Looking for Engine Temp Feedback

Discussion in 'Ridiculous streetbikes with 6 CPUs and too much HP' started by GCecchetto, Sep 12, 2016.

  1. TakSD

    TakSD Been here awhile

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    I did 3 things that made the bike run cooler. Obviously it shouldn’t be necessary but in any case...

    1. Added motul mocool additive to radiator (if I recall correctly it’s a 20:1 ratio)
    2. Changed the rear cylinder exhaust header to the SAT one that has the heat shield
    3. Installed the fueling dongles from Rottweiler, reason being that I think these bikes are too lean from the factory to meet the new stricter emissions.

    Maybe yours is a “leaner” bike from the factory...
    #81
  2. brianbrannon

    brianbrannon They'll ride up with wear

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    Running lean is bad for emissions. Factory engines are not tuned to run lean because it raises NOX
    #82
  3. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    No, I didnt. We'll have the chance to bleed and re-bleed again when installing the old radiator, a vacuum coolant filler looks like a good idea (I had to google it, haha) but I think we have the bleeding procedure covered, specially since we followed guglemonsters advice of doing it twice at least, after letting the fans kick in
    But yes, I agree the bleeding is tricky

    I thought about the fueling dongles a long time ago. While they may help, they wont solve the problem but mask it.
    I am familiar with TuneECU on the 990 but never took a look at the KTM computer, I would like to take a look to see if it controls stuff like fueling and timing. Any chance a technician screw up something during an update?
    #83
  4. TakSD

    TakSD Been here awhile

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    I can’t fathom how somebody would screw it up. It seems very fool proof from what I’ve seen.

    My thinking lies with the fact that bike from bike will vary, some in performance, some in longevity and some in terms of heat (rich or lean). If our engine was developed for euro 3 emissions and the only way to pass euro 4 would be to have all the bikes at the lean end of the spectrum, then maybe your bike (and mine) were pushed over the limit and the engine is producing too much heat. If you have a dyno close by I would just tell him to try the dipstick in the exhaust to see your air fuel ratio at idle, 2k revs, 3k, 4K and so on. Again, don’t actually put the bike on the dyno, just in neutral see the AFR.
    It could indicate where the problem lies...

    The only other thing I can think of is a part that should flow water to be obstructed by something, maybe in the engine cylinders or piping.
    #84
  5. Lettikka

    Lettikka Been here awhile

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    Had the same problem with similar symtoms. Checked everything and all indications were system was functioning properly. Finally figured out that it was the radiator cap not making a good seal. Spent WAYYYYYY too much time and money on a $15 fix. Now a put a new radiator cap on each winter.
    #85
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  6. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Glad you fixed it! It's very frustrating and time consuming ... at least I have time now, my mechanic let me use his workshop and he's always there to give a hand when I get stuck.
    Did your overheated like mine? was dropping coolant?
    A new rad and cap didnt change anything, fans working all the time
    #86
  7. Lettikka

    Lettikka Been here awhile

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    Mine would climb up to 5-6 bars in stop and go traffic or going slow in the dirt, while moving it was fine. I bled, changed coolant, put a new water pump in, checked fan function. I was in the middle of the water pump change when my mechanic showed up with a contraption that attached to the radiator cap hole, then put my radiator cap on top of the unit. It was essentially an air pump that connected to the radiator at the cap. He pumped it a couple of times and we could see and hear air escaping from the radiator cap seal at the cap and at the radiator. I put some light sand paper on the seal, then polished it smooth where the cap seal touches it, new cap and no more heating issues.
    #87
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  8. SRTie4k

    SRTie4k Northeast Explorer

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    My bike had the same issue when it was extremely humid hot day out. I got stuck in a traffic jam on the interstate one day when it was 95* ambient temp and extremely humid. The fan kicked on sitting in traffic and never kicked off again, and temp just simply rose and rose until I was 1 bar away from the top, so I shut it down and let it cool off. Once we got sick of waiting in the traffic, we decided to ride down the shoulder to bypass, so I turned it back on and within a minute of riding at ~35mph, the bike started cooling back down.

