You guys think Harley Davidson will last?

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by tessalino, Aug 24, 2019.

  1. liberpolly

    liberpolly Nu, shoyn, nudnick!

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    Or at least a sort car that Ford/Chevy are able to build, while kinds of Tesla are blowing past them. Kinda perfect analogy for HD troubles.
  2. liberpolly

    liberpolly Nu, shoyn, nudnick!

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    Like Benelli...
  3. BetterLateThanNever

    BetterLateThanNever It turns out you can't delete your account...

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    That's true as of the last couple of quarters. Before that, I think shareholders were more content than certain other investors were. HOG was yielding over 4% up until this spring thanks to reasonable dividends. If you were a mature buy-and-hold investor, you would probably have dismissed most of the chattering. In Q2, Harley cut its dividend from 38 cents a share to 2. There was a lot of COVID spin around this, but it was hard not to notice the timing vs. the proxy war. For serious investors, that's when the alarm bells would have gone off. Share prices alone, within reason, don't always mean very much.
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  4. windmill

    windmill Long timer

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    I seriously doubt it will be that extreme of a change.
  5. ZappBranigan

    ZappBranigan Still Riding

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    As they should. Cars serve no purpose compared to other types of vehicles. When I see a car with a trunk I just think about the wasted space above the trunk and behind the cabin.

    I've owned exactly one "car" with a trunk in my life. It was OK but I have no desire to ever own another. Why would I? A Wagon/SUV/Truck is more practical and has more usable space.

    Modern "crossovers" are nothing but station wagons by a different name, and I'm fine with that. Wagons are awesome.

    Some car people scratch their heads at the popularity of SUVs vs sedans but the reason SUVs/crossovers have taken over as the dominant form of vehicle is that they give the best overall utility.

    Try loading bags of mulch or large houseplants into the back of a trunk. PITA. But easy to do in a wagon/CUV/SUV.
  6. phughes

    phughes Long timer

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    I was on the road as an entertainer for many years. MY 1995 Jetta was a great vehicle for me. I purchased it over and SUV because it's trunk was designed well, had 15 cubic feet of space, and was shaped in such a way that all the space was easily used. The trunk had a low opening, making loading easy. I was able to fit my sound system, mic stands, speaker stands, two tray jacks, a trunk, and another large bag on top of everything. It got fantastic fuel mileage, and was great to drive.

    When I did look for a replacement vehicle, many SUVs would not fit the same equipment behind the seat, since stacking the equipment wasn;t an options due to the back glass, and the potential for the load to fly forward under braking. Of course most SUVs could fit the equipment, but their fuel mileage and comfort wasn't as good, nor was loading as easy due to the height.

    A lot of cars couldn't carry the same amount in the trunk as the Jetta. I would take the equipment and load it into whatever car I was looking at. I looked at a few Buicks. I told the salesman one day that if the car would hold the same in the trunk as the Jetta, I would buy it. I tried a Century and a Lesabre, neither could fit what the Jetta did. The salesman said he wouldn't have believed it had he not seen it.

    So yeah, most cars cannot haul as much as a SUV, but at the same time, there are a lot of SUVs that really cannot haul much at all, and not as much as a well designed trunk, like my old Jetta had. The trunk had the advantage that all my equipment was out of sight. In an SUV, it can be seen and is a nice target when parked overnight, or in a bad area.

    I really miss that car.
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  7. windmill

    windmill Long timer

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    I remember watching some musicians unloading their instruments from the trunk of an AMC Matador. I was simply astonished how big the trunk was, almost the size of a pickup bed, and remember it distinctly even after 20 or more years.
    [​IMG]
  8. borderlinebob

    borderlinebob Been here awhile

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    Zoomer, look what you started with your car mention:pynd

    Now back to our regular scheduled program—H.D.
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  9. phughes

    phughes Long timer

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    I also was unable to put all the equipment in the trunk of an Electra Glide...













    :hide
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  10. Sal Pairadice

    Sal Pairadice Captain Obvious

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    This is what I've been saying -

  11. phughes

    phughes Long timer

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    Okay. I love the Ultra, but this guy is ridiculous. "Too much wind, I don't want to ride. That's okay, you have this fairing..." Yeah, the fork mounted fairing that is known to not be especially good in high winds. Oh, that and the fact there are tons of other bikes with fairings, some that are not even affected by wind as much as the Ultra fairing.

