while riding. :nod

    Finally back at the car I drove over and loaded the bike on the trailer for the hour drive back home.

    Overall, I am very happy with the bike and it is really a fun bike to ride with the 17" front and 14" wheels, and the suspension is excellent.
    Now to get the engine running like it should (it is a Honda after all) and it will be a fun play bike. :rayof

    I will check the electrical system and take the carb apart again.
    I used a carb rebuild kit from XR's Only and it came with the wrong idle jet screw (they sent me the correct one when I asked) but it is possible the pilot jet is the wrong size, or some other issue.
    Hey, it is an old engine, and a highly modified Frankenbike so I expect some issues to need attention. :hmmmmm

    The fork springs are too soft which I expected since they are set up for a lighter bike with a much lighter rider (RM85).
    I plan to send them to Rick at Cogent Dynamics next winter for him to rebuild and put a bit stiffer springs in. :beer
    For this summer they are fine though since I am not jumping doubles anymore.
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  6. wolfcreek rider

    wolfcreek rider Adventurer

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    Earthquake Central NorCal
    You might have a problem with the stator. I'm in the middle of sorting out a xr600r with a similar issue. Ricky stator is supposed to be good.

    Edit: I just just checked their web site and I don't see a listing for your bike. Sorry.
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  7. Roadracer_Al

    Roadracer_Al louder, louder, louder!

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    Congrats on finishing your project!

    RE: hard starting. In my experience with small thumpers -- I ran maintenance for a small new rider school -- I'd suggest that you set the valves to the loose end of the recommended clearance. Not only did my "this POS won't start" trouble tickets drop to almost zero, the "dead battery" trouble tickets went away as well.

    RE: dead on the trail. I feel ya! I can't remember if you've set this up with or without a battery - I'm going to assume with.

    It's probably not the stator b/c that is a charging system failure, and the voltage would drop slowly, run bad, then quit. If it's without a battery, yes, it could be the stator.

    If it shut off "like a switch" ... check the switches! Both for position (it's not impossible that a twig flipped the kill switch) and the continuity/function of the switch itself.

    After that, check the chassis ground wire, the fuses, the ignition coil, and with the ignition on (and some means of seeing a make/break connection such as as a light or a buzzer) just jiggle the wiring harness all over the bike to see what happens.
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  8. tinwelp

    tinwelp Professional Idiot

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2010
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    Deepest Southern France
    Congratulations on finally getting the mini-beast out in the sticks. I built something very similar a very long time ago with an XR200 engine of questionable history in a KX80 chassis. It was brilliant fun before it was stolen... then recovered after lying upside down in a corn field for six months... and never ran again. I've still got it all somewhere and you may have just inspired me to pull it all out!

    As for the sudden stop, if you are running the CDI version of the engine, I may have a suggestion. If yes, maybe worth noting I had a similar problem caused by the CDI trigger coil shorting out. A new coil and everything was back to working well. If they're no longer available, I suspect rewinding the bugger wouldn't be too hard.

    Cheers... Paul
  9. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    Thanks for the suggestions!

    That's interesting about the valve clearance causing starting problems, I will keep that in mind, thanks. :thumb

    The bike has no battery, no reg/rec, no switches, and no wiring harness to speak of.
    It does have a kill button that is new and I hadn't thought it might be a possible problem because once the engine starts it is fine and it dies when I push the kill button.
    But I know weird things can happen so I will add that to the list of possibilities.
    Could be a bad coil, or spark plug lead or cap... :fpalm
    The electrical system is so simple there isn't much to check so I hope to find the smoking gun quickly.
    I hope to be able to spend and hour or two in the shop tonight.

    Your XR200KX sounds like fun and just needs some TLC to come back from the dead, I hope you do it! :beer
    CDI? That's a good question. :hmmmmm
    I think that is what it has, there is no battery, no lights, no switches, no key, nada.
    I checked online yesterday and see that the stator is available from several aftermarket sources.
    One problem for me is that I have a terrible memory so I can't remember which bike has what systems. :scratch
    That's why I buy the shop manual for any bike I own, I have to be able to read the instructions to do anything.
    I was going to order a carb rebuild kit for one bike recently but fortunately I looked at the carb first and saw that I already bought and installed the kit...

    I'm hoping to be able to ride the bike a lot this summer so I need to work out the bugs quickly.
    Of course, I won't neglect my other bikes, I will just have to exercise each one... :ricky
  10. wolfcreek rider

    wolfcreek rider Adventurer

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    Look in your shop manual (I hope it's a factory one) and look for the resistance specs for the stator and the pulse generator. Coil also.
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  11. moffy

    moffy foolish fool

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    perth
    Awesome:))
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  12. Foxed101

    Foxed101 Monkeywrench

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    Aug 1, 2015
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    Holland
    Great to see it out in the wild:clap:clap
    Bummer you got more excersise than you bargained for:lift

    Beat the gremblins and ride the wheels off it!


