XR650R electricity

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by themansfield, Jan 8, 2009.

  1. Haverladr

    Haverladr Adventurer

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    Yes running all LED off one RR and the TT fan off the other leg with its own RR.... update I added a ground wire from the body of the RR to frame and this seemed to help rode tank of gas through the pig with frequent checks by touch got warm but not hot like it was seemed to "fix" the issue for now, will still check every now and then because well..
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  2. alteet

    alteet n00b

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    I pit an XR650L headlight on this bike using the horn/headlight mounting bracket off an XRL. I had to fab a couple of aluminum straps to mount the XRL bulb surround to the mounts on the fork tube. In an attempt to spare the stock stator, I put an LED headlight bulb in and swapped in a dual filment taillight/brakelight bulb. Turn signals are also LED, so my total light power is about 20 to 25 Watts.

    I wanted the lights and horn on DC so I did a little grinding on the fins of an XR650L R/R and mounted it in place of the XRR AC regulator. Since it wouldn't mount in the same way as the stock regulator, I had to through-bolt the new R/R to the airbox and sealed the holes with a dab of rtv. I'm not sure what the capacity of the XRL R/R is, but they've been adequate for the loads encountered on those bikes for years.

    I left the stator leg that powers the CDI alone, so it uses frame ground. I couldn't see any reason why the DC ground plane should be isolated from the AC gound plane, so I used the frame to ground the R/R DC output, too. I know some folks have said they encountered problems with this shared ground plane setup, but my piggie runs just fine. I.m thinking of adding a SPAL fan (35W) to the DC load and, since I don't anticipate using the horn constantly, I suspect the system will support it since I have a small battery wired in.

    IMG_0011.JPG IMG_0010.JPG
  3. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    The R/R ground wire/frame may be working as a heat sink if nothing else.
  4. RyanE

    RyanE Diamond on your timepiece

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    Hello folks. Great thread. I've started reading through but this is a long thread and I haven't made it far enough to see if my questions have been answered. So apologies in advance if this has already been posted.

    My XRR has a Rickystator 200w unit. Originally, when I bought the bike, it was setup with an AC circuit from 1 leg of the stator, running through a regulator and powering the Trailtech X2 with upgraded bulbs, heated grips (hi/low) and the Vapor. The other leg from the stator was run through a regulator/rectifier (DC) and small SLA battery and powered the other electrical components, such as the SPAL fan, turn/tail and brake lights, as well as a 12v power outlet. I always run a Garmin 78s plugged as well as various phone chargers and sometimes even a small 110v inverter to charge up camera batteries. I stopped with the inverter pretty quick since that's just too much stuff to carry. All was good.

    But then I rebuilt the bike (frame up) and made my own harness as I wasn't too impressed with the original dualsport setup. No issues, I streamlined some wiring but kept the same configuration. That worked fine for a few years but I was never satisfied with the X2 lighting. So I adapted some LED lights to the X2 housing. Of course, this requires DC.

    So I decided to combine both legs of the Rickystator into 1 single DC source. I ran the 2 green outputs together and 2 white outputs together and into a Baja Designs (Tympanium) regulator/rectifier. I believed the Baja Designs RR was rated for 250w?

    All seemed to work fine for a year or so. I decided to add a small digital voltmeter at some point to monitor voltage. It was high at times, up to 16v if I was running around with no lights on. So I made a habit of turning on my lights or grip heaters to drop it back down. That seemed to work. I assumed I was asking the RR to shunt too much since I am running a combined system. This usually only happened after several hours running down the highway at high rpm.

    One day I remember hitting redline on a shift and seeing the voltmeter spike to maybe 30v then go dead. I figured, since it was a cheapo Amazon special that it finally died of natural causes. No big deal. Well it seems that sometime around then I started having issues with my SLA battery dieing. I've got a small 1.2 AH battery crammed under the seat sideways. Well, I seemed to be killing one battery everytime i did a long (3-5000km) trip. I figured, long trip, cheap batteries and vibration was killing them.

