The Future ... ?

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by Scooterwolf, Jun 22, 2018.

  1. Strayarider

    Strayarider 空気泥棒

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    Very popular in Japan and the charging time is very little. You just pop the battery out and carry to the nearest place with a power point and plug in for half an hour or so while you have some tea and ramen.

    I've seen the odd zero whooshing around here in Oz. A rider near me uses one daily and transport around the city. Seems reliable and he's had it a few years now.

    We will need a serious drop in purchase/replacement costs for batteries to really take off I think.

    In cage terms, it amazes me that people will spend an absolute fortune on a Prius which has massive battery replacement costs and upfront purchase price but is not much more economical (actually in real terms, much less economical judging by the taxis I've been in) than a small 4-cylinder petrol from Japan.
    #21
  2. Dabears

    Dabears Long Timer

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    Kudos to Kymco for looking for solutions to the obstacles of two wheeled electric transportation. While it may not make sense for many of you, there are people with commuting/transportation needs in many countries that can really benefit from the ease of use for charging, especially in high density cities.

    Around me, a Nissan Leaf would be a much more suitable eVehicle, since the range is around 150 miles, and cars can be recharged over night (not to mention the weather protection). My former work place had chargers in the parking garage, and even 4 years ago electric cars were popular.

    I get that most folks here like scooters for fun, myself included, but just because you or I may not want one doesn’t delegitimize electric scooters as a viable option for vast numbers of people globally. In fact I see the day where cities only allow electric vehicle due to pollution concerns.
    #22
    Jim T likes this.
  3. Scooterwolf

    Scooterwolf Been here awhile

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    China is already moving in that direction.

    - Wolf
    #23
  4. motu

    motu Loose Pre Unit

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    The riders posting here want an electric scooter that they can do 400 mile rides on every few weeks over summer. The rest of the world wants a small scooter to do commuting and around town runs on everday, all year. What is most needed in the world, and who will get what they want ?
    #24
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  5. cdwise

    cdwise Long timer

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    City commuting an ebike or escooter would work well if price is reasonable. Colorado is using its share of the VW settlement to install more power points around the state. There are a few in Breckenridge and Frisco as well as several of the Tesla ones over in Silverthorne by the Outlet stores just off I-70.
    #25
  6. AG200man

    AG200man AG200 Nutjob

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    I get a laugh when the "character" of the internal combustion engine is mentioned in the same sentence or paragraph as Scooter.
    #26
  7. conchscooter

    conchscooter Long timer

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    Price is the obstacle. I can’t pay $16,000 for a Zero with adequate range for my commute. Because that’s all it’s good for. My scooter cost $3000 and gets 75mpg. My scooter is also long distance capable. Electric bikes could be fine commuters but they just cost too much.
    #27
  8. Jim T

    Jim T Been here awhile

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    I agree, but I'm sure the price will start dropping as the technology develops. I'd be willing to bet that the same thing was being said about the ICE automobiles at the start of the 20th century.
    #28
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  9. chazbird

    chazbird Long timer

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    Tell me about the IBM PC price circa 1982.
    It won't be long until electric scooters will have decent range (4-5 day commutes) and a decent price (I hope)
    #29
  10. fullmetalscooter

    fullmetalscooter Let me take this duck off

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    I forgotten what brand is Taiwan is making a electrical scooter that s 2 grand and does 50 mph with a range of 80 miles between charges. The battery is portable so you just lift it out and recharge it as needed. Buy 2 battery and you extend the range . I really wish I remember the brand . https://newatlas.com/ is where I found it posted about in the last 45 days.
    #30
  11. motu

    motu Loose Pre Unit

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    #31
  12. CaptnJim

    CaptnJim Scooter Pilot

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    #32
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  13. JerryH