    Btw. You should get a commission. Would never had gone for the Chinese pitbike mufflers for my project if it weren’t for your endorsement :pope
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  13. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    No time to get into checking the carb and ignition other than to pull the plug last night.
    With the plug out I cranked the engine over by hand and thought maybe I saw a hint of a spark so I turned off the shop lights and tried again in the dark.

    Yep, there is the tiniest little wimpy spark I've ever seen on a new plug. :confused
    Didn't appear to spark every time either, more like 2 out of 3 times. :hmmmmm
    Sometimes I could crank it over 5 times with no spark, then the next 2 it would. :scratch

    Maybe tonight I will be able to spend some time out in the shop...
  14. Roofchop

    Roofchop Hands up mother stickers, this is a f**k up!

    Joined:
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    Have you got a spare coil to swap in? Bad grounds??
    Bad stator coil/connections??
    :hmmmmm
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  15. mach1mustang351

    mach1mustang351 Long timer Supporter

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    I was messing around for quite a while with a customer bike that was having a similar spark, no spark weak spark issue. It ended up being a couple things, but the main one was a bad ground. The engine wasn't grounded to the chassis very well and at times I would get a good test and other times not.

    One of those things, super simple points system... But headache to nail down
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  16. NorthernTraveler

    NorthernTraveler Long time Adventurer

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    There is a problem with the older pulse coils on the ATC motors, it may be the same with the XR motor.
    There are after market pulse coils availavle for very little money, so now I automatically replace them.
    The XR uses a pickup coil with a rectangular connector, the ATC uses 2 bullet connectors, and they are different resistances.
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  17. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    I took the carb off and apart last night to check the jets:

    [​IMG]

    Main jet 110
    Low speed jet 38
    Correct numbers but I looked at the low speed jet and the hole through the center is microscopic.
    I don't know what it should look like so I will buy another one see if it is any different.

    I tried to run a plastic bristle from my brush through it but it is way too large in diameter to go through the jet.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The bristle would go through the holes in the side with no problem:

    [​IMG]

    And the plug reading:

    [​IMG]

    No time to start testing the ignition but I did read the manual section on testing the different parts and problems.
    From the reading it sounds like a bad CDI as someone suggested.
    I will have to dig out the parts bike and remove the ignition parts to swap and check.

    Now to find out if the local dealer carries jets or if I will need to order some.
    I think I will get a couple bigger main jets too.
  18. Salsa

    Salsa Long timer

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    Do you have a left over Pit bike CDI. I would try it.

    Don
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  19. Andyvh1959

    Andyvh1959 Cheesehead Klompen Supporter

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    Da frozen tundra eh? 1.5 mile west of Lambeau
    I agree. I can kick start my XL600R (with no comp release), or my GN400 ice bike (with comp release) and I'm only 5'-6" and 200lbs. The XL600R takes a healthy kick, wearing MX boots, and making certain the piston is just at DTC on the compression stroke. The GN400, when I use the comp release right, I can lick start in house slippers easily. I kick it over with the comp lever held in once, then one kick until the comp lever clicks back out, ignition on and one easy kick and it fires. The GN400 has a new aftermarket CDI. The XL600R has the original CDI, which I suspect is faulty because I can just barely ease the throttle up to get about 60 mph tops. Those old XL600R were known to get much higher speeds than that.

    I have to resolve a tranny issue in my XR200R until I get ready to fire it up.
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  20. JagLite

    JagLite Long timer Supporter

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    I tested the alternator (stator), the coil, the plug cap and wire, the pulse generator, checked the engine ground and the coil ground and everything is in spec.
    I removed the parts off the spare parts bike and tested each of them, all in spec.
    Then I tried replacing one part at a time and checking the spark.
    I bought a new plug and tried again.

    No change at all in any condition. :baldy
    Just the same puny spark that I can't see unless I turn all the lights off.

    Reading online for similar problems it seems there is no one answer, it could be any part of the ignition system.
    Now what I wonder? I think I will have to buy new parts to find the culprit.
    I would take it to someone who knows more (that's just about everyone) but I have had no good results when I have taken bikes to the dealer or other shops.
    Always I have had to redo what they did to make it right.

    I think I will order a new stator (alternator) to just start at the beginning...
    I tested mine for resistance and it is in range but I didn't replace it with the parts bike part.
    Several owners have posted that their stator tested in range but the problem remained until they replaced the stator with a new one.
    I'm at a loss of how I can narrow down the problem to find the culprit.

    The bike does have spark, it is just very weak.
    It is possible it has been like this since I bought it because the times I rode it before taking it apart for the modifications it was always hard to start but ran good once started.

    The new genuine Kehin jets I ordered arrived yesterday so last night I compared them with the new generic jets I had installed from the carb rebuild kit I bought at XR's Only.
    Interestingly, the pilot jet I had was too small for the needle cleaner that fit with no problem in the genuine Kehin jet so I hope that will make a big improvement in how the engine responds off idle.
    The Kehin main jet is just a bit bigger than the generic jet of the same number.

    I hope to have time this afternoon to start it up, or try to...