    That was years ago. Fast forward to this weekend and I am installing another SLA battery and I decided to replace the blown out voltmeter too. I go for a quick shakedown and damn, the voltmeter is reading 12-13 vdc at idle but it quickly climbs with revs until 20+ vdc when riding. Oh oh? Maybe this cheapy voltmeter is junk, it is after all just another amazon/China $5 special. I swing back to the shop and pull the seat. That battery is smoking hot! Duh, its been getting slammed with 20 vdc as confirmed with my actual digital multimeter.

    So - I'm guessing my Baja Designs RR is fried? Running the full 200w is too much for it when I'm not applying much electrical load? How do I test to confirm it is screwed?

    And is there another readily available RR that can handle up to 200w of power? I really don't see any advantage to having an AC circuit on this bike, so splitting up the stator feeds to a split AC and DC system seems counterproductive. All of my electrical loads are DC, apart from the heated grips. Should I be running 2 separate DC circuits? Can I run 2 separate RR's but then feed them back into the same battery? This seems problematic since there is no way both will be producing the exact same voltage, so one would just end up doing all the work anyway?

    Phew, that's a real novel. Hope I didn't put you to sleep.
  5. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    If you're getting more than 15v from the reg/rec, the regulator part is toast.

    BD's reg/rec was never rated for 250w...Ricky Stator made one that was claimed to be rated at that level but isn't made anymore.

    I ran one of those RS units for a while with a combined output stator but always carried a spare on long rides. It's pretty clear the reg/rec is the least reliable part on the bike, especially now most people are going all-DC.

    I'm now running an FHO20AA Mosfet reg/rec and leave the spare r/r at home. It can handle 250w continuous (& quite a bit more), and uses Mosfet technology for faster switching and less heat. It costs more and you have to make space for it but the engine is more likely to fail than it is. Regarding space, it's quite a bit bigger than a tympanium-type unit but running 2 DC circuits takes extra space too and is a problematic solution.

    The Mosfet unit has three inputs (designed for three-phase bikes), but you only use two for the XR.

    It's still a shunt-type R/R...a series-type Mosfet is even more advanced, but they're bigger and the shunt type is already on the big side so I didn't consider one.

    Jack at https://www.roadstercycle.com/ is where I got mine.
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  6. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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    I second the MOSFET FHO20AA, I have one on an XRR as well . I got scammed with a fake FHO20AA so decided to pay a little more and get a good one from Rick's Motorsports, best part they charge lithium ion batteries at a 14.2 set point so no overcharging
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  7. RyanE

    RyanE Diamond on your timepiece

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    Thanks for that info Gildus and Akunin!

    I was afraid the RR was fried. You are correct, it was actually a RS RR that was rated for 250w. Shame they don't make them anymore as it is small and fits the spot on top of the airbox really well.

    Thanks for the link and info for the MOSFET unit. I will research my options there.

    Any chance something OEM from a large displacement street bike could work in this application? Or what about a more modern FI thumper application? I thought some of the more modern bikes like the WR250R had a fairly high capacity stator. I wonder if the RR for that application might be smaller?

    Where did you guys fit your FHO20AA units? I suppose I could relocate my battery to below the carb and try to fit the new RR under the seat. But maybe it won't get enough airflow there....?
  8. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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    I'm using a Antigravity 4 cell battery with my reg/rec. I've mounted both behind my headlight, you wouldn't believe what else I've managed to stuff back there.. a pdm60 circuit breaker, volt meter and even a sealed ground bus. Can't really see it here but I have plenty of room

    View attachment 1872195
  9. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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    Ok.. couldn't post pic in last post. So here it is. I hope.

    20190817_182913.jpg
  10. dogsslober

    dogsslober No neck tie, Ti neck

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    The FH020AA was stock on some Yamaha street bikes, I've found them on Ebay and motorcycle salvage"s yards
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  11. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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    Be sure to check over the sellers reviews if you buy on ebay, thats where they sent me a knock off. PayPal refunded it but doesn't help with time lost waiting
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  12. dogsslober

    dogsslober No neck tie, Ti neck

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    At least you know from Yamaha its the real deal, new unused.
    Salvage pretty much you know it was working when the bike wrecked
  13. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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    Yeah definitely the safest way to go to make sure you get the real deal
  14. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    Good advice, definitely a lot of counterfeit units out there...they're not built the same and may lead to a bike fire.
  15. RyanE

    RyanE Diamond on your timepiece

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    I did a bit more reading and understanding. Looks like I have the choice between an FH020AA, an SH775 or an SH847.