    I love the bike, and I am not knocking the bike, I am knocking the tool in the video.
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  12. Sal Pairadice

    Sal Pairadice Captain Obvious

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    In all fairness, he is just a dealer selling that particular used bike.Thats all his channel is, a sales pitch. He doesn't really sell his opinion as a journalist, like Ryan from F9.

    However, I rented one of these bikes and they are so much improved over the previous models and yet it seems like they get no credit for that Milwauke 8. I ride ( among other bikes) a V-Strom 1000 that in my opinion is pretty quick. This Ultra is not that far behind it in terms of straight line speed. That I can even say that shows what a big step up this new motor is. If I bought a newer HD - it would be the Electra Glide with the Milwauke 8.
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  13. superfly3176

    superfly3176 Adventurer

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    Couldn't even watch the video. I've ridden cruisers for a long time, the ultra is not that good. I have a big problem with heat though and am very suspect to heat strokes. So no wind is a bad thing

    Before I got into adventure bikes I had an Indian Chieftain. Imagine a street glide where the windshield can move up and down. Same for Roadmaster vs. ultra.

    Also felt Indians suspension and cornering was better.
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  14. old scoot

    old scoot Been here awhile

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    I can't believe it, you guys are at 152 pages of this negative crap. Damn man, how many different ways can you say that you don't like Harley ? This has reached the point where it's really funny as hell.
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  15. JETalmage

    JETalmage Been here awhile

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    The 152 pages of this thread have been all over that.

    My two inserts in your quote are, in a nutshell, one side of Harley's survival dilemma coin.

    Increasingly fewer people fall subject to the 'motorcycle means Harley' nonsense and those people are increasingly seen as completely naive about motorcycles, even among non-motorcyclists.

    Yeah, I roll my eyes. I'm not interested in anything Harley builds. But I'm 66. That ship sailed over five decades ago. The rolling of my eyes is not what Harley is hurting from.

    My sons, however, are both in their 30s and are not even motorcyclists. Even so, their generation is also rolling its collective eyes at the whole Harley shtick; an 'unwashed outlaw tough-guy gang' aesthetic from the 60s that is as outdated and laughable as bouffant hair-dos, bell-bottom pants, or glittery sequin 'cowboy' jackets.

    The other side of that coin? The fact that that's all Harley does because it seems to be all Harley knows, so it's all Harley is known for.

    Without the outdated and shrinking-in-popularity shtick that Harley has been all about perpetuating, Harley has nothing to offer. It's been painting itself into that corner for so long that its doing anything else--even if it can--looks like nothing but disingenuous desperation.

    No other motorcycle brand has that kind of self-inflicted stigma to overcome. Sure, some investment entity can acquire the company for whatever it's actually worth, but the brand is overwhelmingly considered synonymous with the outdated shtick. Whatever anyone tries to do with the company's assets, the brand is still the marketing liability. Even if the company could manage to become known for something better, the brand itself steepens the uphill climb.

    Whatever happens to the company, as a motorcyclist, I say good-riddance to the brand and the motorcycling sub-culture it has become synonymous with.

    JET
  16. Traxx

    Traxx Long timer Supporter

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    That sounds great, and I am really glad that the younger people are getting to you.
    So, how many are going on to purchase a Harley, or a used bike or what ever.
    My youngest Son and I went together to take the MSF course and he still has not purchased a bike. I am on my 5th. He loves to ride but thinks his money is better spent elsewhere. I have more disposable income and am more established than most 20 or 30 somethings so I will go with a more premium bike. I believe that is one of the bigger reasons that the avg age of Harley and other premium bikes is in the 40 something range.
    Something else to think about is that there is a whole crop of new 40 somethings every year.
  17. phughes

    phughes Long timer

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    Yeah, I actually love the bike, but the video was stupid.
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  18. TxRoadDog

    TxRoadDog Shut up and ride

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    As far as who purchases a harley, new or used, I don't really care. As long as they ride. A lot of students I get do in fact have other motorcycles, or are considering other bikes.
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  19. Traxx

    Traxx Long timer Supporter

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  20. TxRoadDog

    TxRoadDog Shut up and ride

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    Very interesting data, especially the numbers on bikes being used for commuting and their age. Unfortunately, I just don't know how they'll ever figure out how to make motorcycling popular in this country again. In the US, motorcycling is still associated not with Steve McQueen, but of the fat liquored up outlaw biker, and that turns a lot of people off. Every time I go into the dealership it's still full of LARPers. I'm young, late 20's. Been there and done that, all of it, even the most hardcore aspect of the H-D world. I don't care for it anymore and most my age don't.
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