    It seems to me like the rad fans simply just don't make enough static pressure to force enough air through the radiator for effective cooling.
    #88
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  9. Lettikka

    Lettikka Been here awhile

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    I am in North Carolina and it was about 90deg out when I noticed the issue. Each thing that I did to address the cooling didn't seem to have any affect until I found that the seal on the cap was not perfect. I didn't ever note any coolant coming out. My best advise is to just check the cap seal off of the list. Inspect and use chrome polish to make sure the lip of the cap seal on the radiator is smooth and I think you said you had a new cap. Maybe a light layer of grease around the rubber cap seal to help it seal? After that I would inspect the water pump. It was some years ago but there was a problem with the engine block castings in the LC8 that left sand in the water passages that wore the water pumps out quickly. Maybe this has happened to you, or something similar? Its not too bad of a project to pull the side cover and inspect the impeller.
    #89
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  10. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Two bad caps, and two radiator cap holes not smooth is unlikely, but I'll install a new (third) cap anyway since I already ordered it. BTW, that's the only part I've bought until now, trying to keep this cheap :lol3
    Water pump was checked, looks nice and clean
    untitled.jpg

    untitled2.jpg
    #90
  11. Lettikka

    Lettikka Been here awhile

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    No that is not likely. To be clear, I am talking about making sure the part of the radiator that accepts the cap is smooth and polished. Someone suggested that there could be a blockage in a water passage. If this were an old chevy we would pull the bottom radiator hose, put a garden hose in the radiator cap and run the engine to flush it. Wonder is something similar can be done with this system. If so you could try that, then also back flush the system using a hose to loosen any foreign object that could be lodged in the passage. Seal the hose up to the outlet hose and push water up through the radiator cap Just spit balling free ideas for you.
    #91
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  12. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Got it

    Actually I think the backflush is a good idea

    And I really appreciate it :thumb
    #92
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  13. brianbrannon

    brianbrannon They'll ride up with wear

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    The water pump impeller isn't slipping on the shaft?
    #93
  14. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Nop, impeller turns nicely when cracking the engine, I checked that. Also, the shaft has a cut that makes impossible any slippage as long as the impeller hole is in good shape.

    The new thermostats, installed one/two months ago, came out with some black stuff on them. Found more of this on the radiator inlet and outlet pipes. ???
    Two months ago we flushed the system with radiator cleaner (when I went from Motorex M5 to M3, something Motorex doesnt recommend so we tried to clean the system as good as we could), it supposed to remove the silicate layer out of the engine walls, not sure is related with this black stuff

    IMAG1702.jpg

    Re: coolant. Not sure it makes a huge difference but I have the choice of motorex M 3.0 (re-using it, two months old), Motorex M5.0 or Voltronic R30 (almost every 1190 here runs that stuff, no cooling problems reported, I've talked to users)
    Motorex doesnt recommend using M 3.0 if the engine had M 5.0 on it, something related with a silicate layer the M5 leaves on engine walls, but since we used the cooling system cleaner and then flushed before going from M5 to M3 we "guess" it should be OK using any of them?

    We'll run a compression test today.

    Edit: I had the overheating problems before changing cooling fluid type, and before system flush with cleaner.
    #94
  15. guglemonster

    guglemonster Crivens!!!

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    Jaime, how about leaving the motoprex stuff aside and go with Ice?

    I am extremely pleased with the Elf Glacelf full organic and many friends of mine found out that the Ice was also perfect for their overheating 990

    flushing will never be enough to remove silicon, was the washing designed to be effective with silicon based coolant?
    #95
  16. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Not sure...
    We used this stuff to clean:
    http://www.voltronic-germany.com/en/products/additives/item/r10-radiator-flush-en.html

    Ice, Elf, not sure they can be found locally.

    U know what? I'm going with this:
    http://www.voltronic-germany.com/en/products/technical-fluid/coolant/item/r30-coolant-an-en.html

    Lots of friends on 990s and 1190s using it, not a single problem (when I asked, one of them told me he never heard his fans kicking in, haha)
    #96
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  17. guglemonster

    guglemonster Crivens!!!

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    yeha sure living at thw pole I suppose ;)

    https://www.engineice.com

    you do know that Claudio has one shipping heading his way, shall I get it for you? you cannot top it with water though
    #97
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  18. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Thanks a lot Guglielmo :thumb really appreciate but if can't be topped with water it could be a problem if I need another bleedings in the future
    #98
  19. guglemonster

    guglemonster Crivens!!!

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    sorry mate, wrong perspective ;)

    if it works you will flush it again in two years, if you need flushing is the wrong product or the problem unsolved ;)

    in such cases you get more liquid and take with you for some trips a small flask, but I totally understand your point ;)

    let me know in any case abd let's cool the bitch down !!!!

    :D:D:clap:D:D
    #99
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  20. Jaimoto

    Jaimoto Spaniard in Chile

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    Got it, but will take weeks in terms of shipping. Better try what I find locally, also it has been proved that works. If it doesn't work, after trying three different coolant type then then we'll know for sure the brand/type is not the problem
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