    It seems that the FH020AA is a MOSFET unit but it still uses the same shunt principle for excess current while the other 2 are not MOSFET but are of the series type so they limit load on the stator based on electrical demand. The SH847 has a higher current rating and is even bigger than the others.

    I really like the thought of the series units even though they don't offer the MOFSET technology but they are bigger. My dilemma is that sometimes when running down the highway on a summer day I'm running virtually no electrical devices apart from my 5w led low beam and an led tail light. Probably under 15w. So I have a remaining 185w to burn off via shunting. This seems bad for the stator since the XRR stator doesn't benefit from any cooling (oil).

    Do any of you run a similar DC only setup with very minimal draw at times? I know the MOSFET FH020AA can likely handle this, but what about the stator?

    I really like the kits from Roadstercycle and some other vendors but the cost with our crappy CAD and international shipping is killer. The basic FH020AA will run me about $230 Canadian pesos. The SH847 will be well over $300.

    I also found these from Canadian vendors:

    https://www.rmstator.com/en_ca/prod...yamaha-kawasaki-honda-lynx-1994-2017-rm30506h

    https://fortnine.ca/en/ricks-motorsport-electrics-rectifier-regulator

    Any thoughts on either of these? I'm guessing they are China copies of the FH020AA units. Turns out a work acquaintance has one of the RM units and is happy with it but has little riding time on it.

    I've also found a few used OEM SH775 units on Ebay for about $100 shipped. This would get me a series RR that I think I could benefit from. Seems like a gamble installing used parts and it really goes against my standard practice.

    Meanwhile, summer is fading and the riding season up here is passing me by......:cry
  16. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    Buying a used one would definitely be a gamble...only you can decide whether it's worth it.

    Personally I don't worry about the stator.

    It's just sealed coils of heavy gauge wire with no moving parts. The full voltage potential is always there even with a series reg/rec, so it will still short out if there's a problem. Sure, more current is flowing with a shunt type, but we're not talking about that many amps. Plus, stator rewind calculations were done assuming constant current with shunt type reg/recs so there's a built-in safety margin.
  17. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    Regarding that Rick's unit, I don't see a power rating.

    One thing about power capabilities, ratings for 3-phase reg-recs have to be discounted when you're only using two of the inputs.

    Here's a size comparison for some of the reg/recs you mentioned:

    upload_2019-9-3_23-7-28.png
  18. Akunin

    Akunin Neo-Vegabond

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  19. RyanE

    RyanE Diamond on your timepiece

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    Once again, awesome feedback.

    I think I am convinced that a FH020AA MOSFET style RR is what I need. I have also determined that CBR1000R and CB600RR bikes came equipped with an FH008 RR. Smaller and comes with integral wiring, instead of the external plug. This is easy to adapt to my setup and saves some space. I have a bunch of weather pack connectors around so I will use those.

    The FH008 seems to be fairly well regarded. It has less capacity than the FH020 but that's not really a problem with my setup that at best, puts out 200w, and probably less.

    I've purchased a few lightly used ones off evilbay. Will report back with my results when I get one installed.
  20. Gildus

    Gildus Long timer

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    I looked at the 008 some time ago...if I remember right it could handle 35 amps peak with 3-phase. If you derate 40% for single phase that's 21 amps. If you derate another 40% for a continuous rating you get about 13 amps. Shindengen also derates if the R/R doesn't have 1m/sec airflow (see below) so you might have issues if it's put under the seat surrounded by wires, etc.

    200 watts at 14V gives you 14.3 amps...guess it all depends how much constant load (lights, etc.) you'd be running to reduce the power the R/R needs to handle.

    upload_2019-9-5_18-29-30.png