    JerryH internal combustion rider

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    I'm assuming you've never ridden a Genuine Stella or vintage 2 stroke manual shift Vespa. They just ooze character, especially with an aftermarket exhaust.
    #33
  14. conchscooter

    conchscooter Long timer

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    From what I read the trick is to figure out batteries. I understand scientists are working on accumulator that will absorb charge across the entire surface and thus speed up re-charging comparable to filling a tank with gas.
    The other issue I see with batteries is lack of standard sizes. Imagine if we could only fill our tanks at gas stations with nozzle sizes compatible with our fillers....so even the idea of exchange stations for batteries is complicated by the lack of standardization.
    It will all be overcome, including price but until then internal combustion rules.
    Mass production lowered car prices and that killed motorcycles for a while...until world war killed gas availability...round and round we go!
    #34
  15. AG200man

    AG200man AG200 Nutjob

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    Whatever floats your boat dude...
    :lol3
    #35
  16. Broody

    Broody Adventurer

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    I love electric engines. You can accelerate like a maniac and nobody will notice. Speed = fun, noise = attention seeker

    But the issue with urban areas is that people park on the streets, so unless the public charging network really expands in the next decade, electric vehicles will have a limited penetration rate. For electric bicycles it's fine since the battery is light enough to carry it around, but for scooters or motorcycles with more range, carrying ~20-30kg every other day isn't really an option. In addition, a removable pack means more pieces that can break, limited design options and a higher cost than a built in pack.

    EVs are perfect for suburban home with a driveway though.
    #36
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  17. JerryH

    JerryH internal combustion rider

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    Actually my Sportster is the most fun bike I've ever owned. I am a former drag racer (cars) for more than 40 years. I got my speed fix on the track. Speeding on the street would get me a pile of tickets in a hurry. The Harley is a very visceral machine, it vibrates and it makes noise. That big long stroke engine down there leaves no doubt about it being powered by internal combustion. It is a primitive machine and satisfies my need for that. It hammers you hard when you whack the throttle open. That is what I relate to. I am not technically inclined. I like mechanical, and I like it simple. Big heavy mechanical parts. Harleys are not fast, but they sound and feel like they have a lot more power than they actually do. I can enjoy that, while staying within the speed limit. I wish someone would build a scooter with a long stroke "thumper" engine that you could hear and feel. The old Heinkel comes close to that. It has a long stroke engine and a "chugging" sound. You can hear and feel the power pulses. It sort of chugs down the road. Being able to feel that piston going up and down in the cylinder adds a lot to the experience.

    On the opposite end, you have the 2 stroke vintage Vespas. They vibrate, but it is a high frequency buzz. They sound a lot like a chain saw. Being a 2 stroke, they have exhaust smoke, which lets you know real fossil fuel is being burned. They are a blast to run up through the gears at full throttle. You actually use a manual clutch and shifter, and they require a lot more interaction with the machine than a CVT scooter.

    Either way, most of the fun from riding bikes comes in large part from the internal combustion engine. I also like steam powered locomotives. They have big moving mechanical parts, and they also make a really cool sound, unlike modern electric locomotives that use dull boring diesel engines to power the generators.
    #37
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  18. Broody

    Broody Adventurer

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    They will eventually make unbalanced electric engines for you, to feel like a dual shock PlayStation vibrating playpad, that way you'll feel the torque and vibration.

    Otherwise, I'm more a 4 cylinders guy, especially my fzr250 with a 17000 rpm redline.
    #38
  19. Wentwest

    Wentwest How's that work?

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    So I agree with all of these:

    We are hobbyists, we enjoy the experience of riding and do it for fun as well as transportation. The world market for scooters is mostly people who need a cheap way to get from here to there, when there isn't very far away. A 50 mile round trip is probably very unusual for a typical scooter. And most people live in crowded urbanized places. There's no doubt in my mind that their interest is in reliability, easy ways of carrying people and things, and price. Right now gas scooters still win. The power sources are proven and straight forward and lots of people everywhere know how to keep them running. Gasoline is a very good source of energy to run scooters - it takes up a small space for a lot of energy. Unfortunately it's a poison, it is explosive and using it creates environmental problems that keep getting worse.
    #39
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  20. GerrNP

    GerrNP Mr. President we must not allow a mine shaft gap

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    Like that description of the Harley's and similar engines. Not sure how the electric stuff is going to all pan out, have a hard enough time figuring out the present much less the future, but I like my stuff as quiet and smooth as possible. Can understand the other side of the coin too.
    #40